On call

[aeronautic1]

Depends on when your last flight was. On Call 24/7 does not mean duty time, unless you are called away from your domicile/hotel. Consult your AIM for clarification.

 

[59PA]

Question, if on call 24/7, when you are called to fly, when was your rest period? How are 135 companies addressing this?

I did not state my question clearly. If on call, and expected to fly when or if called, you are not free from responsibility to fly should the need arise. You are therefore not on rest. Do companies simply ignore this?

 

[TimsKeeper]

What section does the AIM talk about duty times? Just curious, the only information I have seen are in he FAR's. tx

 

[aeronautic1]

What section does the AIM talk about duty times? Just curious, the only information I have seen are in he FAR's. tx

I ment FARs

 

[MNR]

The FAA has up until this point said that you just have to be able to "look back" over the last 24 hours and see 10 hours of rest some time in there. Some companys will tell you that its technically ok to call you out at 2 am for a 3 am show and a 4 am depature and as long as you were not "on duty" since 3 pm that afternoon they can use you until 5pm the next day. If you look at the FARs under 135 nowhere does it specifically outline "on call" situations. Its a loophole that some operators choose to exploit at this point.

The FAA is quite aware of it and is right now in the final process of a major revamp of the Part 135 regulations. Similar to The addition of Part 91(k). One of the things that will be addressed in detail is the issue of rest time, on call time, duty time, etc. From what I have read companies will have a number of options about how to operate their fleet but each option will be much more defined.

The company I work for tries very hard to not put pilots in situations like I described above. They try to give us at least 10 hours notice of a trip. So briefings are done the day before for the next day. We then know we are basicly off unless they call and say the trip cancelled. Pop-ups do occur but if they happen between 10 pm and 6 am the dispatchers will not call until exactly 2 hours before wheels up time.

As far as the brewski thing goes. When at home, unless I get briefed for a trip the next day and they turn me off for 10+ hours I don't. I really dont want to tell the CP, "Yeah sorry I can't do that trip because I just had a beer". When on the road I have two questions for the dispatchers when we get done with a trip. "Are we released to the hotel?" and "When can we have a beer?" They typical response is too tell us to go to the hotel and call in around dinner too turn us off duty. (if there is duty time left) Seems to work well so far.

 

[FlyingMoose]

59PA, you are asking the key question, that for some reason, the answer to which eludes many pilots, operators, and POI's.

I've never understood why people get twisted up into the discussion of an "on call" term not being in the FAR's. It doesn't need to be and IMHO this was by design. Instead of trying to define any and all possible terms an operator might come up with to describe being "on call", the FAR's were written specifically to define rest requirements and what qualifies as rest. Subpart F specifically and completely lists all applicable Rest Requirements per operation type and 135.273 specifically and completely defines Rest / Rest Period.

Secondly, The FAA has issued numerous letters, notices and publications addressing this matter. But for whatever reason, many pilots and operators still remain confused and continue to argue about the "on call" term and likewise many POI's can't seem to read and understand the language either! That is why the "rewrite" is being done, not to close a loop-hole, but to clarify there isn't one to begin with and to stop operators AND pilots from trying to exploit their "misunderstanding" of the FAR's.

With all of that said, understand that being "on call" 24/7 is not in and of it self what is illegal and unsafe. There is nothing wrong (from a regulatory sense) with being "on call" for any length of time in order to be given a schedule or assignment which will provide for a PROSPECTIVE Rest Period (as defined by the FAR's) within any preceding 24 hours. The bottom line is that any time that you are "on call" is not and can not be considered Rest or any part of a Rest Period.

BTW, keep in mind that this is only addressing the regulatory issue and we aren't even discussing the practical and physiological reason for why these rules are present and need to be respected by operators AND pilots. The whole point is to avoid flying fatigued. Never forget that it is our responsibilty as pilots to operate safely and the lack of understanding or concern for current regulations by your operator or lack of government oversight shouldn't relieve you of common sense and safety.