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Negotiating a Contract

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falcondrivr

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 3, 2001
Posts
111
Everyone on this forum has faced this issue before:
You are flying for an owner on two different large jets and are required to do charter also.
Your flight dept could easily be a career company if they only treated you better; as in ACCEPTABLE QUALITY OF LIFE better.
They can certainly afford to do it, they just don't offer. Now it's time to ask for a raise, better flying schedule, days off, etc.
You are not worried if you hav to leave this job, so shooting high and asking for everything is the plan.
I am hoping I could get some comments on the following list as to any points i might be missing:

Pay increase
Annual COLA raise
Cap on flying days/month
Limiting the 135 flying to only one of the types
Restricting back to back long trips without sufficient rest in between.

This company runs my ass ragged. 20 days/mo avg. A big salary is meaningless if I am never home. I think its worth pushing for before deciding to leave. They are a good group.

Any suggestions would help.
 
Get next job lined up, then explain to them that you'll need those items to stay. Some companies will never, ever, get the big picture. So, you're probably going to leave. The only thing these places understand is a withdrawal of services.
 
It's all about head-count. The company can ONLY give you the first two items until it has to add bodies to the payroll. You can fly a bird 2000 hours a year with proper head-count, and everyone is happy.

You're dealing with a company philosophy here, and while it's easy for them to take care of 1 and 2, if they stop there, you're going to be just as unhappy....
 
Is the employer concerned about the safety implications of crew fatigue? Do they seem to value crews as people or simply interchangeable service providers? IF so, you may have a chance, if not, you get what you get. Find something better before you force the issue. Good luck.

MT
 
Is the employer concerned about the safety implications of crew fatigue? Do they seem to value crews as people or simply interchangeable service providers? IF so, you may have a chance, if not, you get what you get. Find something better before you force the issue. Good luck.

MT

Good advice. How much leverage do you think you have?
 
Everyone on this forum has faced this issue before:
You are flying for an owner on two different large jets and are required to do charter also.
Your flight dept could easily be a career company if they only treated you better; as in ACCEPTABLE QUALITY OF LIFE better.
They can certainly afford to do it, they just don't offer. Now it's time to ask for a raise, better flying schedule, days off, etc.
You are not worried if you hav to leave this job, so shooting high and asking for everything is the plan.
I am hoping I could get some comments on the following list as to any points i might be missing:

Pay increase
Annual COLA raise
Cap on flying days/month
Limiting the 135 flying to only one of the types
Restricting back to back long trips without sufficient rest in between.

This company runs my ass ragged. 20 days/mo avg. A big salary is meaningless if I am never home. I think its worth pushing for before deciding to leave. They are a good group.

Any suggestions would help.

Remember, everything in negotiation is give and take. You don't give them your minimum, you give them your entire wishlist plus 25%... and you don't present this to them as an ultimatum, but just as a proposal to be negotiated. You also need to be prepared for them to completely reject everything and possibly send you walking. Are you prepared for that? You might be, but something to keep in mind... An old friend of mine told me once - when the pain of staying is greater than the pain of leaving... you leave. That's what I live by.

Something else - offer a proposal to the owner to make it worth his while... whether it's hiring an SIC for charters or whatnot - having another body does wonders and do the math to see if it's feasible and whether it makes financial sense from revenue perspective.

Remember, the market is still such that they could probably replace you fairly easily. Won't be so in a couple years...

Good luck!
 
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This thread is a few weeks old but I have some thoughts anyway and if it doesn't help falcondrivr it might help someone else so here you go. When you negotiate anything the inclination is always to start with your own perspective, and that's fine. Frankly, that's precisely what your counter-party expects of you. But you will be more likely to achieve the results you want if you take the time to understand your counter-party's perspective. With that in mind, think about what motivates them. In this particular case, why do they work you the way they do? Is it because they think that you're easy to replace? Is it because the DO just has terrible management skills and can't juggle crew assignments and operations? Is it because you have marketing people overselling aircraft availability? Did they pay for your type and now they think you owe them? Are they just cheap? There could be TONS of different reasons, so think about what those reasons are. Once you understand what drives their decisions and actions you will be more likely to frame your negotiating position in terms that they can understand. You need to “sell” your position to them, and this is the way to sell yourself and what you need.

So… if they paid for your type and you leave then it will cost them more in the long run to hire and train someone else then it would to make you happy enough to stay. Do they think you are easy to replace (i.e. lots of folks out there with this type or lots of available people to do contract work if you leave)? Then the way you sell your position to them in THEIR terms is that using contractors is even more difficult when short notice trips are scheduled, and very few contractors can cover multiple types that they operate. Are they just cheap? Find a way to remind them of the costs associated with locating and hiring new folks. The DO/chief pilot just doesn’t care? How much more work would it be on them to replace you? Whatever motivates them, sell them your position in their terms and you’ll get a better outcome.

Good luck!
 

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