Message from US Airways concerning 190 fleet

[jball2]

Remember that the Midwest and F9 deals means RAH has to actually pay for their own fuel as opposed to the fee per departure plan they have with the other companies. If gas goes back up they are in trouble.

 

[RobCat]

Remember that the Midwest and F9 deals means RAH has to actually pay for their own fuel as opposed to the fee per departure plan they have with the other companies. If gas goes back up they are in trouble.

If fuel prices darts up like it did before I think we are all in trouble.

 

[Bringupthebird]

Why would RAH implode? They have several contracts to provide services which gives them cash flow. Indy had none of that, that was their plan, remember? "Independence"? Didn't get them very far, as much as I like the idea.

You're comparing apples to oranges, Grumpy.

Who are their contracts with, predominantly? Why wouldn't those companies (or "company" if they merge) seek to dissolve their relationship with a would-be competitor and reduce capacity at the same time?

The Midex and Frontier business models rely on little or no strong competition unless they drastically reduce their costs, to unreasonably (and unsustainably) low levels.

Bedford is about to learn that mastering Guitar Hero doesn't qualify you for induction into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame.

 

[Colonel Savage]

We agree it's a cut throat market, I just didn't understand the Indy analogy.

 

[USMC319]

The Midex and Frontier business models rely on little or no strong competition unless they drastically reduce their costs, to unreasonably (and unsustainably) low levels. QUOTE]

Bird,
I don't know much about the Midex business model other than it is being shi!tcanned in preference to one that might work and become profitable.

Including Frontier in your above statement is absurd. In Frontier's case, they are operating in one of the most competitive environments in the airline world, at one of the highest cost airports in the country. Southwest dumped major capacity into Frontier's market in an effort to kill them. It didn't work. According to the analyists WN is losing their ass in Denver and Frontier has been profitable on both a net basis and an operating basis for all of 2009. Sure RAH will be looking to contain costs, but with Frontier they have a high quality operator with lower CASMs than any other similar operator (sans Tranny, with cheap ATL) certainly lower than the RJ operations of the other RAH subsidiaries. So why isn't that sustainable?

 

[Deadalus]

Hmmm concerned about longevity. Is that not an odd stance for a westie. I'm not even a player and that strikes me as an odd statement.

No, not really. Time on property is not the same as DOH. The east guys wanted pilots that spent most of their time at Airways on Furlough going ahead of senior AW pilots. You know what I'm tired of explaining this. All those people on the sidelines that don't know the facts or don't understand them, or think you're smarter than a distinguished judge and panel of senior pilots just keep your pieholes shut.

 

[deadstick]

Bedford is about to learn that mastering Guitar Hero doesn't qualify you for induction into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame.

Damn. Now THAT is funny.

 

[Cornelius]

Roughneck, you are a tool.

Frontier is not going to lose airbuses.

 

[reepicheep]

No, not really. Time on property is not the same as DOH. The east guys wanted pilots that spent most of their time at Airways on Furlough going ahead of senior AW pilots. You know what I'm tired of explaining this. All those people on the sidelines that don't know the facts or don't understand them, or think you're smarter than a distinguished judge and panel of senior pilots just keep your pieholes shut.

Comes another merger and it'll be the same. "I was flying NDB approaches in snowstorms in Allentown while some guy senior to me was in grade school." The east still don't get it - the enemy isn't Nicolau, the west, or ALPA. It's their own airline's 20-year implosion. The next list will look a lot like this one did.

 

[FL250]

FEDEX is looking to buy the 190's

 

[Minimaniac]

I know everyone assumes that RAH will be getting the 10 Airways 190's, but let me offer up this one bit of information. A recent bulletin to our manuals says that SOME of our soon-to-be-arriving 190's have IFE (in flight entertainment) units installed in the aft cargo area. While I doubt the IFE will be operational, I think this indicates that the 190's coming to RAH are likely not coming from Airways, which does not have IFE installed.

I don't doubt that Bedford would buy the Airways 190's if they came at a good price. He has made cash available to Airways multiple times in the past, sometimes in exchange for assets, sometimes not. I do think that Bedford has found a source for his immediate 190 needs without the US Airways sale, but he would not pass up an acquisition opportunity IF their is a need for additional 190's.

The reason Airways is getting rod of the 190's and not another fleet type is the CBA language guaranteeing minimum fleet size. I wonder, if Airways could get rid of 10 aircraft of any fleet type, which they would choose to lose.

 

[starchkr]

I know everyone assumes that RAH will be getting the 10 Airways 190's, but let me offer up this one bit of information. A recent bulletin to our manuals says that SOME of our soon-to-be-arriving 190's have IFE (in flight entertainment) units installed in the aft cargo area. While I doubt the IFE will be operational, I think this indicates that the 190's coming to RAH are likely not coming from Airways, which does not have IFE installed.

I don't doubt that Bedford would buy the Airways 190's if they came at a good price. He has made cash available to Airways multiple times in the past, sometimes in exchange for assets, sometimes not. I do think that Bedford has found a source for his immediate 190 needs without the US Airways sale, but he would not pass up an acquisition opportunity IF their is a need for additional 190's.

The reason Airways is getting rod of the 190's and not another fleet type is the CBA language guaranteeing minimum fleet size. I wonder, if Airways could get rid of 10 aircraft of any fleet type, which they would choose to lose.

This may be a good point, but i don't think the lack of IFE in the birds the way they currently are makes a difference. Our buses do not have it direct from the factory either, we send all birds down to MCO (i'm pretty sure thats where it is) to go through the IFE install process with our IFE provider. So maybe RAH buys US birds and sends them to MCO for IFE... a possibility at least.

Bringupthebird...I'm glad USMC already schooled you on the facts pertaining to F9 and it's "lack of strong competition." You obviously know nothing about F9 and the environment in which we currently operate.

Also, as far as the dissolving the relationships with the current feed partners goes, i thought it has already been established that BB discussed the transaction of purchasing F9 with his feed airlines and they more or less gave their blessing.

 

[Bringupthebird]

Perhaps I've been "schooled" but the evidence remains that F9 could compete against a wounded UA, but ran into major problems when WN arrived with just a smattering of flights. F9 dithered with what type of fleet they wanted and then who would provide regional feed (which, for an airline dependant on low costs, is contrary to their primary requirement). F9 made a series of missteps in fleet and strategy and got behind the cost "power curve" unable to make the changes necesary to reduce costs to where they needed to be. Hence BK.

I am actually a fan of F9, but I can't ignore the errors that got them whee they are, nor should the pilots pretend there is an alternate reality out there if they just will it to be so.

If insanity truly is doing the same thing over and over again expecting a different result, then Bedford either is unaware of Independence and ExpressJet or he's denying his own insanity and those who willingly follow him.

 

[AutoBus]

Why? If you are alluding to the Nicolau award and seniority integration, I wholeheartedly support pilots being paid at their longevity rate and bidding what their relative seniority can buy them. If they were at the bottom of the old USAirways list or America West list, they should be at the bottom of the combined list. Middles with middles and tops with tops. If they were on furlough, they should be put after all active pilots.

Makes total sense to me

 

[starchkr]

Perhaps I've been "schooled" but the evidence remains that F9 could compete against a wounded UA, but ran into major problems when WN arrived with just a smattering of flights. F9 dithered with what type of fleet they wanted and then who would provide regional feed (which, for an airline dependant on low costs, is contrary to their primary requirement). F9 made a series of missteps in fleet and strategy and got behind the cost "power curve" unable to make the changes necesary to reduce costs to where they needed to be. Hence BK.

I am actually a fan of F9, but I can't ignore the errors that got them whee they are, nor should the pilots pretend there is an alternate reality out there if they just will it to be so.

If insanity truly is doing the same thing over and over again expecting a different result, then Bedford either is unaware of Independence and ExpressJet or he's denying his own insanity and those who willingly follow him.

I still don't understand your thoughts on "strong" competition. You say that we competed against a "wounded" UA...but to my knowledge, we have been around for 15+ years now, does that mean from day one UA was wounded and no longer "strong" competition? Sure SWA came in and it seemed as though our operation started to head towards major problems. I seem to remember that just after SWA came into DEN it was written that the end of F9 was upon us. Well, they tried to kill us and they failed. Sure we had to file BK, but that had nothing to do with SWA or other competition. Our BK was preceeded by oil skyrocketing and the consumer no longer wanting to travel as much due to a downturn in the economy...not to mention the final straw know as First Data and their newly required holdback. The F9 fleet was well established by the time SWA came into DEN, the transition to the bus was done at least a year before that happened. Feed, sure, we had regional feed by Horizon for a long time, including years before SWA came to town. Yes, SWA tried to harm us, and maybe they did a little, but it has been shown that overall, F9 did not lose any market share the entire time SWA has been in town...now UA's market share, that's another story. F9 is a profitable carrier, and now that we are out of BK and no longer have to pay 7+ million every month in BK fees, i am sure our profits will look much better from this point forward.

I'm pretty sure that this is not another Indy air...as far as Expressjet, i don't know their story so i can't comment. We have established, profitable, feed in the RAH system, that will stay around for many years. We have F9 who is a profitable carrier and looking stronger by the day. I think with those two combined we "could" be a good thing. I never will sit here and say that we will be around forever and that we will take over the world, i'll leave that to the SWA guys, but i believe that this is a good thing we have going.