Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Friendliest aviation Ccmmunity on the web
  • Modern site for PC's, Phones, Tablets - no 3rd party apps required
  • Ask questions, help others, promote aviation
  • Share the passion for aviation
  • Invite everyone to Flightinfo.com and let's have fun

Nothing like waking up and being pi$$ed off after reading this

Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Modern secure site, no 3rd party apps required
  • Invite your friends
  • Share the passion of aviation
  • Friendliest aviation community on the web

capt. megadeth

Metal Momma!
Joined
Oct 12, 2003
Posts
2,898
Nothing like waking up and reading this to start your day off right

Not that I'm surprised....but for Pete's sake....


Delta CEO says airline to seek termination of pilots' pension 'fairly soon'
PARIS (AP) — Delta Air Lines will file a request to terminate its pilots' defined benefit pension plan "fairly soon," Chief Executive Gerald Grinstein said in an interview Friday in which he also talked about employee pay cuts, his future and whether a merger is a good idea.
Grinstein, in Paris for a meeting with other executives, told The Associated Press that the Atlanta-based airline is in talks with the United States' pension insurer about the pilots' pension.
Asked when the company planned to seek termination of the pension, Grinstein said, "It'll be probably fairly soon."
He said the third-largest airline in the U.S. is keeping the pilots' union informed about the discussions with the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corp.
"We've got a judicial schedule to conform to," he said. "All of those are pieces in motion, but it'll be fairly soon."
It was the first time a Delta executive has said for sure that the airline plans to terminate the pilots' pension. In the past, the company has said only that it would likely seek termination.
A union spokeswoman, Kelly Collins, had no immediate comment when reached by telephone Friday.
Grinstein also said that Delta has no plans to ask its pilots for a third pay cut, and he dismissed the idea, at least for now, that the bankrupt company could merge with another carrier.
Grinstein said the $280-million-a-year concessions agreement that pilots and the bankruptcy court approved Wednesday gives the airline the cost cuts it needs.
"I don't expect to go back to the pilots," Grinstein said. "We have all our people at the market rate. We are going to have to be more efficient both in the way we operate the airline but also in what can be recouped in revenue management, handling the network and utilization of our equipment."
The airline's chief financial officer, Edward Bastian, had been non-committal when asked in March by AP whether the company might seek a third pay cut from pilots.
The concessions package approved this week, which included an initial 14% pay cut and assurances the pilots union won't fight any company effort to terminate the pilots' pension, was the second the pilots agreed to in two years. In 2004, the pilots gave up $1 billion in annual concessions in a five-year deal.
Delta has said previously it expects to emerge from Chapter 11 in the first half of next year. On Friday, Grinstein said Delta's goal is to emerge as an independent standalone company. Mergers are not an option, at least not now, he said.
"Mergers in our industry are very difficult. You'd be hard pressed to name a lot of them that have worked in the long-term sense," Grinstein said.
He added, "Merging workforces particularly when they have different unions and getting the seniority straight in an industry that is so affected by attitude, when your service quality is a derivative of attitude — it can give you a pause, and in this market place you don't need a pause."
Separately, Delta has said it supports making it easier for a foreign investor to invest in a U.S. airline within statutory limits.
Asked about his future at the airline, Grinstein said he'll "stay until at least we know we're coming out" of bankruptcy. He wasn't more specific.
He said Delta fought long and hard to avoid filing for bankruptcy protection last September, saying it was a very difficult "extremely costly" process that had drained time and energy when the airline needed to turn itself around.
"Obviously I didn't want to file Chapter 11," he said. "It's taken more time than I'd like to have spent doing it ... It's a diversion. You'd like to be doing or thinking about different things and you have to spend a significant part of your energy on that."
If there was a silver lining to bankruptcy, it was putting in place a team of people that were capable of running the airline, he said.
Grinstein was upbeat about the airline's prospects, saying Delta had managed to wrestle revenue costs plus the soaring cost of oil and still post a profit in April.
"I think that we've made remarkable progress," he said.
"In the light of fuel at the levels that it's at, the company was still profitable in April. When the final numbers are out I think you'll see a remarkable change in where Delta is in relation to the rest of the industry," he said.
In approving the pilot concessions deal Wednesday, a U.S. Bankruptcy Court judge rejected claims by the government's pension insurer that it should receive the compensation the pilots were promised if their pension is terminated.
If getting the pilot deal was a success, seeing a bankruptcy court deny Delta subsidiary Comair's request to reject its contract with its 970 flight attendants was one of Delta's failures, Grinstein said. Comair wanted to impose pay cuts the regional carrier says it needs to stay in business.
"There have been some failures too," the Delta CEO said. "We have to recognize that. We have to go back into negotiations on that. I hope we can work that out."




I know how long he'll stay.....until he rapes every last employee and ensures enough money for himself to live like a sheik for the rest of his life. Gawd, when will the madness stop?
 
I have to say that really stinks, not suprising nut it still stinks.

I think I'm more amazed that AAL and CAL still have their pensions. I think if I was a major shareholder with AAL or CAL I would be suing the companies for inept management. How can they compete when they not only have a pension obligation, but they didn't even use the bankrupsy "Get out of Jail" free card when they had the chance.
 
This was all expected, since they have not been funding the pensions for awhile. As far as more eventual pay cuts, Bastain said during the arbitration that he couldn't rule it out, but Grinstein just stated we are now at "Market price." I guess they could still ask for more, and the cynical people on here will say they absolutely will, but they are the same people that would have voted NO regardless to any deal being made, just because they dislike the management, most of which are gone or are in the process of leaving. We have had terrible management in the past, but the ones that have been promoted lately seem to be a lot better or more promising. We shall see.


Bye Bye--General Lee
 
Uncle Leo said:
I have to say that really stinks, not suprising nut it still stinks.

I think I'm more amazed that AAL and CAL still have their pensions. I think if I was a major shareholder with AAL or CAL I would be suing the companies for inept management. How can they compete when they not only have a pension obligation, but they didn't even use the bankrupsy "Get out of Jail" free card when they had the chance.


Because unlike some AA has not let their pension obligations slip, they have paid and continue to pay, I believe our A fund is roughly %80-85 funded. It would actually COST the airline more money to shut it down and start a new one. The B fund is paid to us each year, roughly %11 of or pay, and that fund has been producing an average %13 a year return.


Not sure how CAL is doing it, I thought they used a hunk of the ExpressJet IPO proceeds to pay up on their pension. An airline CAN pay a pension and stay in business.

I am sure the UAL,NWA,DAL managers still have pensions.......

AA
 
I am sure the UAL,NWA,DAL managers still have pensions.......

NWA pilots still have a pension too, at least for now, although it is frozen just like CAL. If the legislation passes the plan could survive. The weasels running NWA don't care about the pilots BUT they don't want to give any equity to the PBGC in a termination either.
 
If the legislation passes the plan could survive.
GWB promises to veto it. Gonna cost my daddy about $65k a year until he dies if NWA terminates it.And, correct me if I'm wrong, NWA wants to fully fund it, they just want more time.Great country we live in. 31 years flying the line, and then to get hosed like this.
 
I think if I was a major shareholder with AAL or CAL I would be suing the companies for inept management

WHAT?????

Pilots suing for thier pensions after profits are gained by thier bankrupt carriers makes more sense to me.
 
capt. megadeth said:
Nothing like waking up and being pi$$ed off after reading this

Being pissed off AFTER reading this? Does that mean you actually woke up in a good mood to begin with? :p


PS This was meant in a friendly joking way, please don't berate me as a result. I'm ever more fragile than SWA/FO.
 
AAflyer said:
Because unlike some AA has not let their pension obligations slip, they have paid and continue to pay, I believe our A fund is roughly %80-85 funded. It would actually COST the airline more money to shut it down and start a new one. The B fund is paid to us each year, roughly %11 of or pay, and that fund has been producing an average %13 a year return.


Not sure how CAL is doing it, I thought they used a hunk of the ExpressJet IPO proceeds to pay up on their pension. An airline CAN pay a pension and stay in business.

I am sure the UAL,NWA,DAL managers still have pensions.......

AA

AA Management should be commended for doing the right thing - even in difficult times.

The management like DAL/UAL out there should be thrown in jail... They made a promise to these people and they should have funded it but they are too busy lining their own pockets - it is a disgrace.
 
Welcome to my world ie.. no more pension. Hopefully the PBGC won't want to accept DL's pension and just fight the courts to not approve the contract. This might make DL management have to think of another plan. As for AA and AL hanging on to theirs..good luck guys, it's pretty hard to compete with another large airline not paying millions upon millions to an "A" fund when your competitor isn't. Of course if they hedged their fuel like SWA maybe they could. :)
Either way, you guys still with your A fund intact, you are my hero's.
 
My understanding of the A-fund at AA is that the company is required to fund it legally due to the A scalers on the property. It is not due to the kindness of the AA management. Look to the future for AA to stop funding the A-fund.
 
I've heard the language that describes the A-fund at AA is one of the most brilliantly-crafted bits of lawyerese in the history of contract negotiations. Apparently, as AAflyer mentioned, it would be MORE costly (how, I don't know) to eliminate the A-fund than to keep it.

Now how it will ultimately affect the airline, time will tell.
 
HighSpeedClimb said:
Welcome to my world ie.. no more pension. Hopefully the PBGC won't want to accept DL's pension and just fight the courts to not approve the contract. This might make DL management have to think of another plan. As for AA and AL hanging on to theirs..good luck guys, it's pretty hard to compete with another large airline not paying millions upon millions to an "A" fund when your competitor isn't. Of course if they hedged their fuel like SWA maybe they could. :)
Either way, you guys still with your A fund intact, you are my hero's.

Very unlikely. It looks like the PBGC just wants a piece of equity, like they got with UAL.


Bye Bye--General Lee
 

Latest resources

Back
Top Bottom