Open letter to US Airways pilots

[FR8mastr]

FR8,

Ciabatonni did a lot more than mearly "speak up," now didn't he....

There are several ways he could have conducted himself while raising these concerns that would have been more productive. If he actually had good intentions, he could have solved the problems he sees by acting professionally. He doesn't do that, though....it's not his MO.....reminds me of our previous bargaining agent. Enough said.

So exactly what do you consider professional? give me an example of wrong doing, and what should have been done.

 

[j32wreck]

Give PHXFLYR some slack. He does not have a college education like most AWA pilots hired in the 90's.
It is extremely hard for them to express their feelings in writing.

M

Say there, Skippy, your avatar doesn't really jive with your comments.

 

[BeCareful!]

No. Not at all. But I must admit your ignorance regarding some of these issues is fast approaching the point where I'm left absolutley speechless.

PHXFLYR

OK there, All-Knowing-Desert-Flyer, then go ahead and enlighten me and the rest of us with what you know about Mr. Ciabattoni and his history of productive action as a long-time union guy at AAA. Your clear perspective on this should prove fascinating :laugh:

 

[Turtle21]

All correct, of course. I did find it interesting that a west pilot felt moved to post Dave's tantrum on a public forum, but to paint this as E/W was not my intent.

In any case, the true irony with Dave's rant is that while he appears to be trying to save USAPA from going the way of our horrid ALPA unit, what he is engaging in is exactly the ALPA-style, divisive, distracting, political stupidity that made our ALPA here on the east so g0damn ineffective. If he actually had good intentions, then there are several ways he could have gone about fixing the problems he perceives. Having siad that, I believe the issues he raises are important items to be on guard for, but after carful investigation of my own, I'm confident USAPA has a looooong way to go before reaching the bloated, top heavy, bureaucratic high mark set by AAA ALPA. If Dave sees a trend, then fine, let's look at it. But his actions are obviously ego-driven, and we'll all be better off without these distractions. Does anyone really believe that a union spending $75 on a hotel unreasonable? What if the Sterling burns down? Or they raise their rates? The Sterling's meeting room is too small anyway. I just see Dave's rant as very short sighted. We have waaaay bigger fish to fry, while this guy lives in the past and can tell you an ALPA story any time you want to hear one. Let it GO Dave. Live in the "here and now" and use your head for a minute.

In the end, Dave's not looking out for either east or west; Dave's looking out for Dave. He's just another ALPA guy who hates not being in power; we have a small fleet of these types. Dave is trying to convert on the "rebel" image he attained near the end of ALPA occupation on our property and crawl his way back into a position of power. The EVP gig apparently didn't do enough for his ego.

Bingo.

And too bad for him, he will never be elected again. The West will never trust him and the East won't either. Because he went off in a tizzy there is now too much uncertainty that he might not have the mettle to stick with it even when he isn't getting his way. He lost it once, what's to keep him cool headed in the future. Sure, he'll have a few die hard fans but he will never get elected again. He might have a couple valid points, but he just told all the pilots that we should trust no one at all but him. The whole world is wrong except him.

Its too bad really, he wasn't such a bad guy when he kept his wits about him.

 

[vetrider]

Bingo.
The whole world is wrong except him.

Its too bad really, he wasn't such a bad guy when he kept his wits about him.

That description of DC just happens to fit the east pilot group at large to a T.

 

[Bringupthebird]

Couldn't agree more! THe ALPA slough floated to the top of USAPA!!! It was just a matter of time! Now that USAPA is failing it will become more obvious that we just keep running out the clock- plan b all along. The west is so clueless. Keep it all up!

Wait. The east told us there was no overlap between ALPA and USAPA. Now you're saying the DNA was identical. Which is it? Seham told you if you changed the name you could convince the courts that you were completely different folks from that bad old ALPA and their misguided negotiating position of DOH which precipitated the Nic list.

Now you can see how ridiculous that argument looked to the rest of the rational world.

 

[PHXFLYR]

OK there, All-Knowing-Desert-Flyer, then go ahead and enlighten me and the rest of us with what you know about Mr. Ciabattoni and his history of productive action as a long-time union guy at AAA. Your clear perspective on this should prove fascinating :laugh:

Rowe, Ciabattoni and the Roll Call 4 ...the only group in union history who gave more in contract concessions than the company ask. 'nuff said

oh...and let us not forget the rank-and-file members of C41 who didn't have the "balz " to recall them from office after they where sold a bill of goods by these fine upstanding gentlemen.

PHXFLYR

 

[Fast43]

Wait. The east told us there was no overlap between ALPA and USAPA. Now you're saying the DNA was identical. Which is it? Seham told you if you changed the name you could convince the courts that you were completely different folks from that bad old ALPA and their misguided negotiating position of DOH which precipitated the Nic list.

Now you can see how ridiculous that argument looked to the rest of the rational world.

They have a name for this..........Dual Unionism!!!

Remember this term, we will hear it again during the Damages trial.


F

 

[Front Office]

You guy's sure do have a messed up family. Why not just have a rumble or duke it out and press on?

East send one guy West send one guy, put the gloves on and go at it till we see the last one standing?

I will be having a beer....

 

[Crzipilot]

Looks like someone has been buddying up with a certain LGA Capt............

 

[Turtle21]

You guy's sure do have a messed up family. Why not just have a rumble or duke it out and press on?

East send one guy West send one guy, put the gloves on and go at it till we see the last one standing?

I will be having a beer....

Republic and Northwest are like sole mates compared to Rustheads and Tumble weed.


ALPA national is passing out the beers, compliments of RHs and TWs. Drink up.

 

[becket]

Republic and Northwest are like sole mates compared to Rustheads and Tumble weed.


ALPA national is passing out the beers, compliments of RHs and TWs. Drink up.

Rusthead/Bubbas and Tumbleweeds are "sole" mates as you say. One won't hesitate to kick in the teeth of the other.

"soul" mate is something else entirely.

 

[Bad-Andy]

You guy's sure do have a messed up family. Why not just have a rumble or duke it out and press on?

East send one guy West send one guy, put the gloves on and go at it till we see the last one standing?

I will be having a beer....

The problem with that is, even if they agreed to fight, and even agreed on the rules, if one side lost (say because they sent a big talker to the fight as opposed to the toughest guy on the team), they would argue that the ref was senile and old and should have changed the rules in the middle of the fight. Then a few loud-mouthed hecklers from the winning team would jump up and down and scream that they want their prize winnings right now and that they are being disenfranchised, all on the various internet message boards (without actually doing anything productive like using the legal system to remedy the situation).

And, while all this is happening, the manager/coach (who happens to be the same for both fighters) will be laughing and sneaking out the back door with both teams' cash, while pleading poverty. (And, he is probably having another beer while driving home).

The moral of the story? Well, there really isn't one other than how f'ed up the whole situation is, especially for the furloughs stuck in the middle (particularly the west guys that should have never been furloughed in the first place...).