Mesa must be stopped

[avrodriverj85]

Hey Boo -

Nice speech but you need to wake up and realize that this is bigger than ALPA. It all starts at the top of the chain and in my estimation it appears that ole' Duane at ALPA has his head up his ass and doesn't have a clue what to do with these alter-ego carriers and the like, much less the regionals.

(small-jets, ALPA Express) - all monikers to separate us further from mainline - all failed too.. we can only go as far as our representation and while they are supposed to work for us, we are also constantly brainwashed in believing that it is the other way around. "read flying the line - ALPA knows what it's doing" BLAH BLAH BLAH......

Well, the CEO's and their slick lawyers seem to have it figured out and they are running with the ball and getting rich doing it. They are also playing on weak pilot groups that are easily intimidated by bullys. ALPA National doesn't have a clue how to fight it, because they are still trying to figure out how to save mainline jobs and keep their coffers full.

Yeah, some say the RJDC is a bad idea. That's a group of pilots that finally said 'enough was enough' and decided to fight back. so I guess there are a few groups with a just cause.

 

[flyhard]

Hey Tuffguy,

Quit blaming your tuff times on Mesa. Like the earlier post explained, you do not see Southwest, Jblu, Airtran being called bottom feeders and all this other bull$hit for being low cost. Sounds like you need a little talk with your management to figure out how your airline is going to survive in this changing world. Either you get cheap or get the fuc* out. That is how I see it.

And by the way I have never worked for Mesa. Just get tired of reding the bull$hit excuses.

 

[avrodriverj85]

Hey FlyHard

Then don't read the posts if you get sick of reading them.

It's like porn - if it offends you then don't watch it, but don't ruin it for everyone else.

 

[stillaboo]

the rest of the pilot industry will be laughing with ZERO sympathy at your pathetic asses over at Mesa for the hole you've dug for yourselves.

Mesa managment, not the pilots, are the ones who signed up for all this growth. My understanding is the pilots at Mesa think they're short-staffed on all equipment right now. They don't even know what short-staffed is!

Mesa, in the last 2 weeks, has lost 5 jets and gained up to 130, plus 8 Dash 8-200's. And that's not even counting their growth with HP. With no pilots in the pipe-line, and short-staffed already . . . it will be interesting, for sure.

It boggles the mind how Mesa can get 130 jets and ACA can get none. Interestingly, virtually all Mesa FO's will upgrade due to this growth (if they can keep it), making the pilots who voted in the 'crappy Mesa contract' the highest paid pilot group in the regionals! Of course, there will be all those new FO's, but they didn't vote in the contract, they will merely work under it (and get "ZERO sympathy" from 'avrodriverj85'). The real kicker is many of the guys who are screaming bloody murder about the Mesa contract may eventually find themselves furloughed, and the only place hiring will be Mesa, forcing them to be the FO's who suffer under the contract.

Most would say that they would never work for those wages. We'll see. I'm betting that there will soon be a huge divide in the Mesa pilot group b/t those who voted in the contract (who are all sitting pretty in the left seat of an RJ) and those in the right seat or on the props.

U-N-I-T-Y may be much harder to find in the cockpit of a Mesa RJ then a popped breaker soon.

-Boo!

 

[avrodriverj85]

Boo

Ever heard of Newtons 3rd Law?

1980's stock market, 1990's Internet Bubble, etc... history is full of bubbles that eventually burst. Mesa will be no different.

 

[DDpaysoff]

Mesa who!

They are obviously not that big of a problem, I still don't recall ever seeing them. They can fly from Albequerque to Boise anyday. I do remember one of their check airmen kissing my ace on the hotel van one day, trying to get me over there. Onetuff guy, I wholeheartedly agree w/ you. However, everybody is stealing everybody's flying right now and everybody is getting some of their flying stolen right now. MGMT. has finally caught up. I will tell you this right now, and I hope you remember.........They will get what is coming to them. Just remember, there is always some lowlife who wants to be sitting in your warm seat. However, your picture is the Shizznit. And if they ever try to sit in my jumpseat, they will have to replace a crewmember for getting ill at the last moment. When I am cpt., the flight will go out on time w/o scab. You can talk shi%^ all day, but until you take a stand in real life you are just hiding behind a computer screen.

 

[stillaboo]

And if they ever try to sit in my jumpseat, they will have to replace a crewmember for getting ill at the last moment. When I am cpt., the flight will go out on time w/o scab. You can talk shi%^ all day, but until you take a stand in real life you are just hiding behind a computer screen.

Are you saying I'm talking "sh%^"? I don't get it. I agree with you, I think Mesa HAS bit off more than they can chew, and will ultimately kill themselves with growth (who woulda' thunk it?).

But if a Mesa guy wants to ride with you, you'll call in sick? And once you're a captain you'll call them 'scabs'?

Please do not label people as scabs unless they are. The word scab is not something we professionals use lightly. I'd hesitate even calling Freedom and Republic guys scabs.

Pilots need to work together. Refusing a jumpseat to a pilot b/c he might have once voted for a contract that gave him a smaller raise then you think he should have deserved . . . I hope you can see how rediculous this is.

The jumpseat is not a weapon! Use it as one and you will undermine much more than anything you might think Mesa has done in your wildest dreams.

We all need to work together to achieve small gains in the industry, like TSA refusing concessions to Mesa's wage level. Follow their lead. Many small gains over time will be much more effective in achieving a better lifestyle for all pilots than argueing about who screwed who while managment wage collusion slowly undermines us all.

-Boo!

 

[Dieterly]

Commuter pukes...

Six years ago I left the commuters, guess things hasn't changed a bit...

By the way, how come you are not knocking Commuters like ASA, ACA, or Comair when they are takin over mainline flying for a fraction of pay/benefits compared to DL?

 

[jetdriven]

Hey Jetdriven

With comments like that you are no different than these greedy CEO's that are running this countrys airlines into the ground.

Enjoy the growth while you have it because one day it will come crashing down around you and the rest of the pilot industry will be laughing with ZERO sympathy at your pathetic asses over at Mesa for the hole you've dug for yourselves. I just hope it happens sooner than later. Free economy - my ass! More like a cancer ... you mesa guys are screwing the rest of us in the back.

that's a pretty broad brush you paint with. But a typical idiotic coment from an Air Whiskey guy. I hear something ringing....Oh wait.., it is your wakeup call.

You "sellout"! You guys took concessions! You guys were gonna shut the focker down"?? Right??

 

[zkmayo]

Boo:

While you make some good points, I have to say that I am one ACA pilot who will never work at Mesa. And i know Im not alone. Your right though; Mesa pilots will be better paid than ACA's soon, only bc alot of us are going to be furloughed with a 100% pay cut. I dont hold their pilots at fault, I hold their management, Bain and UAL for the sorry state of affairs ACA is in right now. And now, UAL has signed TSA to a 10 yr deal, basically phasing out or at best severly limiting ACA's future in the UAX program.

UAL has made their bed with several of the bottom regionals (nothing against the pilots who work there). It appears that the "Portfolio" of regionals mentality is alive and well at the new UAL that the fellow in charge of UAX brought over from USExp and learned from the Comair strike. I do feel sorry for the deplorable work conditions Mesa/TSA work under though (bad pay, RSV guar 8 days off /mo). I just hope UAL is ready to reap what they sew. How quickly history is forgotten; UAL dumped Mesa in 97 and TSA about 1999.

I only hold out hope that ACA has an ace up the sleeve ( and also that JB,AT, or ATA come calling) and that this UAL wakeup call has happened now instead of when/if they liquidate (hope they dont for the sake of all those involved). ACA's heavy reliance on UAL for revenue has been the co's achilles heel for a long time.

 

[T-handle]

IGNORANCE MUST BE STOPPED!

Is it me or does every ALPA pilot hold every other pilot group up to a high standard? It's like if we don't get a "industry leading" contract you guys take a sh!t on us and threaten to deny jumpseats and disrupt someone's basic privelege to commute to/from work. And no I don't work for Mesa. I work for MesaBA. We've been in talks for over 2 years. If we don't "meet" or "raise the bar", are you going to come on here to flame every Mesaba pilot and deny jumpseats? To folks you don't even know? If our contract doesn't meet YOUR standards, that's your problem. It's OUR contract. We have our goals.

Look at XJ's situation. Saab retirements, NWA replacing our Saabs with Pinnacle CRJs. Hell, NWA is replacing their OWN flying with Pinnacle CRJs. Does that mean every XJ and NWA pilot should ban every 9E pilot cuz they're overlapping the same cities we fly to? And I could claim they have a substandard contract to go along with that but I won't. It's not their fault. Look at from a furloughed mainline's pilot point of view. Everyone is bickering and whining that the other company got more RJs than we did. Well boo f-n hoo! More RJs= less jobs for us at the mainline level. Don't be surprised to see 50% of U.S domestic flying done by some type of RJ. 50%! or even more. by 2020, there wil be nearly 8000 RJs flying worldwide. And we will be the who.res. So work on your leg stretches cuz there's going to be some serious bending over to do during the next 10 years.

It's all politics and it runs even at the ALPA level. ALPA doesn't really give a flying funk about "regional pilots." I didn't get into this business for ALPA. I didn't even know who the funk they were til I got on with Mesaba. I pay my dues, back my MEC/LEC 100% and will strike if voted for, but I could care less about ALPA or work when I'm off duty. ALPA, APA, SWAPA, etc. I have friends at Skywest (non-ALPA), but I don't give them sh!t for not being "on our side." People are in this business for their own reasons. And frankly, they don't give a **CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED** about your opinion of them.

Why do you think mainline pilots call RJs: Replacement Jets. We work for peanuts, even Comair with their leading contract still works for a fraction of what a mainline pilot would fly it for. It's a vicious economic cycle and Deregulation is to blame for our current situation. Hell, blame free enterprise for that matter. The lowest bidder will always have their way, unfortunately.

Careful what you wish for... you just might get it.

 

[stillaboo]

Re: IGNORANCE MUST BE STOPPED!

If we don't "meet" or "raise the bar", are you going to come on here to flame every Mesaba pilot and deny jumpseats?

Don't be silly . . . of course we will!

Look at XJ's situation. Saab retirements, NWA replacing our Saabs with Pinnacle CRJs. Hell, NWA is replacing their OWN flying with Pinnacle CRJs.

Look at Mesa's situation. 1900 retirements, HP replacing thier CRJ-200's with Freedom CRJ-700's. Hell, HP is replacing their OWN flying with Freedom CRJs.

Do I need to go any further for you to see what the mighty gods of the internet will think of your new contract?

Good luck with the negotiations, Mesaba. If you guys get a small raise, then you've done yourselves and the industry more good than any of this infighting ever has.

-Boo!

 

[jobear]

Fingered by fate

I try not to get involved in the finger pointing thing it's not my way, having said that I know that not matter how bad the industry gets I can and will find work outside aviation. I have two items that can not and will not be impinged upon by something as trivial as my JOB.
We as pilots have to have fisrt and foremost Principles; I can't work for someone I cannot respect. I will not work for someone who knowlingly is screwing over other pilots under the guise of it's just business call it skewed Morals or something. If you work for someone you don't like f_ck em quit, don't whine about money or the cost of getting there if you arrive only to realize you can't smile when you look back on your life.

If you or I do these things we wouldn't point our fingers and say he/she took my job.If you refuse to work for these people they would eventually wither on the vine. No recreminations. No one made you interview there did they?

Jobear
Rant Over

 

[Dieterly]

T-Handle,

How come there are only a few commuter guys that are able to see what's really going on? MESA is not the problem, you ALL are the problem!!!

 

[stillaboo]

you ALL are the problem!!!

Perhaps we lack good leadership, 'Dieterly'?

I think it should say " we ALL are the problem!!!". As long as those on the top of the heap divide the group (mainline and regional, or any other divisor you want to use), the bottom will continue to sink further.

We are all professional pilots.
-Boo!