Options and a Union

[Apeman]

I received my cards in the mail the other day. I filled one out and will be sending it in tomorrow. I hope all the Options pilots like myself do the same thing. Please remember--just because you send in a card, does NOT MEAN you have just voted in the Union! It means you are willing to hear what they have to say! After enough cards are in, there are still 2 years (I believe) to actually tally a yes or no vote for representation. If after 2 years no vote for representation has been done, cards have to be mailed out again. Now I might be wrong on some of this, but that is my understanding. And if I'm wrong--don't be childish and bash me. Just give what you believe is correct information. I am trying to do what I feel is best for OUR pilot group! I am not interested in any more things being taken from us, while being told how good it is going to be for us! I wish there were a couple of different unions that were interested in our money, but unfortunately there is not. Kind of like going into battle with the french backing you up. I would much rather have a say as to what goes on in the company, then just sit back and take (or in our case, give back) what ever they decide. And if the Teamsters are the only one's that are around, it hurt's me none to hear them out.

 

[TonyC]

He started an honest discourse ...

ApeMan, It is clear from your post that you know nothing at all about how a union organizing campagin works.

If you want to send in a card requesting representation under the RLA, fine, Do it! But do not show your lack of knowledge by speaking about thinks you clearly know nothing about.

thor, it is clear from your post that you did not read ApeMan's post, or have no capacity to understand the English language, OR you are simply dead set on bashing anyone who suggests a meaningful discourse about the pros and cons of representation.

Let me repeat the good part:

Originally posted by ApeMan
And if I'm wrong--don't be childish and bash me. Just give what you believe is correct information.

So, pony up with some correct information, oh wise one, or sit back and let the mature adults carry the discussion.

 

[Dep676]

speaking about thinks you clearly know nothing about.

What the he!! is this "thinks you clearly know nothing about" crap? If you can't read he said he wasn't real clear on how the whole thing works and I believe he was looking for some anwsers. So moron if you can't help him with some correct anwsers. SHUT YOUR PIEHOLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

He was posting his toughts and said he didn't want some snot nose kid bashing him for it. He just wants to explore his options. I am getting real close to doing the samething. I am getting sick of having stuff taken away from us. Meanwhile being told much better it is going to be for us after the changes come. When really things are for the worse so far.

 

[matchthehatch]

ApeMan,

Thanks for your post. I, too, have sent mine in. Thor is either very anti-union or incapable of understanding your well-written sentences. The sentiment is starting to change after our new benefits package was detailed.

 

[apache]

I've had it with this Mickymouse, Amateur-hour, management that has evolved here at Flops. Mr Nahill and his ilk are just begging for the IBT to show up on the property. I've had lukewarm experience with the IBT and downright negative experience with Alpo. Ideally, we should all pull together for an in-house union although I think that the Company has rewarded just enough snitches in the ranks to kill off any unity among us. Anywho, I've been forced to send in my card and what will happen will happen. It is too bad that it is going to come down to this, but Management won't be happy until they reign in costs and efficiency directly at our (pilots, dispatchers) expense. My next big prediction: They will spend a sum of money equal to our old medical and benefit plan to law firms that specialize in anti-unionizing tactics. Better get the seat belt sign on because the next few years are going to be bumpy!! Injun Joe

 

[Lrjet55]

The last thing Options needs is the IBT. Ask any NJA guy and they will tell you, IBT is a fuggin' joke. The best thing Options can do is take the experienced pilots already there who have prior union or MEC experience and start your own in-house union. Next call the NJA MEC and ask them how they have negotiated their contracts. Finally, throw out all the NJA MEC information and run the other way. Do all this and you should be just fine.

 

[flyr4hire]

Unfortunately

anyone that tries to organize anything in-house will find themselves out of a job. I used to be straight line ANTI union and am not real hot about the IBT representing us BUT not anymore... I sent my card in. My hope is that the IBT has gained some kind of experience in their dealing with our bros over at netjets and will be able to use that experience to better represent us. Maybe it will help the fractionals in general to have the majority of frac pilots represented. I just don't like what I am seeing with the company and the direction I see us headed. (EX: weekly message, what weekly message... just shut up and fly the plane meat). We DON"T have anyone in our corner and we DON'T have anyone to go to bat for us when we see something that clearly doesn't pass the common sense test. Program Manager, Check Airman... yeah, right.

 

[Diesel]

i listened to the call in questions today on the 2nd. Not really much there. Sounds like there were both good and bad points with the questions that were answered. Of course i'm sure they were "selected" questions and answers.

Remember this if you do go union you won't have a comendations at the end of a weekly announcement or have a monthly message from your company. Of course you will be able to point at a booklet and say you guys worked me past midnight on my last day. You owe me X as described by the contract. Period.

It's a two way street. I've been happy with the representation but I think we're all waiting on the contract before I make my final decision. My dissapointment is the lack of comunication from the company once a union is formed. Except for the propaganda from the chief pilot.

 

[VivaZapata]

The IBT sucks. What sucks even worse is the road ahead for FLOPS with Nahill (no aviation experience) at the helm. At this point, my concern is a to have a legally binding contract to offer at least some protection from the whimsical style of the current upper management at FLOPS. Unfortunately the IBT is clearly the lesser of the evils.

My card has been mailed.

 

[Lrjet55]

All good points fellas. Being that I am an union pilot I fell better about my job. I know that the rules are laid down and supposed to be adhered to.

There in lies the problem. You will have a union and you will have a contract. The way the contract is written will have a tremendous amount to do with your happines. Our contract is essentially a giant loophole. And we the pilots do not get the advantage. Again, our contract was written as a UNION pilot group which speaks a great deal about the IBT representation. A contract this poorly written should not have been written to begin with. If the IBT would have properly represented the previous MEC then our current contract would never have come up for a vote. The fact that the contract is even here pseaks to the "old farts" at the company who couldnt go anywhere else.

The pilots at FLOPS will have to expect a great deal more and hold their leadership to higher standards that those at NJA. I completely agree that we all should have representation but IBT is most certainly not the answer.

Lastly, when you vote in your MEC make sure you have a good mix. Corporate, airline, cargo, the works. You need people with foresight, insite, vision and who are in touch with reality otherwise you will have a contract where a captain makes $37,500 a year. Welcome to our world.