Pinnacle Pilots: "Just wanted to have fun"

[Spinn555]

.....

Do you get what you pay for when you hire a pilot?



If the starting salary is under 20K a year and opportunities are limited beyond that; does the quality of people flying up front begin to decline?



Perhaps to the point where you have two howler monkeys sitting up front saying ‘dude, grab a Pepsi and watch this!’ shortly before the airplane careens into the ground.



I think so; and the idea of spending all day in a small box with ‘dudes’ like that was a small factor in my decision to stay out of the airlines

 

[johnny taliban]

my guess is in their minds 410 was the max certified altitude and they thought simply they were empty and could go up there (ie thought only weight was the factor). unfortunately they were wrong. hopefully it will cause a lot of changes in peoples minds about the capabilities of their a/c.

If these guys only took aircraft weight into consideration when deciding to climb to FL410, then neither one of them had any business sitting in that cockpit. Their ignorance of high altitude aerodynamics and of the aircraft's limitations is truly remarkable.

Im really surprised that no one has brought up the OBVIOUS issue of Pinnacle's (or for that matter any regional) hiring minimuns. Let's think about this for a second. Company hires a 500 hour piston pilot to fly an AIRLINER!!! Yeah, that makes alot of sense. It doesnt take a rocket scientist to realize that with low standards like that an accident is inevitable. How much more ability, knowledge, and experience is required to fly a Boeing 737 than a CRJ? My guess is that its about the same, yet Southwest (or just about anybody else) has much higher minumums then these regionals. You pay a guy food stamps to command an aircraft but expect top notch performance. Somethings wrong with that picture. Quite frankly, Im surprised that an accident like this did not happen sooner. These pilots screwed up but there is a whole lot of blame to go around. The company they worked for as well as the FAA are at fault as well, IMHO. Of course, I could be wrong .

Johnny

 

[Top Gum]

Im really surprised that no one has brought up the OBVIOUS issue of Pinnacle's (or for that matter any regional) hiring minimuns. Let's think about this for a second. Company hires a 500 hour piston pilot to fly an AIRLINER!!! Yeah, that makes alot of sense. It doesnt take a rocket scientist to realize that with low standards like that an accident is inevitable. How much more ability, knowledge, and experience is required to fly a Boeing 737 than a CRJ? My guess is that its about the same, yet Southwest (or just about anybody else) has much higher minumums then these regionals. You pay a guy food stamps to command an aircraft but expect top notch performance.

I understand your concerns about low minimums, low pay, and quality people but I don’t know of anyone getting hired at Pinnacle with only 500 hours unless they are being promoted from within the company.

The current minimums at Pinnacle are 1000 total and 200 multi.
· Average age in my class 32.
· Average hours 3,000

I know that the pay is terrible but I can assure you that the low pay has not stopped the new hires from trying to be professionals at operating the CRJ.

 

[NoBathroom]

I understand your concerns about low minimums, low pay, and quality people but I don’t know of anyone getting hired at Pinnacle with only 500 hours unless they are being promoted from within the company.

You obviously don't know your company well, then. There were many pilots hired with only 500 hours (250 of them in the BE-1900) in the past few years.

 

[Ty Webb]

The unrelenting level of immaturity revealed here is nothing short of shocking.


Training is never perfect. And yes, this airline's training prior to the accident regarding high altitude flight obviously sucked....they depended on their pilots sticking to flight plans, thereby operating well-within the aerodynamic womb...not on the fringe, and they didn't sufficiently stress the dangers of going outside it. But it remains that if the crew had stuck to, or even marginally adhered to the plan, it wouldn't have happened. And like someone else has mentioned, for lack company training neither pilot reflected a self-education of knowledge (that even if the company didn't provide it) is very basic to flying jet aircraft at high-altitudes and is readily available from many sources. Educating yourself to a higher degree than what any company can spoon-feed you is part of what proffessionals do, and i make no apologies for saying that if you're getting paid to captain a jet you better know this basic %@#@.

Everyone can make mistakes, and everyone does. Everyone has lapses in judgement, but usually singular and temporary. This whole event, on the other hand, is a friggin' showcase of immaturity from the get-go. This is the kind of thing only peer pressure can solve. .

Well, I often disagree with CatYaak, but I agree with him on every point in his post (which I edited above for brevity).

An excellent book, "Redefining Airmanship" lists some of the basic tenents of Airmanship . . . training, discipline, knowlege being three of them, all of which are missing in this unfortunate display.