Pinnacle Airlines buy out by CoEx

[burg]

Our MEC has sent out this mass e- mail to the pilot group that states,



"October 4, 2003

Special Message from Wake Gordon, PCL MEC Chairman

Early today I spoke with my counterpart at Continental Express. In that
conversation I was informed that Continental Express has made an offer to purchase Pinnacle. This information was given to the Continental Express pilots by its management. At this time the COEX union representatives do not know the nature or terms of the offer.

All members of the MEC who were available this morning have been fully briefed. I have also spoken today with our management. At this time, they are unaware of any offer to purchase the company. Given the ownership structure of Pinnacle stock, this fact would not be unusual.

It is reasonable to assume that this information is correct.

I wish to emphasize that this is very preliminary information. Wild speculation as to the potential impact upon our pilot group is just that; speculation. Further, I want to assure you that next week your MEC will working our contacts within the industry to pin down the terms of this offer, if indeed an offer has been made, and gauge its impact upon our company. I wish to further emphasize that you should not believe any of the rumors that an announcement of this type will generate. If you have not heard it from your union representatives, it is probably not true.


Sincerely,


Wake Gordon
PCL ALPA MEC Chairman"


End Quote. Any CoER guys heard anything remotly close to this. Or is My 55 year old MEC chair finaly lost his marbles.

I lean toward the latter>>>>>>>>>>>


Thanks
burg
.

 

[cl-65link]

Apparently Coex offered stock and NW wants $$$.

 

[Saluki Dawg]

We know just about as much as you guys have been told right now which is that Expressjet has made some kind of an offer to acquire Pinnacle. However, the company hasn't released any information to the pilot group yet. Stay tuned, things should get really interesting.

 

[stillaboo]

Mergers, Mergers, Mergers!

CoEx wants Pinnacle, Mesa wants ACA - man, is this industry in consolidation or what?

Who would be bigger, Mesa/ACA or CoEx/Pinnacle? When's Eagle gonna' be sold (rumors)?

The game is afoot.

 

[Tim47SIP]

Why pinnalce?

What would CO Ex want with Pinnacle? How would CO EX benefit from purchasing them? Who does Pinnalce fly feed for? I thought that they were a WO but I am probably mistaken. I hope it happens if it is a good thing for the Pinnalce employees. Anyone in the know? Thanks.

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

Pinnacle is 1/2 (or so) of NW Airlink (the other 1/2 is Mesaba). They fly CRJs out of DTW, MSP and MEM.

THey ARE 100% owned by NWA. Last year, NWA tried to spin them off into an IPO (like CoEx-now called ?), but failed. People didn't want to buy them at that time (I would never buy stock in a regional that was 100% controlled by a larger airline-it doesn't make any sense to me as an investment-how can you control your stock price/profits when your company has no control over itself?).

Based on the fact that NWA wanted to sell them, it makes sense to me that they would consider selling them now.

Cliff
DTW

 

[captjim]

Re: Mergers, Mergers, Mergers!

CoEx wants Pinnacle, Mesa wants ACA - man, is this industry in consolidation or what?

Who would be bigger, Mesa/ACA or CoEx/Pinnacle? When's Eagle gonna' be sold (rumors)?

The game is afoot.

Mesa has 149 airframes
ACA 146
Total 295

XJT has 218, 56 on order
Pinnicle has 70, 59 on order.
Total 288

 

[mckpickle]

Don't forget that MESA has to buy their aircraft from some guy down on 42nd ST. They have a hard enough time finding financing so Lets hope that JO gets indited for insider trading before they get all the financing. Listen to the VM 877-MESA-CEO

Very entertaining.

 

[Habib]

What about Messaba

If this was to happen, how Fuc%ed would Messaba be.
Kinda funny that this could happen the same time NWA is talking about making Messaba get rid of their Jets.

 

[Cardinal]

Hundreds furloughed, now lets go buy someone...does this make sense to anyone else?

 

[VFR on Top]

I think consolidation among the regionals is a very good thing for the profession; fewer pilot groups to whipsaw, and it gives some teeth to legal labor actions--the whole "strength in numbers" thing.

 

[Publishers]

Why buy

Two different animals..

While this may not be a good time for pilot employment, it may be a great time to purchase something at a depressed price.

 

[flywithastick]

Hundreds furloughed, now lets go buy someone...does this make sense to anyone else?

Businesses are about making money, not employing people. These two do not necessarily relate directly or inversely.

 

[Marko Ramius]

Not so fast grasshopper

I think consolidation among the regionals is a very good thing for the profession; fewer pilot groups to whipsaw, and it gives some teeth to legal labor actions--the whole "strength in numbers" thing.

I bet you'll find a couple thousand American Eagle pilots who strongly disagree with you.

 

[VFR on Top]

Yeah? Same dudes who agreed to a 16 year contract?

No sympathy for self-inflicted wounds.

 

[WrightAvia]

What about Messaba
If this was to happen, how Fuc%ed would Messaba be.
Kinda funny that this could happen the same time NWA is talking about making Messaba get rid of their Jets.

NWA is not talking about making XJ get RID of THEIR jets. NWA is looking at ending it's contract with XJ, for the OPERATION of NWA's RJ85s. NWA OWNS those jets...not XJ.

Could you imagine for a minute, that you are a furloughed mainline pilot at NWA and the company YOU work for has contractors flying planes as big as a small DC-9 or 737, that YOUR OWN company owns? You'd wan't your union to pressure management into getting YOU the jobs your company is farming out...especially if your company owns the planes that others are getting paid to fly.

 

[U of I Tweak]

Mesaba planes

Northwest owns all of Mesaba's planes, not just the Avros. Mesaba leases them from Northwest. NW pilots shouldn't be bent out that Mesaba is flying planes they pay for.

 

[Marko Ramius]

Wait a minute, you left the point behind

Yeah? Same dudes who agreed to a 16 year contract?

No sympathy for self-inflicted wounds.

Nowhere did I say that you should give the pilots at Eagle sympathy or anything else. Since you mentioned their 16 year contract, do you even know some of the things they hoped to accomplish with it? Perhaps you should look at their history, and rethink your comments about mega-regionals somehow being able to enjoy increased leverage and less whipsawing.

 

[TCAS]

Yeah? Same dudes who agreed to a 16 year contract?

No sympathy for self-inflicted wounds.

You have no clue about what you're talking about. If it's a sixteen year contract how come the American Eagle pilots enter contract negotiations with the company every 4 years?

When you have a clue come on back and we can have an intelligent discussion about it.

 

[WrightAvia]

Mesaba planes
Northwest owns all of Mesaba's planes, not just the Avros. Mesaba leases them from Northwest. NW pilots shouldn't be bent out that Mesaba is flying planes they pay for.

What kind of PEYOTE BUTTONS have you been chewing on?

 

[labbats]

As an aspiring Regional pilot, I'd like to see some positive reasons for going that route. Please try and keep it civil boys.

 

[JohnDoe]

Quote from TCAS:

"You have no clue about what you're talking about. If it's a sixteen year contract how come the American Eagle pilots enter contract negotiations with the company every 4 years?

When you have a clue come on back and we can have an intelligent discussion about it."




The entire term of the contract IS 16 years......While it is true that every 4 years both parties can come to the table with things they want changed, there are some items that can't be touched....and I believe one of the very important items that can't be touched is PAY RATES.

 

[TCAS]

I believe one of the very important items that can't be touched is PAY RATES.

Pay rates are not negotiated since they are changed yearly by a weighted indexing of pay rate increases in other regional airline contracts.

Wage rates are calculated by November 1 of each year and become effective on January 1 of the following year.

If the resultant weighted average percent of change is greater than, or equal to one and one-half percent, they then apply the resultant weighted average increased percentage change to the Eagle pilot hourly pay scale.

If the resultant weighted average percent of change is less than one and one-half percent, the Eagle pilot pay scales for that adjustment period will be increased by one and one-half percent and any difference between the IAI and one and one-half percent will be applied against future increases.

 

[NuGuy]

Hi all,

WrightAvia is partially correct. NWA actually owns or leases ALL the aircraft that the airlinks (Mesaba and Pinnacle) operate. The Avros, Saabs and RJs are all leased by NWA, then subleased to the Airlinks.

Actually, pretty brilliant. Gets them comming and going. Nail them for the lease of the aircraft, then take a big slice of the revenue going the other way.

The deal with the AVROs is this. NWA originally got those airplanes via a sweetheart deal from BAe. BAe guaranteed NWA an operating profit with 69 seats (to fit the NWA scope) with those aircraft at a time when RJs were hard to get. It was a win/win for both sides. NWA got larger RJs, and BAe was able to place a 4 engine RJ in the US market.

Needless to say, the Avro has a hard time competing with other RJs...4 engines vs 2, and an 85 seat airframe flying with 69 seats. Not to say it isn't a nice plane, but it requires BAe to make up alot of $$$ to make it's performance guarantee.

The guarantee is reaching it's terminating date, and lets face it, BAe is financially strapped, and not interested in renewing it, and NWA isn't interested in losing more money at this point, so bye bye Avros.

I hate to say it, but Mesaba is finding itself in a power play. Cheap competition from Pinnacle, NWA senior management leaving the Mesaba board, no new RJs on the horizon, a contract that is ammendable and now this. Doesn't bode for good things in the short term.

To clear the air: There are no negotiations between the pilots and NWA management to change scope in either direction. You won't see NWA pilots flying the Avros with 85 seats, nor will you see a new order for 70 seaters anytime soon. The NWA guys are looking at doing anything over 55 seaters (the current book scope) themselves, and from what I'm told, that's a line in the sand.

JMHO,
Nu

 

[ksu_aviator]

Boy am I glad I left Mesaba for charter work.

 

[T-Gates]

Cheap competition from Pinnacle....

For christs sake.....why do people keep spewing this crap.....our contract sucks, but so does Mesaba's. We have not been approached for or accepted ANY concessions to get what we have. Our contract was signed pre-Comair and pre-9/11.

If we were in negotiations and Mesaba was still under thier current contract, they'd be getting all the RJ's.....

Please do not make it look like we cheapened ourselves to get the flying from NWA. They bought us 100% in 1997....that gives them the right to do whatever the hell they want with us.

Just my .02,

--TGates

 

[belchfire]

As an aspiring Regional pilot, I'd like to see some positive reasons for going that route. Please try and keep it civil boys.

If I hear of any, I'll let you know!!!

 

[NuGuy]

For christs sake.....why do people keep spewing this crap.....our contract sucks, but so does Mesaba's. We have not been approached for or accepted ANY concessions to get what we have. Our contract was signed pre-Comair and pre-9/11.
QUOTE]

T-gates,

Dude, relax. Where in my post did I say "they're cheap because their pilot's rolled over for a deal"?

Don't be so paranoid. Much to your amazement, the world doesn't revolve around the pilot costs. A lot of factors go into an overall CASM, not just the pilots. FAs, MX, maintenence, facilities all add their share. MN is known for being a very expensive place to do business, while TN isn't.

Its not just the pilots, but the whole operation. It doesn't matter how little you pay the pilots if the rest of the operation is overly expensive and/or more of a hassle. [not that I'm saying Mesaba is!]

Best,
Nu

 

[T-Gates]

Note to self: Never post after post-highspeed nap.....

Yeah, I was a little grumpy....

This industry tends to do that....

Peace

 

[NuGuy]

Hiya T-Gates,

No prob...I think highly of naps....along with nooners, and hearty bowel movements, you have the holy trilogy of human exsistance.


Best,
Nu