NJI Hiring Info

[mmuzzall]

All,

I'm currently flying a G450 and am interested in applying to NJI. Does anyone know if they are in a hiring mode?

Thanks

 

[Humphreybogart]

I don't know anything about them. Hope this helps, Bogie

 

[On Your Six]

I don't know anything about them. Hope this helps, Bogie

Seriously, a lame and useless response. But not surprising - we expect your idiotic responses by now.

With regard to NJI, keep in mind that NJA and NJI will likely merge lists at some point. Not sure what that means for NJI hiring given that some NJA pilots are already taking a few FO seats in the Gulfstreams. I suppose NJI does need to cover for some limited attrition. Wolfpack and other NJI pilots can tell you. Good luck.

 

[NJA bound]

Just had a NJA Falcon 2000 copilot bid to GIV copilot this week, hired on at NJA 2 years ago. If you go the NJA to NJI route, probably take a twice that long if you hired on today.

 

[ozpilot]

According to the Union, that FO will not be able to upgrade to Captain at NJI until his seniority at NJA allows it - i.e. never.

 

[RNObased]

According to the Union, that FO will not be able to upgrade to Captain at NJI until his seniority at NJA allows it - i.e. never.

Never is a awful long time, I would say somewhere on the order of 10-15yrs.

 

[FLYLOW22]

Much happens in 10-15 years.

 

[gutshotdraw]

Ok. Let's review. Each time NJI receives an additional aircraft, 5 pilot positions are created. One is an NJA "Captain" bid, one is an NJA "First Officer" bid, and the other three are hired off the street. Every third aircraft delivery, one additional NJA "Captain" bid is added.

Five aircraft deliveries are scheduled for this year with no aircraft leaving the system. Next year should see about six deliveries with one or two older SP's going away. You do the math.

The rest of the issue can be found over by the carcass of that dead horse....

 

[RTRHD]

I bet no GIV Sp's go away.

 

[ozpilot]

Ok. Let's review. Each time NJI receives an additional aircraft, 5 pilot positions are created. One is an NJA "Captain" bid, one is an NJA "First Officer" bid, and the other three are hired off the street. Every third aircraft delivery, one additional NJA "Captain" bid is added.

Can you qualify this?

According to the LOA, for every 3 upgrades at NJI, one has to come from NJA. For every 2 FO's hired one has to come from NJA.

So to keep the equation on the 5 pilot positions you've quoted, two out of the three "off the street" pilots would have to be Captain upgrades (or a direct Captain hire) and the other one would be new hire FO.

This makes for 3 Captains and 2 FO's right? One NJA captain and one NJA FO in complience with the LOA.

My point on upgrades is that when the new hire and the NJA FO go to initial, the new hire FO will mostly likely be able to upgrade 10+ years ahead of the NJA FO. I'm not sure all our FO's over there understand that. I suspect some believe that an NJI FO slot is a shortcut to an NJI Captain slot.

 

[gutshotdraw]

Oz...it's a bit like mixing oil and water. Since it is a mixed shop, you can't try and apply a strict union upgrade policy. Without muddying the waters too much....

Every time a new aiplane arrives, 4 existing NJI G-IVSP Captains move up to G-450/550/V Captain positions and 2 existing NJI G-IVSP F/O's move over the "Five" fleet. At the same time, 3 existing NJI F/O's upgrade to G-IV Captain and 1 NJA Captain is brought in to fill the vacant PIC slots. Then, 3 off the street F/O's and 1 NJA F/O are brought on board to fill those vacant SIC slots. Every third airplane, an extra NJA Captain comes over to comply with the LOA. Every so often, an extra couple of people are hired or brought over from NJA to account for attrition or to make the staffing numbers right.

We have been told that any F/O on the property prior to date of signing (11/05) will upgrade to G-IV Captain on schedule (about 2-3 years from DOH at present delivery rate). The NJA Captains in the mix will stretch the usual 60-40 PIC-SIC ratio to about 80-20 until the last pre-signing F/O makes Captain. Then, upgrades will essentially stop for off the street F/O's until the ratio returns to normal. By the time that happens, we'll probably have a final answer on the over-riding topic and then all bets will be off.

Clear as mud?

Bottom line: NJI only hires F/O's off the street and I don't think 1108 will allow NJA F/O's who came over on the LOA to shortcut into Captain positions.

 

[ozpilot]

Thanks gutshotdraw

I think its going to be very interesting when those NJI FO's junior to the NJA/NJI FO's start upgrading.

I can imagine NJI saying to our FO's "We'd love to give you a $50K payraise and upgrade you, but your union won't allow it..." I see a storm building on the horizon .....

BTW there is nothing in any of the 3 NJA/NJI LOA's that prohibits one of ours from taking an upgrade if offered. I doubt NJI will offer an upgrade to any of our FO's because its to their advantage not to ("Badddd Union..."), but we shall see.

 

[gutshotdraw]

Not quite a 50K raise. In case you didn't know, the NJA F/O's on property are earning NJI F/O pay, not CBA Class IV F/O pay. In other words, about 75K instead of 50K.

And that storm has been brewing for a while now. I'm hoping for sunnier skies in 2009 no matter what the resolution....

 

[wolfpackpilot]

MMuzzall,

Since no one wants to answer your question!

With 450 experience (and a decent attitude) you "might" be able to get an interview if you know someone on the inside. If its a good schedule, good benefits and the such your looking for, then NJI might be right for you. If its the left seat and $110K+ your looking for..... aint gonna happen if you were hired off the street today (not for a long time anyway).

But each person has his/her own wants in life.

PM me with any questions.

Wolfpack Pilot

 

[TCA]

Hey.. "Gutshot"How come I can't P.M. you?
Send me one or page me.

 

[notaNJApilot]

Not quite a 50K raise. In case you didn't know, the NJA F/O's on property are earning NJI F/O pay, not CBA Class IV F/O pay. In other words, about 75K instead of 50K.

And that storm has been brewing for a while now. I'm hoping for sunnier skies in 2009 no matter what the resolution....

doesn't the LOA say Class 4 FO pay? how is that possible?

 

[gutshotdraw]

Cause NJI can pay 'em more if they want to. And for some reason, they want to. Way above my pay grade.

TCA: "PM's? We don't need no stinking PM's"

 

[ozpilot]

FYI - LOA 01-012 specifies that first year FO salary for NJA pilots moving to NJI is set at $70k.

 

[notaNJApilot]

good to know. otherwise i would imagine there would be complaints from the few 2000EX FOs.

 

[TCA]

O.K. Then No P.M......Correction. (about 2-3 years from DOH at present delivery rate)..This is not holding.
Tim

 

[fly2dive]

OZ "FYI - LOA 01-012 specifies that first year FO salary for NJA pilots moving to NJI is set at $70k."

Original Class 4 table was flat $50K for 1st year in type and only a 10 yr FO in type would make $70K.

01-12 is a result of what NJI chose to pay them.

 

[kman]

I thought it was a average of the g's fo w2's.

 

[geeitup]

So what is an educated guess on upgrade for a guy hired now, off the street, assuming the lists are combined? Usually when seniority lists are combined, the list is still biased toward the indiginous pilot group, using some sort of formula. Could time to upgrade ever be as bad as the Majors' 8-10 years?

 

[jtf]

If the lists are combined (big IF since nothing is close to decided yet and the company will fight it till the end) and it happened before you upgraded at NJI, it would be probably at least 15 years and probably longer to hold similar pay grade equipment (the current generation of Gulfstreams will be retired from NetJets by then). If the lists are combined, the biggest shaft will go to those hired off the street at NJI who didn't upgrade before a merger. I'm sure they wouldn't be forced from their FO seat, but they would only be able to be captain when their company wide seniority would hold it. The way the current union has been planning so far and is telling everyone is that the seniority list will be straight date of hire and that most likely there will be fences to keep current Gulfstream CAs and FOs in seat so they won't be displaced by senior NJA pilots. Many NJA pilots are not happy about that since they wish for NJI pilots to go to the bottom of the list, but the current union leaders have said that isn't fair and that won't fly if things go to arbitration or court. Whatever happens it is almost 2 years before the union can move forward with merger plans anyway and probably a lot longer before anything is decided since the company plans on fighting it.

 

[gutshotdraw]

Pretty much what he said....

 

[RTRHD]

I am getting pissed again. LOL

 

[doylehargraves]

Many NJA pilots are not happy about that since they wish for NJI pilots to go to the bottom of the list,

Big surprise there. It's too bad there is this animosity from NJA over NJI. My question is this: If the payscale at NJI was the same, or lower, as NJA, would this even be an issue? Or, does all this boil down to the NJA people wanting to fly bigger equipment to overfill the ego?

 

[Ultra Grump]

Personally, I could care less about the pilots or the planes at NJI. The reason I care about the issue is SCOPE. We need to lock down the scope - all domestically-based NetJets flying needs to be done by 1108 pilots.

The reason there is angst about where the NJI pilots would be put on the list is primarily because they are non-union, have not been paying union dues, yet have been reaping, and will continue to reap, the benefits that we have to fight so hard to get.

A staple will never happen, which is understandable. A ratio may be okay, but it'd have to be a pretty hefty ratio. The worst that could happen is a relative-seniority integration. DOH would be preferable to that.

 

[doylehargraves]

yet have been reaping, and will continue to reap, the benefits that we have to fight so hard to get.

Like what?

 

[Ultra Grump]

I'm sorry, I was under the impression that NJI got a pay raise, oh, right about the time our new CBA came around. When did NJI get 7-7 for all?