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MEC Summary of Nicolau Remedy

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beagle pilot

Airline Pilot
Joined
Oct 11, 2003
Posts
110
Fellow American Eagle Pilots:

As you are all now aware, this morning we received Arbitrator Nicolau’s remedy award. We have spent the better part of today reviewing the award. While we strongly encourage you to read the award for
yourselves, we are now able to provide for you this initial bullet point summary:

1. 244 American Eagle pilots will transfer to AA with the following:
a. In determining their initial equipment, the Arbitrator’s opinion requires that their initial equipment be determined no differently than the transfers that had previously occurred under Letter 3.

b. Their initial pay scale will be determined by when they should have flowed to AA under Arbitrator Nicolau’s initial award (October 2009). For example, if the pilot should have transferred to AA in June of 2007 and actually transfers to AA in June of 2010, he will be placed on the 4th
pay step upon his arrival at AA.

c. Their A‐Fund vesting will begin based on when they should have transferred to AA under Arbitrator Nicolau’s initial award but their “time of service” for A‐Fund calculations won’t begin until they actually arrive at AA. When a pilot retires from AA, his A‐Fund benefit is determined by a calculation that includes his ‘final averaged earnings’ and his time of
service. There is also a vesting requirement in order to participate in the A‐Fund. Under the award, these pilots will receive retroactive credit for vesting, but not for time of service.

d. Upon transfer to AA, pilots will have their B‐Plan fund retroactively credited at 11% of 73 hours per month at MD‐80 First Officer rates of pay. The applicable rate of pay will begin at first step based on the date pilots would have transferred to AA under Arbitrator Nicolau’s original award and increase one pay step for each year thereafter.

e. Their sick bank will be adjusted to reflect AA’s higher accrual and higher cap. Therefore, pilots transferring to AA will transfer their sick bank hours and have additional hours to reflect the appropriate level of the sick bank had the pilot transferred to AA under Arbitrator Nicolau’s initial award.

f. Their vacation bank will be adjusted to reflect any higher accrual rate at AA had the pilot transferred to AA under Arbitrator Nicolau’s initial award.

2. To determine the 244 pilots who will receive the items listed in paragraph 1 above, the most senior 286 flow‐through pilots will be asked to decide whether or not they are willing to transfer to AA under these provisions. Once 244 out of the 286 have been identified, that will constitute the maximum number of pilots who will receive the transfer benefits listed in paragraph 1 above.

3. Once the 244 pilots from paragraph 2 have been identified, the most senior 35 will transfer to AA in June of 2010. AA may accomplish this transfer in one or two training classes, but must complete the transfer in the month of June.

4. Following the June transfer of the 35 most senior flow‐through pilots who accept transfer, AA will offer recall to all of the pilots furloughed on February 28, 2010.

5. Once the most junior AA pilot furloughed on February 28, 2010 has been offered recall, all flow‐through pilots will be permitted to transfer to AA in strict AA pilot seniority order, but only the most senior 244 who accept this transfer will be provided with the additional benefits identified
in paragraph 1 above.

6. Once AA has offered recall/transfer to all pilots on the AA pilot seniority list, including all Eagle flow‐through pilots, 1 out of every 2 new hire positions will be offered first to American Eagle pilots. American Eagle will not be required to release more than 20 pilots per month but is
required to make every effort to meet this ratio.

7. Once 824 Eagle pilots have transferred to AA under the provisions of paragraph 6 above, AA will not be obligated to transfer any additional pilots to AA.

8. The Arbitrator has ordered the affected parties to negotiate the specifics associated with accomplishing the transfer of 824 Eagle pilots to AA, noted in paragraph 6 above. We are fully aware that there are additional questions surrounding this award and we are diligently working to provide answers. We will post this bullet point letter on the ALPA.org website and update it with a working Q&A as soon as possible.

Thank you for your patience as we analyze this award and determine the answers to your questions.

Fraternally,

EGL‐MEC Vice Chairman
__________________
 
Am I reading this correctly? The 824 slots will be filled AFTER everyone goes back to AA who is currently on the street (1989 as I understand it), and after all the AE pilots with AA numbers (roughly 560) flow up.

So in other words, a total of nearly 1400 slots (824 + appox 560 AE guys with AA numbers already) at American will eventually be filled by current pilots from Eagle?

Some cursory math makes it look like this could potentially run downhill to AE pilots as junior as DOH around 2005-2006. I can't imagine lots of senior captains at AE going for this...I'd imagine more than a few of those slots might run downhill...

If I am in any way wrong please correct me!
 
Nah!! This is a crap remedy! We should flow more than 35 initially.. Where does this number come from..

It's an arbitration, not a negotiation. Agreed more should have been allowed to flow, but it's not a matter of choice or even negotiation.

Arbitrators often rule either by using "industry average", playing Solomon by splitting the baby or some combination thereof. Several Eagle pilots, myself included, speculated there'd be a token flow-through class as compensation for the breach of contract, but that most of the 244 would have to wait (again, with compensation) for their turn. Any remedy involving trading pain from one group to another was unlikely so it followed that there would be no furlough of AA pilots to make room for the 244 or that the company would have to "suffer" taking all 244 when they were in the midst of furloughing.

How he came up with 35 isn't known to me at this time, but the speculation of 25-50 token flow-thru's almost immediately with the rest to follow puts the number 35 in the proper ballpark.

One thing we must remember is that arbitrators (and other judges) don't just consider the one point of view. They must consider all points of view. In this case, Eagle's, AA's and the APA's in addition to ours. His job was to find a settlement which followed the contract and was in the best interests of all involved. It seems he accomplished his mission.

In some ways, determining whether a negotiation or arbitration was fair or not is like determining if a merger is fair or not. If one side is really happy and the other side is not, it wasn't done fairly. If all sides are a bit miffed, then it was done fairly. :beer:
 
Am I reading this correctly? The 824 slots will be filled AFTER everyone goes back to AA who is currently on the street (1989 as I understand it), and after all the AE pilots with AA numbers (roughly 560) flow up.
Correct. The 824 was payback for the "harm" done to all those who couldn't upgrade, transition, hold a line, etc due to the fact the contract was breached by the company and 244 pilots didn't flow over when they were supposed to flow.

Since you already understand the math about recalls, you should also understand it will take a few years to even get to the point where those 824 begin to leave for AA classes. Since the arbitration also allows the company to set a max of 20 per month, it could take 5 years to have all 824 class seats filled.
 
Beagle,

Thanks. Yeah, I figured it would be a at least few more years for all of this to happen. I suppose the remaining 824 slots are a light at the end of the tunnel for Eagle FOs and junior CAs. It will be interesting to see how it shakes out.

Would you further agree with my guess that these 824 slots could go as low as 05/06 hires? I'm sure lots of Eagle FOs are trying to figure out that very thing right now!
 
Would you further agree with my guess that these 824 slots could go as low as 05/06 hires? I'm sure lots of Eagle FOs are trying to figure out that very thing right now!
I haven't looked at the seniority list to compare.

Two available variables to consider are:

1) Time to captain restriction. Currently it's 10 years, but this could change and any change would likely increase the time for a bit. Any pilot who is 55 now and not part of the 244 won't flow. Any pilot who is at a seniority level which will him/her at 55 by the time their turn comes up won't be able to flow.

2) Age again. How likely is it that a pilot over 50 will give up a $100,000/year job to be stapled to the bottom of an airline seniority list at $35K/year? They'll lose $100K of income the first two years and it would take 8 years just to break even. This isn't counting going on reserve and commuting. How likely is it that a 45 year old with two college age kids would do it?

Of course, the higher the numbers of both 1 and 2 turn out, the more likely you'll see pilots hired in 2005 and 2006 becoming eligible to take one of the 824 seats.

BTW, remember, this all will happen when AA begins hiring. If this goes like last time, the 824 is a gimmee and Eagle only has to let 20 go per month. There is nothing to stop a pilot from applying to AA "through the front door" and take one of the other 50%+ seats in the class. There are dozens of Eagle pilots at AA who went over through the hiring process between 1997 and 2001. Every one of them was out of seniority order. :p
 
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I'm sure you all will be welcomed with open arms. Welcome to AA, hope you weren't that d.bag checkairman that hosed so many flowbacks, because your days are numbered.
By the way, The Time To Captain (TTC) has got to be around 15 years now.
 
So let me get this right. If someone is in the 244, say near the bottom of it. It may take several years for them to go to AA. However during those several year they are accruing pay, retirement, vacation, etc at AA's contract.
 
Just reread it. 35 go immediately. Then they recall the other 1700 pilots, then get to the rest of the 244.

Therefore these guys could be accruing benefits for 10 years.
 
Just reread it. 35 go immediately. Then they recall the other 1700 pilots, then get to the rest of the 244.

Therefore these guys could be accruing benefits for 10 years.

Could be, but more likely the remaining 244 will be accruing for about another year or two. Check page 16 again***. It only talks about those pilots furloughed last February, not all the furloughed pilots. The 244 will probably start leaving in 2 years and be gone in 3 years given no catastrophes. It's the non-244 FTs and other Eagle pilots who will have to wait about 5 years before beginning to flow.

***Page 16:
Following the aforesaid transfer, before any additional CJ Captains
are transferred, recalls to AA shall be administered in accordance with
the AA/APA Agreement based on the AA seniority list as of the date of
this Award until the most junior pilot furloughed on February 28, 2010
has been offered recall
.
Following that offer and recall, the remaining Eagle CJ Captains
with AA numbers who elect to transfer when and as future positions
become available and those AA pilots presently on furlough shall be
entitled to enter and re-enter active service at American in AA seniority
order.
 
Are these 824 going to be like the PIG guys at XJT? Preferential interview? Or do they actually have to be hired and put into class?

With this 1:2 language it could actually hurt you all. I wasnt around during our(XJT's) flow-through agreement, but I know guys who I fly with that said we had more guys hired monthly at CAL after the flow-through expired than were allowed when it was in place. I think the Compass guys are looking at their flow-through limitation of like 1:3 or something like that as a problem and wish it wasnt in there.
 
Are these 824 going to be like the PIG guys at XJT? Preferential interview? Or do they actually have to be hired and put into class?

With this 1:2 language it could actually hurt you all. I wasnt around during our(XJT's) flow-through agreement, but I know guys who I fly with that said we had more guys hired monthly at CAL after the flow-through expired than were allowed when it was in place. I think the Compass guys are looking at their flow-through limitation of like 1:3 or something like that as a problem and wish it wasnt in there.

Completely agree, flow-throughs never work as advertised. It seems like a complete waste of bargaining capital. XJT to Cal or ASA to Delta, both when hiring had huge numbers go over. More than any flow-through could compete with.
 
Could be, but more likely the remaining 244 will be accruing for about another year or two. Check page 16 again***. It only talks about those pilots furloughed last February, not all the furloughed pilots. The 244 will probably start leaving in 2 years and be gone in 3 years given no catastrophes. It's the non-244 FTs and other Eagle pilots who will have to wait about 5 years before beginning to flow.

***Page 16:

What was this arbitration concerning? What was the case in a nutshell?
 
Are these 824 going to be like the PIG guys at XJT? Preferential interview? Or do they actually have to be hired and put into class?

With this 1:2 language it could actually hurt you all.

Preferential hiring. We had 1:2 clause in Letter 3, but the language wasn't sufficient to enforce it. This arbitration is clear about the issue and states so in two places. Here is one of them:
from the Arbitration said:
The affected Parties are directed to enter into a
preferential hiring agreement pursuant to which
American, at the time hiring resumes, will offer to
824 Eagle Captains, including Eagle Rights
Captains, one of every two new hire positions in a
new hire class in order of Eagle seniority, subject
21
to the following limitation. Eagle is to make every
attempt to release a sufficient number of pilots to
meet the aforesaid ratio. It will not, however, be
required to release more than 20 pilots per month
if doing so would, in its judgment, create severe
operational difficulties.
Should any of the present day Eagle Captains
decline the above offered pilot position
opportunity, an Eagle pilot who becomes a
Captain after the date of this Award, shall have
the right to elect said opportunity in seniority
order until such time as 824 pilot positions have
been filled by Eagle Captains pursuant to this
paragraph.
Jurisdiction will be retained in the event there
is any dispute regarding the interpretation or
application of this Award.
 
What was this arbitration concerning? What was the case in a nutshell?

Resolving the issue of recall order in a mutual, but now expired, agreement between ALPA, APA and the two airlines regarding flow back and flow through of pilots between the two airlines.

There have been at least a half dozen grievances regarding this agreement. The agreement is called "Letter 3" by Eagle ALPA and "Supplement W" by APA.
 
Resolving the issue of recall order in a mutual, but now expired, agreement between ALPA, APA and the two airlines regarding flow back and flow through of pilots between the two airlines.

There have been at least a half dozen grievances regarding this agreement. The agreement is called "Letter 3" by Eagle ALPA and "Supplement W" by APA.

Thanks.
 
It's worth mentioning that, as part of the remedy, FTs get the opportunity to undo their election to flow. May 24 is the deadline for electing to keep thier number or surrender it, and that decision is irrevocable. 527 Eagle CAs with AA numbers. I'm not going to speculate how many of them will now choose to decline an AA opportunity, but the 244 in question are also the most senior, thus with the most to lose.
 
Some would say the most to gain.

Agreed. From the arbitration:
As stated, the 244 Eagle CJ Captains who choose to transfer to
American should have been at the Company earlier; the first on June 6,
2007, and the remainder on the July 3, 2007-March 18, 2009, class
dates at the pace measured by the class attendance of the remaining
243 TWA-LLC pilots. The retroactivity of the compensation and benefits
to be offered has been determined with those dates in mind.

In some respects, for those lower on the 244 list, the longer it takes for them to flow, the better. Within reason, of course. Also, the longer it takes, IMHO, the more likely they will flow too. Again, within reason.

Third year MD-80 FO pay is $90/hour. Given that the APA is very likely to see a nice pay bump (albeit at the cost of stagnation), I'd go over for that amount of money given the other benefits and QOL of the APA's Green Book.
 

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