Pilots' Bar Tab

[Ty Webb]

Alright, Ladies, I think it's time that someone bring this ridiculous string back to reality.

What those guys allegedly did was bizarre. It gave the whole industry another black eye at a time that we scarcely needed it . . . but some of you need to get down off of that soapbox before you fall off it and hurt yourself.

This is still America, and everyone still gets their day in court. Until then, let's wait until the facts are in.

The guy that said that ". . . since they pleaded not guilty . . [that] they were in denial" needs to educate himself about our legal system. Prosecutors routinely file multiple charges, in the expectation that there will be some dropped as part of plea bargaining. To plead guilty to everything off the bat would be stupid.

Chances are, they will be found NOT guilty in FL, probably on a few technicalities. I'm not sure that a jury will believe that sitting in an aircraft that is being tugged fits the description of "operating" an aircraft, and usually Federal regs supercede any state laws, especially at a Federally-funded airport. The Federal charges/certificate action is another story . . . . . I would think that will stick, based on the BAC alone.

Again, I am NOT condoning any violation of the very reasonable regs regarding alcohol use, but I am suggesting that you wait until all the info is in.

PS, for the King Air pilot who considers 2 drinks to be a "wild night", man, you are an animal . . . . like to be paired with you for a month, dude (NOT!).

 

[banned username 2]

PS, for the King Air pilot who considers 2 drinks to be a "wild night", man, you are an animal . . . . like to be paired with you for a month, dude (NOT!).

I'd rather be paired with him than someone who can't control their drinking and shows up to work drunk!

These is MUCH more to life than booze!

I enjoy an occasional drink, but every time I am out on the road it doesn't have to be a party, I've long since outgrown that...

 

[AWACoff]

These guys MOST likely did not drink 3 gallons of beer. The Smoking Gun is a very accurate site. It states they were drinking with "friends". I am guessing they each had about 6 or 7 12oz drinks each. Definitely getting "off the wagon" but by no means were they blowing "twice Florida's legal limit" and drinking 3 gallons of beer. Let he who has no "sin" cast the first stone. These guys did a stupid thing and are going to pay for it. Let it rest and let this incident fall out of the media spotlight.

 

[flywithruss]

Need to defend myself!

Ty ... I didn't say (or mean to say, in any case) that I thought two drinks constituted a "wild night" ... I just am VERY conservative about drinking whenever I might be flying, and especially during layovers. I'd rather be way too safe than get my name in the papers. I save my wild nights for the days off!

As for the "rush to judgment", there is no question that, whatever a jury says, these guys were monumentally STUPID! I'm going with Falcon Capt and saying that dancing with Bubba in the joint for a couple of years might just do the trick. This kind of publicity is the LAST thing we need.

Even if they bought all the booze for someone else, it shows very poor judgment to be out closing down a bar until 0430 and turning in at 0530 when you have a 1030 departure in the morning. Just my opinion ...

Fly safe, y'all!

R

 

[Ty Webb]

I'd rather be paired with him than someone who can't control their drinking and shows up to work drunk!

I'd rather not be paired with either of them . . . . someone who is an extremist one way or the other on the subject would be a pain.

While most pilots I know enjoy social drinking, no one I know would dream of violating the regs on the subject- and no one I know would tolerate it if their fellow crew member did, either.

 

[Simon Says]

Thank God we do not presume guilt before all facts are in. All of you wishing rape on these two individuals are way off base and a sickness in itself.

Ty is right on saying he would not want to fly with anyone far left or far right. Some of you all scare me with what you have to say. It takes education to understand the reasoning of our legal system and the reasoning behind it. It takes immaturity to try to belittle these guys. If they are found guilty of a crime than say what you must, but assuming they are guilty before they have a fair trial is just arrogant.

By the way wishing rape on these two pilots for the fact of "giving our profession a black eye" is ridiculous. Isn't it the point of not flying drunk is to protect the safety of the passengers and other people. It is not to protect our profession. Get your priorties right.

Now all of you that flamed me once before on this topic may now once again chime in.

 

[JayDub]

These guys MOST likely did not drink 3 gallons of beer. The Smoking Gun is a very accurate site. It states they were drinking with "friends". I am guessing they each had about 6 or 7 12oz drinks each. Definitely getting "off the wagon" but by no means were they blowing "twice Florida's legal limit" and drinking 3 gallons of beer. Let he who has no "sin" cast the first stone. These guys did a stupid thing and are going to pay for it. Let it rest and let this incident fall out of the media spotlight.

First off, I couldn't have said it better my self. Second, did anyone notice at the bottom of the receipt what was hand written? I bet it was his name and what used to be his employee number. You often will get a discount or credit at the hotel bar if you provide this. Usually we will put everything on one tab and split it up with cash, especially if we are socializing with someone who may not get this discount. What this means is the F.O. didn't necessarily pick-up the tab, he was probably the first to the bar.

Now on to the serious part of this post, it has been well publicized lately that America West has a twelve hour bottle-to-throttle rule. I also believe these guys were busted at @ 10:30 a.m. Look at the time the account was opened. When they put that first beer to their lips, they were in violation period dot, end of sentence. Twelve hours is twelve hours. We have got to get the word out that not one minute can be trivialized. If your policy is twelve hours, so be it and live up to it. Let alone flying after not quite six hours. Let's learn our lessons from this and move on.

 

[publisher]

video

Ah! Let's go to the video tape.

What we have is

Bar tab in detail
Room Key information
Video Tape from the bar.

 

[bigD]

Making jokes about prison rape and actually wishing it upon these guys are two very different things. Chris Rock's tossed salad bit is one of his most quoted segments, and people joke about it all the time. Doesn't mean they actually wish it on anyone. And personally, these guys brought the jokes on themselves. I don't have one ounce of pity for them.

Yes, they gave the profession a black eye. But worse, they showed a complete lack of respect for the responsibility they have to the people that ride in the back of their airplane. THAT is was pisses me off about this.

 

[flywithruss]

BigD ...

AMEN brother! You hit the nail on the head. People entrust us with their lives, and this was a flagrant abrogation of that trust. That is really what hurts here.

Also agreed that, while I've no sympathy for these clowns, the prison rape is a JOKE.

R