Mesa Classes

[TopBugs]

Got the call today. HR said They think ground school classes will begin for the folks in the pool sometime in April.

 

[sonic340]

Congrats on getting ANY job these days, although I would definately think twice before joining the ranks over there. Most of us will be stuck at the regionals for quite a while. The great pilots at companies like Comair, Air Wisconsin and so on have made tremendous sacrifices not just to better their own contracts, but raise the bar for the entire regional industry. Hopefully the pilot group at Mesa realizes the dire consequences that will set all of us backwards 10 steps if they vote yes on this horrendous t.a. Best of luck.

 

[Beechnut]

Yeah, I'm thinking about writing a single post about how Mesa is a hinderance on the industry, but I'll save it. Any job these days is pretty good. Get some multi turbine time and then look for a good job. You're going to find life tougher at Mesa than at most other places.

S.

 

[TopBugs]

Any Flying job is better than Mr. Mom 24/7 for the past 15 months. Don't forget one has to stay fairly current or not ANY company will touch you.

 

[Beantown]

Got the call today. HR said They think ground school classes will begin for the folks in the pool sometime in April.

Brett, are they saying that they are going to start ground classes for Mesa or Freedumb in April? If it is Mesa, I am not sure how that will be possable considering they have 120 CCAir pilots to train plus any J4J guys that are needed to make things 50/50. If the contract passes it will happen on March 18th. That does not give them time to train all these people by the end of April. Not even close. Most CCAir guys/gals think they will all be called back by the end of August. Only after that can Mesa start hiring off the street. Either way, good luck with everything. -Bean

 

[TopBugs]

HR did not mention anything but ground schools will "hopefully begin in April." She did say the people already in the pool would go to training first. As far as CCAir is concerned, I haven't heard anyone bring it up at the interview or when I talked to HR today. I'm even sure what airframe(s) they flew. Maybe there would be some sort of shorten training course or transition training for those guys(I'm clueless). From my understanding during the interview, one J4J guy would be hired for every "off the street" Mesa new hire. If I interpeted this correctly, I don't see how this would delay tainining for an extended period of time for a guy like me. But I could be totally high. Please enlighten me if you have a better understanding of this stuff. I'm new in this area and haven't asks the questions I probably should have. Let me know If you have any other questions.

As for some of the others out there. I know everyone has different opinions on the aviation industry, but getting attitude over the Mesa contract if your a ComAir guy is a little hypocritical. After all, I could, and I stress COULD still have my Airline job right now if the people working for the regionals(RJ's) didn't work for so little. I'm not blaming anyone for what has taken place, but be careful about blaming others. I hope ultimately Capitolism will run its ever changing course and things will work out for all of us.

 

[Beantown]

As far as CCAir is concerned, I haven't heard anyone bring it up at the interview or when I talked to HR today.

Hey Brett. The CCAir angle is pretty simple. They were owned by Mesa until October when they were shut down. The new TA has scope that will bring the CCAir pilots in as furloughed pilots under a merged seniority list that was done in 1999 by both MEC's but not reconized until now by the company. B/C the CC pilots are considered furloughed, they will all have to be offered positions before Mesa can hire off the street. The one thing that you and other guys have on your side is that many of the CC guys are older and will be waiting for Capt slots. (b/c of the merged list, many CC guys are in the top half of the Mesa list and will be able to hold Capt slots with good seniority).

CCAir flew Dash 8's and Jetstreem 32's. They will all have to go through the entire ground school like any new hire.

I'm not sure if you have been hired yet or not but good luck. If you have any other questions feel free to PM me. -Bean

 

[Beechnut]

After all, I could, and I stress COULD still have my Airline job right now if the people working for the regionals(RJ's) didn't work for so little. I'm not blaming anyone for what has taken place, but be careful about blaming others.

And yet you're going off to work for Mesa. How ironic.

S.

 

[TopBugs]

whatever

 

[Beechnut]

Good answer!

Logic sucks when it works against you.

S.

 

[Future SNA]

As far as I've heard, the unions have told current Mesa pilots that it is okay to move over to Freedom, so I don't think it matters whether they are hiring for Mesa or Freedom. I do know that if you have a CRJ-700-900 type on your certificate, and are a Phoenix folk and would like to work for America West, no matter what time you went to Freedom, they won't hire you...ever.

 

[Mayday911]

The Mesa pilots didn't solve the Freedumb problem by negotiating this TA, they only increased the number of pilots at Freedumb by the exact number of pilots on the Mesa seniority list.

Mayday

 

[Mesagrunt]

Mayday,

If you think Mesa Pilots should be considered as low as Freedom pilots you may want to educate yourself.

The only reason Alpa is able to squash Freedom is because only 5% of the Mesa pilots went to Freedom. If this contract passes we will be buying scope. Buying it by taking it up the ass by management (without lube) and stomping out Freedom before it spreads. That and getting CCAir pilots back to work are the only things we are gaining by accepting this contract.


Yes, the contract sucks! Unfortuantly it is a bad time to be negotiating. I sat across from a 25 year ALPA lawyer who told us that this is the absolute best we will get. He has seen this before and says you have to know when to hold em. If this contract does not go through you will see J.O. stall more and more while Freedom grows and grows and grows! According to ALPA, if we were to try and strike the Republicans would probably step in and allow J.O. to stall even more. If this TA does not solve the Freedom problem then why is ALPA telling us to vote it in?

Freedom was a management tactic that worked. J.O. won this round. We have no leg to stand on. We will be back!

 

[WileE]

Enough blame to go around.

Don't forget to point those fingers at the America West pilots who could have made a stand against Freedom just like the USAir pilots did and not allow their flying to go to the non-union start up. Instead they helped screw the ALPA pilots at Mesa and CCAir by not standing up to their managment as well.

 

[mullet]

one J4J guy would be hired for every "off the street" Mesa new hire.

Hopefully with the J4J pilot's flying for Mesa I might be able to RELAX on my deadhead's now.

 

[the turtle]

whew....glad to know you'll be able to RELAX back there now. BTW, next time you ride stop by the cockpit, be sure to let me know you're back there, you know, just in case I see something I can't handle.

And another thing...you boys at PSA were THE FIRST to accept a concessonary contract, to the detriment of your "brothers" and ALG and PDT. spare us all your bulls@!t.

Your arrogance blows me away. But something tells me you've heard that before...

 

[ChinaClipper]

What would a WO guy know...

about flying jets????? Very professional, is Springer over?

 

[ChinaClipper]

And, is it too late..

to change my Vote to YES??????? Nahhh, can't do that........but I appreciate all the support out there.......

 

[mullet]

...you boys at PSA were THE FIRST to accept a concessonary contract, to the detriment of your "brothers" and ALG and PDT. spare us all your bulls@!t.
Your arrogance blows me away. But something tells me you've heard that before...

Now, now, sweetie, relax it will go in so much easier. Regarding the concessonary contract, you little brothers (PSA pilot group) did'nt even get to vote. Same bastards that passed are TA, are the one's to blame.
So fly away little starling!

 

[mullet]

disregard the last post, I thought I was responding to one of the pilots from ALG or PDT, just realised I'm corresponding with mesa thrash.
bye bye starling

 

[Jeepman]

Mayday,

If this contract passes we will be buying scope. Buying it by taking it up the ass by management (without lube) and stomping out Freedom before it spreads.

So if you pass this contract then basically you will be like the Free-dumb guys with the exception that you won't be stepping on your fellow Mesa pilots. Instead you'll be stepping on the rest of us.

COME ON STAND UP FOR YOURSELF.....FOR ALL OF US!!!

Is JO paying this ALPA lawyer? Or has JO promised you guys a big raise if you sign this. Look, I don't see how GW would step in and block you guys because it would disrupt service. I don't think it would be a problem for other airlines wih REAL contracts to step in and replace Mesa's flying. The only bad thing would be that you guys would have to leave Mesa & apply at SkyWest, ACA, ASA & Comair........is that really that bad?

 

[AirBoard]

Posted by Mesagrunt:

''If this contract does not go through you will see J.O. stall more and more while Freedom grows and grows and grows!

So basically what your saying is J.O. has won again. He's pitted low wages against an alter ego airline and you guys feel you have no other choices, great!

Freedumb grows and your wages suck OR Freedumb is stopped and ALL our wages will suck. There's some good flying out in the Northeast, I'll give you guys some crashpad info when the time comes......

BTW Good post Jeepman. The race is on and Mesa looks poised to take the lead!

 

[AirBoard]

you're probably making a lot of us want to vote yes just to spite you jerks. Heck, several of you are so eager to bash us that you seem to have convinced yourselves that the TA has already passed! I'm not gonna make a prediction, but have you ever heard of a self-fulfilling prophecy?

One thing to consider is that many of those complaining about your sub standard contract are those that bargained hard in past negotiations. Comair even spent 89 days on strike to raise the bar. We're just trying to protect ourselves and the industry from our hard fought concessions.

To vote in a sub standard contract would certainly hurt other airlines future contract negotiations. Don't think for a minute other airline's management won't bring up your contract when it comes to it. Makes us proud.

 

[Jeepman]

Hud,


First of all I'm not some wimp (I will refrain from using the same vulgarity), and second I am not here to bash Mesa pilots. I also don't think alot of other pilots are here to bash Mesa pilots as well. All we are saying is that what happens with your TA will affect ALL OF OUR LIVES & FAMILIES!!

As far as starting over, yes it's no fun to be at the bottom, but ask yourself this, wouldn't it be nice to get paid even if your flight gets cancelled? The 2nd year pay for RJ FO at SkyWest is $34.51 and if I read your proposed TA correctly you guys wouldn't make that for 5 years? SkyWest is currently in pay talks with our pilot association for 70 & 90 seat jets for the same pay just so that we can remain competetive & keep our jobs and feed our families! I don't think I will approve it, and I would not sign a TA just to spite other people. If you sign that TA just to spite people like me you spite the whole industry & thats not cool at all!

 

[KingAirKiddo]

Well, your company's willingness to lowball the entire industry has definitely affected me already and the TA hasn't even passed yet. Let's look at the timeline:

1. ACA is flying as a UAL carrier
2. UAL goes bankrupt, uh oh.
3. UAL seeks bid from carriers to provide UEX service.
4. Mesa and CHQ provide lowball bids.
5. UAL management tells existing carriers you need to cut your costs or else.
6. UAL does not reaffirm ACA's contract.
7. ACA cannot obtain financing for jets on order.
8. Due to non-delivery of expected aircraft, furloughs are imminent.
9. KingAirKiddo is probably going to be furloughed, according to a very recent memo from the CP.

I'd be really interested to hear from Mesa pilots how this is not the case. For all of you who voted no on the TA, thank you...I hope it doesn't pass. For those of you who voted yes, I'll be making more at Home Depot...enjoy that quick upgrade at my expense.

Later.

 

[Herman Bloom]

Right on there KingAirKiddo

This MESA thing is gonna screw all of us IF WE LET IT. I really hope our pilot group is ready to deal with this. I think it is.

I'm really sick of this "feed my family" bs. ALL of us know that...some of the folks on this board held out even when liquidation was threatened. But if the MESA pilots are unwilling to do it, then thats that I suppose. I, for one, would rather quit flying altogether than allow our contracts to be reduced to rubble.

Hope we get some better news soon.

 

[Concierj]

Kind of like Pay for Training.........

 

[AirBoard]

Right on there KingAirKiddo



I'm really sick of this "feed my family" bs. ALL of us know that...some of the folks on this board held out even when liquidation was threatened. But if the MESA pilots are unwilling to do it, then thats that I suppose. I, for one, would rather quit flying altogether than allow our contracts to be reduced to rubble.

Exactly! It's all relative anyway. If you lower the bar far enough it doesn't pay for me to fly anymore - especially as an FO. Eventually I'd make more in some other career and be home everynight , just not enjoying my career as much. Do Mesa pilots honestly feel they'l be happy 4-5 years down the road making those wages, especially once the industry has righted itself (which it will!)??? Try living in the Northeast on those Mesa wages - I don;t know how the BOS Chit-taco guys do it.

 

[Mesagrunt]

No one at Mesa wants this contract. The only reason people are voting yes is because of timing. You cannot compare Comair's negotiations with ours. It was a very very different time when they were negotiating.

Yes, JO did win if this goes through. This contract is terrible! However, our negotiating committee and ALPA national are telling us we need to go ahead and vote it in. We need to fight this fight another day. We need to step on Freedom while we still can. Unfortunately we will have to live with this crappy contract for a while. To me its worth it to see those Freedom losers pay.

 

[Jeepman]

Unfortunately we will have to live with this crappy contract for a while. To me its worth it to see those Freedom losers pay.

We will ALL pay if you agree to this TA!!!!

I don't think that there's room enough for all of us at Home Depot