Mesaba question

[Cargoboy]

What is happening at Mesaba. Are the pilots going to get there new contract or do they feel a strike looming on the horizon. Being from the midwest I was always thinking of Mesaba as a good place for a 121 start. Now it seems they are spiraling around the drain. I understand that Pinnacle is picking up a lot of there ( or should be there planes) and some routes, but I can't imagine that Northwest woudl want Mesaba out since they still have such a controlling interest in Mesaba. Is there hope for these pilots and the pay scale. I understand they are pretty bad. Also, I heard that a lot of pilots are jumping ship to other airlines. With this all happening you would think this would make mgmt a little nervous and maybe try and buck up to the pilots and help them out. I would love to work for them but not in the condition they are in. My friend would love to get me in at Continental Express but who knows when hiring will start for them.
Any Mesaba pilots out there talk to me.
One more question. Let's say you are working for Mesaba and you get the Saab (pretty common I am sure) do any pilots switch to the RJ or does everyone just get the hell out of there and move on?
Thanks for any info.
Good luck to you Mesaba pilots and your contract. Foley......doesn't he have enough money?

 

[av8br]

CB,

Once upon a time Mesaba was a good place to work from what little I know. I was hired there in July 2001 with a class date of Oct.1 2001. Only one problem though 9/11. My class was cancelled but i remained in the pool until last week. I recieved a call from them on my machine. At first I thought great maybe they need some pilots since so many have been leaving. But then I realized with the state there in that it had to bee something else. Well two days later I got ahold of them and they wanted to confirm my address to send a certified letter to me and that they are recinding all offers of employment to all of us in the pool. I think there was about 20 of us or so. Got my letter yesterday. They said the earliest they could forsee any hiring would be late 2004.
Seems like a sinking ship, I wish all the best to those there and hope things turn around. Like you I am from the midwest and was really looking forward to mesaba. I have been sending resumes ever since spring 2002 and have yet to get an interview. I will keep plugging away though, Good luck to you.

 

[HAZ-MAT]

The past few days i've been behind an Avro-RJ on the taxi here in MEM, and they've been going unreasionably slow. I'm wondering if thats intentional, or if they have a long taxi checklist to do, or takes a while to fire up the other 3 engines.

 

[Cargoboy]

av8br

Not sure if this rings a bell but I have been talking with a Scott Lyndsey out there in there HR dept, my god like early 2001. I think he has moved on to bigger and better, but he said he wanted a res from me and I told him I was working on getting the required 75 hours in a three months since I was instructing and didnt' have my 135 job I do now. Also I was getting married in late summer and after the wedding I was set and ready to send it in. Then 9/11. Took me right out of the running right there. But on the lighter side I am sure I woudl of been furloughed if I had actaully gotten the job.
Good luck to ya and like you I am sending those resumes as well. Thanks for the info. I know now if they ever do hire it is going to be a long while before it happens.

 

[ERJpusher]

I have two friends that fly (flew) for Mesaba. One started early 2001 and is 3 spots from the bottom. The other finished class in August 2001 and was furloughed about a month ago along with 100 other pilots. Things are looking dismal there. The acquisition of Big Sky didn't seem to help matters, either.

 

[T-handle]

Intentional?!? No way, we'd NEVER do that The company wants us to operate by the book, so we are. We're not rushing, just taxiing in accordance with FARs, AIM and company manuals. What's the rush? Sorry, the Avro is a little chubby......

ALPA national just pledged $2 million in support of our contract negotiations. The sh!t is going down by the end of this year. We're just waiting patiently for the mediator to release us....... then we'll release the hounds!!!!!

We lose leverage every month (since summer of 2001 when PCL came back to MSP and DTW) when 2 CRJs/month arrive in Pinnacle colors and replace our Saabs. Northwest better hurry and mirror all of the Mesaba routes, otherwise they will still lose money and cities if we strike.

Look us up when we get a new contract unless Bigsky hasn't taken over by then. Don't get bent out of shape because we're the doghouse place to work. EVERY airline goes through this situation. I can name plenty of other regionals that were doghouses just a few years ago. Now they're the top places to work. It's a cycle. Just part of the "business".......

 

[avrodriverj85]

HAZMAT

The after-start and before- takeoff checklist isn't any longer than any other aircraft out flying. Also, we start all 4 engines during pushback from the gate prior to entering the taxiway. Was there someone ahead of the Avro, like a DC9 or an Airbus? Sometimes those guys taxi slow. But. don't jump to conclusions that we are in a work slow-down. The AIM says to taxi at a brisk walk, right?

The latest update on the negotiations is that it is a slow process. NWA continues to whipsaw Pinnacle and Mesaba against one another. That's ok, with the pilot group over here, the feeling is, is that they will lose in the long run. They have both NWA and Pinnacle opening contract talks late this year or early next. But our pilots remain strong and we will not be bullied around by management or anyone else. We are prepared to strike if we need to. AND we WILL.

 

[Cargoboy]

That is what my friend told me at Cont. Exp. Great place to work now but give a few years and all of that could change. Def. a cycle that is why I don't want to count out Mesaba.
Did you start out in the Avro? Still trying to find out if you can transition if you stick around in there. I assume you can but I hate to use that word ASSUME.
I am crossing my fingers for you guys believe me.
Unleash Unleash!

I'd piss on a spark plug if I thought it could help!

 

[Cargoboy]

Hey isn't there a sub paragraph in the AIM after the....you should taxi at a brisk walk......unless you are flying cargo for a co. that doesn't care about you or the plane and only your cargo?
thought I read that somewhere or was it just the co. I work for saying that I can't remember.

 

[ERJpusher]

Last spring Northwest went to the union and inquired about payscales because they were interested in assuming all the Avros ( staffing them with mainline pilots) and reconfiguring them for 100 seats. The union replied that DC-9 pay would be expected. Since then, I haven't seen or heard anything. Any new news on that?

Also, one of my friends started at Mesaba on the jet and is still on the jet. I know that 2 years ago, they were requiring 5000TT to upgrade to jet captain.

 

[Cargoboy]

So all I need is another 2500TT more hours and I should be set. Not a problem

Actually just trying to see if any FO's actually started out on the Avro., or if you have to transition to one.

 

[cl-65link]

Cargoboy, the planes are not Mesaba's or Pinnacle's, they belong to NW

 

[flyn96]

Yea things aren't to hot at XJ, low moral, losing routes. All Fo's are seat locked until upgrade and they share the same payscale. Unless there is a reduction of a fleet (ie wer're retiring saabs) then you can bid to the Jet, unless they furlough your ass before then. We will end up on strike, that is about 99.99999999% done. Thats ok cause most Fo's with ALPA strike benefits and unempoyment will make almost as much as they do while working. Give it a few years and Mesaba will once again be the place to work. Right now Comair is the place to be, but guess what their growth is going to slump eventually. The good thing about Mesaba is that we are last large regional to grown and go all jet. Thats assuming those ass wipers at Big Sky don't do it for us.

Its time to stop the race to bottom for the cheapest pilots and cheap airlines. Otherwise all that money you spent on your education is going to get you no where. Hope you think RJ's are coool cause your gonna fly them for the rest of your career.

 

[T-handle]

cargoboy

When Mesaba was hiring they hired FOs for the Saab AND Avro. It was based on whatever they needed at the time. But "some" Avro FOs will have you believe that they were handpicked to fly the Avro because they had the flight time and flew the interview sim. perfect.

Anyway, since the Avro is very senior, very few Avro FOs upgraded into the Avro because it was at least 3, sometimes 4 years before holding Avro Captain. So it was common for Avro FOs to upgrade into the Saab. I think to those few high and mighty Avro FOs it was a "downgrade", almost an insult.

It's a guaranteed good laugh listening to some of the AVRO FOs around the crew room or employee bus. "Yep.. there I was at FL330.... doing .66 with 4 engines, watching all of the other traffic blow by us..."

 

[Cargoboy]

Cargoboy, the planes are not Mesaba's or Pinnacle's, they belong to NW

I understand that. They are leased from NW if I am correct. that is why NW loves to pit the two against each other and rake the money from them. good busines decision on NW end. bummer for the pilots and the payscales and routes.

 

[Cargoboy]

thanks T-handle.
I thought it might be something like that.

 

[avrodriverj85]

Hey T-Handle

You mean we weren't "hand-picked"? That's what they told me in the interview. LOL Besides, we are normally doing Mach .73 when everyone else is blowing by us. But, who cares we get paid by the minute, right? At least I don't have Saab-ass at the end of a 4 day trip. LOL.

 

[T-handle]

yea Saab a$$ sucks after just one day.

 

[Rook]

Hey Mesaba bros and sistas,

We at Pinnacle are supporting you guys 100%. I walked with you guys in DTW and will walk again when the next picket comes. The whole whipsaw tactic sucks and I won't even get into the Big Sky debacle. But just know that we other 'Linkers are hoping you guys get what you deserve.

Rook(keeping the beer cold)
Pinnacle PR*CK
600' AGL
Autopilot on.
'WHEW!'

 

[Simon Says]

Sorry Mesaba 2425,

Its my turn to bash you for trying to entice a fight. For everyone that doesn't know, this guy is not a Mesaba Pilot. He is a union busting pawn for the company. His posts are usually Flame Bait.

The Mesaba Pilots are over 98% unified on a strike. We are not out to sink the company, but we are out for a fair contract. We conceeded a contract in 1998 to help the company to grow (which also helped us) and with the concessions we were told by the company that we would get an industry leading contract in 2002. Now is the time to reap our rewards for those concessions and the company doesn't know what we are talking about.

To enrage us more the company tells us that we need to save money anywhere we can, and then turns around and gives our CEO a 36% raise! Soon after that our holdings company goes out and buys Big Sky airlines to whipsaw us with. We used to be a a big family here at Mesaba, but it has turned into an us against them philosophy.

Mesaba 2425 you are dead wrong thinking that we will not strike.

 

[WrightAvia]

whatever became of the 146 IP that

quit Mesaba for a confirmed class date at Northwest Airlines, only to have that class cancel post 9/11, leaving him jobless for a while? I heard from D*nny Ch*pm*n (an ex RJ85 fo)now over at FDX, that 146 instructor pilot got back in at Mesaba with some union finangling...I even saw him taxing as capt in one of the RJ85's last year at MEM. Was this IP able to get back in as an RJ85 captain with his OLD seniority number or did he have to take a seniority number at the bottom of the pile?

(sorry, it's a little off subject, but I had to ask)

 

[othello]

Mesaba2425,
I don't know where and whom you fly with but every single pilot that I have flown with over the last 3-4 month thinks we we'll have to strike to get what we where prommised in 96 and I feel we deserve. That is a contract on par with the other top regionals.

An AirWisconson RJ 85 2ed year FO is making 42$ an hr while a 2ed yr Mesaba FO on the same equipment flying in the same region of the country is payed 24$ hr to do the same job. It's time for things to change.

Pilots around here are angry and will do what ever it takes to get a new fair contract.

 

[Simon Says]

2425,

We will see won't we.

 

[avrodriver]

I posteds this elsewhere as well but was curious if anyone was going to challenge my reasoning:

I am not excited to be at the regional level right
now and to be moving to another brings absolutely no security. I think we
will have a new contract by year end. But I do not believe things will be
changing over night, if we get the jets.....anyone thinking things will move
quickly is dreaming. I am 266 numbers away from being the last guy on
reserve as a Saab Cpt.........that number is not getting smaller, it's
getting bigger. The first NW orders that have not been assigned to a
carrier can be delivered in late 2004/early 2005, even a very modest
delivery rate of two airplanes a month (what 5 cpt's an airplane) means
about 10 guys upgrading a month so about 2 years or so, and that's from
first delivery........and that's to be the last reserve captain on a
Saab. I am over 2 years deep already, the most optimistic thing that can happen (this is totally ignoring the fact that Big Sky may still be a player) is if jets start arriving a year and a half from now. Then we wait the two more years for our turn to upgrade and where are we??? A six year veteran with 10 days off (ok maybe 11 or 12 with a new contract), sitting last bottom bitch on reserve in a Saab in Memphis. That fact plus Big Sky is what is making me leave, they bought Big Sky
for a reason, I hope that reason doesn't end up screwing Mesaba pilots, but
it is a very real fact that no one has been able to offer me comfort about.
I think Mesaba will get jets, but who is to say it is going to be in the
near future. Big Sky could easily get the next batch while we continue NW's new mission for us which was already spelled out by making Express all jet, We will continue to be the home of all the Saabs until the day Northwest decides that they do not want them in their fleet, there is no rush to get rid of B models, but when they finally did want to, then they could give us the jets .......i could go all
day. I just wish things didn't have to be this hard. =)-AD

 

[Hollywood]

what do you care? Are you looking for a date? HA!

 

[Cargoboy]

Avrodriver

Very interesting. Go on and elaborate if you can. Me being in the position to move from 135 to 121, I often wonder if waiting another 6 months to a year wouldn't be the best thing to do. Heard if you don't have a letter of rec. from the airline you are trying to get into you can have a longer wait for that position. But like you said, The number you are at (which would be dead last for me if I were lucky enough to get an offer) is rather scary with all of the furloughs and who knows what is going on out there that is our economy right now. Currently I am the senior pilot and can pick my schedule. Is a risk at this time worth it? I could easily (with my luck) see my myself get the furlough and really hurt my family. Not to say that you shouldn't expect at least once in your life to get a furough but right now it seems a lot easier with all of the changes going on on the industry and contract negotiations.
Just weighing out my options and trying to make the smartest decision for me career wise and financial wise.
Thanks for the input there.
Hope I made sense here.

 

[Metropilot]

Remember, Mesaba Airlines is tied to Northwest only...by contract. Mesaba Airlines cant fly anything else.

Have you heard of the RJ bids coming from Mesaba for UAL routes during the restructure? HHHmmmmm Well it sure isnt going to be for Mesaba Air. Your hands are tied.

Remember the ALPA scope clause between NWA and Mesaba?
HHHmmmm. That is your union.

ALPA looks out for number one.

 

[SilentDave]

Big Sky

Latest rumors are that we will have Dash 8's as soon as possible and RJ's by years end if not sooner. No mention yet of retiring our beloved Metros

 

[Mayday911]

So, word is that Big Sky is going to be acquiring Dash 8s in the near future!!

Who is getting sold out so that Big Sky's pilots get to fly Dash 8s?Mesaba...no wait that already happenned. Enjoy the RJs.

Mayday.

 

[Simon Says]

Silent Dave,

My guess is that the Dash 8 your hearing could turn into Saabs. (that Mesaba is retiring.) Any truth to the rumor that A model Saabs showing up in Billings?