Metro's with JATO bottles?

[AceCrackshot]

Can anyone give me a source or any info on JATO bottles being installed in early Metros?

 

[N7167L]

Can anyone give me a source or any info on JATO bottles being installed in early Metros?

It's not much, but a small mention was noted here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairchild_Swearingen_Metroliner

 

[flx757]

I flew many of the old Metro IIs with JATO bottles in the early '80s. A few hundred lbs of thrust designed to keep the aircraft airborne while you retracted the landing gear in the event of an engine failure on takeoff. I could not imagine having to rely on that for real. The -3 engines were vastly underpowered and the landing gear had these big spade-type attachments on the back of the strut that would sort of seal up the underside of the nacelle when the gear was retracted. But in the mean time, they were just huge drag devices hanging out when the gear was extended.

No way this aircraft would fly on one engine with the gear extended. SO...the JATO was installed in an effort to keep it airborne until you could retract the gear. Lots of noise and smoke...probably very little actual effect.

Later improvements included removal of the spade doors, the "Super 3" engine mod...then eventually the -10 and -11 engines. These improvements basically ended the need for the JATO.

 

[dojetdriver]

I thought it was more a smoke flare to help find the crash site.

 

[N7167L]

Has anyone ever found a good website (or book) that goes into details on each mod that was ever produced, etc.? (e.g. what was the "Super 3" engine mod?)

 

[Corona]

I flew many of the old Metro IIs with JATO bottles in the early '80s. A few hundred lbs of thrust designed to keep the aircraft airborne while you retracted the landing gear in the event of an engine failure on takeoff. I could not imagine having to rely on that for real. The -3 engines were vastly underpowered and the landing gear had these big spade-type attachments on the back of the strut that would sort of seal up the underside of the nacelle when the gear was retracted. But in the mean time, they were just huge drag devices hanging out when the gear was extended.

No way this aircraft would fly on one engine with the gear extended. SO...the JATO was installed in an effort to keep it airborne until you could retract the gear. Lots of noise and smoke...probably very little actual effect.

Later improvements included removal of the spade doors, the "Super 3" engine mod...then eventually the -10 and -11 engines. These improvements basically ended the need for the JATO.

Yikes! And I always thought the manufacturers could never dream up anything more stupid than the water/meth injection on the good 'ol BA3100!

C

 

[xspud]

Metro III also had AWI. My former airline had IIs before my time and I heard a story about JATO bottles being replaced for time compliance: supposedly the bottles were fired on the ramp with the brakes released and didn't even cause the airplane to roll forward. Even in the III we had to raise the gear at MDA on single engine approaches, couldn't maintain altitude with the gear down.

 

[flx757]

Yep...all the Metros I flew...II, IIA and III, had AWI.

I've heard that same story about the no chocks, no brakes Metro II where they were changing the JATO out (they had to be replaced at certain time intervals), and were taking "bets" on how far it would roll. Like you said, as the story goes, it made much noise and much smoke, but didn't budge at all.

Maybe a true story, maybe urban legend among old Metro drivers, but I have talked to more than one guy that "was there" when one of these "tests" were conducted. True or not, it's a good story that pretty much sums up the usefulness of the JATOs.

 

[SDCFI]

How were the JATO bottles activated from the cockpit? The MEL for our Metros actually still has the rocket listed in it, but I've never seen any info regarding their operation.

 

[flx757]

There was a key that was used to "arm" the system, then there was a red-guarded toggle switch used to activate it. I knew some guys that were always "at the ready" with the JATO. Key "on"...guard raised.:bomb:

 

[Corona]

Perhaps the JATO Metro comments could be repeated on the "Suppose an airplane is on a moving runway" thread. Now, that would resurrect some serious debate! (Not)

C

 

[PreRVSM]

The Swearingen ELT,,,, you follow the smoke trail to the crash site.


I was a night shift mechanic at an airline when we had 4 of these JATO bottles time out.
The first one we had the brake on, the boys in the cockpit didn't even know it light off as it did not burn through the wire. It had a small wire that went in front of the rockets output to give a cockpit light.
We did #2 without brakes,, did not move the plane.
#3 got ugly as it burned a hole in the side of the tail cone,,, when the rocket did not work right. Thats when the "fun" at night shift came to an end,, kinda hard to explain that one to the boss.
#4, removed the tail cone,, still did not move the aircraft

The Super 3 mod was a new compressor,, to improve power output.

 

[TXDA2000]

There is a great old story of a Metro Airlilnes Metro that had there Jato bottle fire waiting in line at DFW. The guy behind them in a widebody radioed ground and said "DFW ground, could you let Metro XXX know that he just farted"

Some of us still get to fly these lovely birds, luckily ours is short and has -10's.

 

[ArcticFlier]

It provided a smoke trail to the point of impact.....................


That is all,


AF

 

[flx757]

There is a great old story of a Metro Airlilnes Metro that had there Jato bottle fire waiting in line at DFW. The guy behind them in a widebody radioed ground and said "DFW ground, could you let Metro XXX know that he just farted"

Some of us still get to fly these lovely birds, luckily ours is short and has -10's.

I don't think that was Metro. AFAIK, they didn't operate the Metroliner. Only BE-99s, Twin Otters and Convair 580s. I'm pretty sure the airline in that story (embellished a bit, but it actually did happen where the JATO was fired waiting in line for takeoff) was Rio Airways.