Mesaba/Pinnacle/Champion

[PCL_128]

You forgot to tell him that his rookie 3500 hour a$$ wouldn't have being a Captain as fast as he did here in any other place.
All this rookie Generation Xr. do is whine

A troubling attitude from a checkairman at a company that is filled with 3000-hour Captains and 500-hour First Officers.

 

[dondk]

You hate your job so much, I hope you move on soon. You emit so much negative energy. We can always complain about something no matter where you are. Talk to some folks in Colgan, Mesa, even 'better' regional airline pilots complain about a lot of things.

At Pinnacle, people who have been on line barely 6 months are getting 14 days off line. People who have been on line barely 1 year are getting 16 days off. My friend who has been at ASA for well over a year is getting 10 days off buildup/reserve line.

Yes, our contract needs to get better, but I sure don't think that we have it sooooo bad my life is miserable. It's about your attitude.

I don't know how long you have been at 9E, but the increase in days off is a direct result in lack of staffing. Ask how many of those 14-16 day line holders are extended or junior assigned, ask how may actual days off they get. I know plently of pilots who have been here for 6 months, I don't know of 1 of them that gets 14 days of regualrly. It is also dependant if you commute or live in domicile. Live in Domicile it is not too bad, if you commute subtract 2-6 days off from my guide below

As a general rule of thumb and this is from 5 years at this joint.

1st year... 10-12 days off
2nd year... 12-14 days (or when you pass the 50% mark for your domicile)
3rd year... 14+ days off
max days off has been 22 and that was 2 years ago, normal max days off is 18-20 and that usually goes to the FO's with 4+ years and CA'S with 10+ years

A 5 year CA depending on domicile averages 14 days off.

also back in 2002-2003, reserve went out 14 months, attrition right now is the ONLY reason reserve is 2-4 months.

 

[Dumb Pilot]

A troubling attitude from a checkairman at a company that is filled with 3000-hour Captains and 500-hour First Officers.

Not as troubling as you slinging mud at the company that gave you the opportunity that you wouldn't have gotten anywhere else any chance you get. We have enough with the PCL haters lurking to have to deal with enemies from within.
Stop whining, direct your concerns to the negotiating committee or quit

 

[Charmin]

Not as troubling as you slinging mud at the company that gave you the opportunity that you wouldn't have gotten anywhere else any chance you get. We have enough with the PCL haters lurking to have to deal with enemies from within.
Stop whining, direct your concerns to the negotiating committee or quit

Why you getting all whipped up...

 

[Dumb Pilot]

I don't know how long you have been at 9E, but the increase in days off is a direct result in lack of staffing. Ask how many of those 14-16 day line holders are extended or junior assigned, ask how may actual days off they get.

As a general rule of thumb and this is from 5 years at this joint.

1st year... 10-12 days off
2nd year... 12-14 days (or when you pass the 50% mark for your domicile)
3rd year... 14+ days off
max days off has been 22 and that was 2 years ago, normal max days off is 18-20 and that usually goes to the FO's with 4+ years and CA'S with 10+ years

You know I love you Bro!

But explain to me how those averages of days off are a bad thing. Are they junior manning and extending people once in a while? Of course, but this is happening at AA, NWA, United and just about every other gig there is out there. It is an industry wide problem that they are running with minimum crews and ramp personnel and everything else.

But we are also working towards fixing a lot of this stuff aren't we? Sometimes you guys make it sound like is a living hell working here, and IT IS NOT. It's a regional job with highs and lows

 

[PCL_128]

Not as troubling as you slinging mud at the company that gave you the opportunity that you wouldn't have gotten anywhere else any chance you get. We have enough with the PCL haters lurking to have to deal with enemies from within.

This company didn't "give me" anything. I did my job and worked hard, and I upgraded when my seniority held it just as a pilot does at any other airline. I do my job and receive a paycheck. The company doesn't deserve any gratitude from me for that.

Perhaps you should ask yourself why it is that we have so many low-time pilots at this company? Do Comair, ASA, Eagle, etc... have so many 500-hour FOs and 3000-hour Captains? No? Then why is that? I think the answer is simple: this company has such massive turn-over because of the horrendous pay and working conditions that management has no choice but to replace the experienced pilots with low-timers. You say that things aren't that bad here, so please explain why we have the highest attrition of any large regional airline. We lost 25% of our FOs last year, mostly to other regional airlines. Do you think maybe that might be because things aren't as good as you and Mayoplane are saying? We average 20 FOs and 10 Captains a month leaving this airline. If things aren't so bad, then why is that? No other regional has such massive attrition. Mesaba is in dire times right now, and even their attrition is less than ours. Something is obviously wrong. Perhaps if management decided to treat us as valuable assets to the airline instead of expendable drones then you would be working with a more senior, experienced group of aviators. Just something to consider.

 

[Dumb Pilot]

This company didn't "give me" anything. I did my job and worked hard, and I upgraded when my seniority held it just as a pilot does at any other airline. I do my job and receive a paycheck. The company doesn't deserve any gratitude from me for that.

All that in what? Three years. And before that what? flight instructing? or perhaps daddy paid for the "Program"
No where else would you be a Captain as fast as you have done it here. If you consider working hard "Three years from program to Captain" you are the perfect example of a generation Xr. You haven't earned a damn thing Skippy, as much as you want to deny it PINNACLE made you.

 

[TurboAWD]

The Republic/Chq/SA pilots seem to have some pretty junior upgrades, as has mesa, and even ExpressJet is pretty junior these days.

Turbo

 

[PCL_128]

All that in what? Three years. And before that what? flight instructing? or perhaps daddy paid for the "Program"
No where else would you be a Captain as fast as you have done it here. If you consider working hard "Three years from program to Captain" you are the perfect example of a generation Xr. You haven't earned a dang thing Skippy, as much as you want to deny it PINNACLE made you.

Three years? Hardly. I took my first flying lesson over 10 years ago and I spent over 5 years in the right seat between two different airlines before upgrading. Still not that long in the grand scheme of things, but not 3 years either.

Also, your assumption that upgrades in 3 years are unheard of in this industry is incorrect as the previous poster said. Several pilots at ExpressJet upgraded at around the 2000-hour mark not too many years ago, so your 3500-hour phobia is nothing compared to there. Upgrades are currently under 4 years at CHQ, Colgan, PSA, TSA, Skyway, ExpressJet, Mesa, Skywest, and probably a few others. You're stuck in the past if you think 10-year upgrades are the norm in this industry.

 

[mayoplane]

Move on.

You say that things aren't that bad here, so please explain why we have the highest attrition of any large regional airline. We lost 25% of our FOs last year, mostly to other regional airlines. Do you think maybe that might be because things aren't as good as you and Mayoplane are saying? We average 20 FOs and 10 Captains a month leaving this airline. If things aren't so bad, then why is that? No other regional has such massive attrition. Mesaba is in dire times right now, and even their attrition is less than ours. Something is obviously wrong. Perhaps if management decided to treat us as valuable assets to the airline instead of expendable drones then you would be working with a more senior, experienced group of aviators. Just something to consider.

I wonder if you always speak like that in the cockpit. Do you ever think that your first officers may not want to have to hear you complain so much? You really sound like you hate your job with passion. Not trying to offend you, brother. Is there any way you can leave the company where you hate so much? You make it sound like you rather be doing something other than flying, than working for such a crappy company. All we can do is to fight for our rights for the next contract. Can you spend more energy on that and not so much on being so loud about how much you hate this place????

As for the days off. I am simply relaying what my first officers were saying about their schedule. Let's admit, that a lot of pilots are getting good schedule last month and this month. It's OK to admit something positive.

 

[PCL_128]

I wonder if you always speak like that in the cockpit. Do you ever think that your first officers may not want to have to hear you complain so much?

I think you'd find that most of my FOs enjoy flying with me. Besides, they're usually the ones to start complaining about the company since they all make poverty wages. I think you've been here so long that you've forgotten what it's like to make $18,000 a year and have 10 days off.

You really sound like you hate your job with passion. Not trying to offend you, brother. Is there any way you can leave the company where you hate so much? You make it sound like you rather be doing something other than flying, than working for such a crappy company.

Actually, I still enjoy the flying. I also enjoy working with the overwhelming majority of the pilots and FAs. It's the other BS from the company that I can't stand.

All we can do is to fight for our rights for the next contract. Can you spend more energy on that and not so much on being so loud about how much you hate this place????

I and the rest of the Association volunteers spend a huge amount of time working towards a better contract, not to mention trying our best to enforce the one we already have. However, that doesn't preclude me from trying to inform the new pilots out there on this board that this isn't a great place to work. I think it's only fair that the new guys hear the truth before coming here instead of just the HR kool-aid that they hear at the interview.

As for the days off. I am simply relaying what my first officers were saying about their schedule. Let's admit, that a lot of pilots are getting good schedule last month and this month. It's OK to admit something positive.

Am I correct in assuming that you are based in MEM and that most of your FOs live in domicile? If that's the case, then yes, the schedules wouldn't be that bad. For the pilots that commute however (the vast majority of the pilots in DTW), the pairings are so badly constructed that a 15 day-off line turns into a 9 day-off line when you factor in the commute. You can't just look at the days-off average, you have to look at the pairing construction also. A commutable 13 day-off line is better than an uncommutable 16 day-off line.

 

[blackbox]

I think mayopilot and pcl128 both need to calm down. You 2 are on total opposite ends of the spectrum. Pinnacle isnt that bad, but it isnt that good either.

The pay is horrible, and I was hoping with the new contract that things would get better, but with these crap proposals that management keeps throwing at us, I am kind of losing hope.

but at the same time, the crews are fun and once ur off reserve your life gets a lot better. And because the attrition is so riduculous, you may upgrade faster here than eslewhere. Living in base is huge, its definitely better to work here than commute to work at another regional.

 

[MACH-TUCK]

Im so sick of hearing people bitch and complain about working at PCL!! If you hate ur job, quit. Its that simple. It will make everybody happy.

 

[TurboAWD]

Im so sick of hearing people bitch and complain about working at PCL!! If you hate ur job, quit. Its that simple. It will make everybody happy.

Please. In the real world, it is not that easy.

There is nothing wrong with saying 9E sucks (it does), and trying to improve things. I suppose all the early Americans that didn't like British rule should have just moved, right?

PCL128 and others trying to improve things deserve thanks. Now for those that just bitch and don't even know their own contract, much less help to improve things, well they can shut it.

Turbo

 

[Napoleon TNT]

Please. In the real world, it is not that easy....

...I suppose all the early Americans that didn't like British rule should have just moved, right?

Turbo

Um, I think they did, and started a whole new country where they were more happy.

 

[DoinTime]

Um, I think they did, and started a whole new country where they were more happy.

History lesson....

The British monarchy once ruled the originating colonies that made up was to be America.

 

[xjcaptain]

History question......who did we fight in the revolutionary war?

 

[pipejockey]

Um, I think they did, and started a whole new country where they were more happy.

Um, it looks like somebody failed history!