Long range duty times question

[G100driver]

Another question on pre-positioning the crew. What is your cut off flying the crew first class/business vs coach?

 

[banned username 2]

Another question on pre-positioning the crew. What is your cut off flying the crew first class/business vs coach?

Our company policy is about 6 hours, anything further it is Business Class.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

Another question on pre-positioning the crew. What is your cut off flying the crew first class/business vs coach?

we only do business/first.

I would do a 75hr duty day myself before flying coach to hawaii or PANC- but thats just me!

dicking around about the extra $$$ to go business class to meet your GV is a bit absurd to me - but we all know how they think...

.

 

[empenage]

We dont carry a third crew member at all. If we are flying a 12 hour leg we will reposition a fresh crew down the road if the airplane keeps going. We get 12 hours on the ground in a hotel for all crossings etc.

As far as the airlines, we fly coach domestic and business or first class international. We stay in great hotels.

We fly to the Far East all the time, every month. Our trips start in Switzerland and go to Narita, Singapore, Beijing, Macau, etc. It's not uncommon to do a 14 day trip with the same crew with a different stop every other day.

It's not uncommon to make 3 round trips to Switzerland from MMU every week for a year either......

 

[G4G5]

Domestic, consisting of the greater 48 is coach

Everything else is business

 

[empenage]

Who carries a "Tech" with them on the International trips?

We dont. I have to over see all maint. on the road. The last was a 3 day windshield change in Beijing.

If you do need maint. on the road in the Pacific Rim try Jet Aviation out of Singapore. Ask for Graham. He's hard core.

 

[AA717driver]

Our techs double as FA's for the low maintainance pax. We're taking three pilots and a tech on our adventure next week.

Our SOP requrires us to ride in business if the flight is over 4 hours. Funny, we seem to be riding on SWA a lot lately... In November they did put us in business class on JFK-WAW--On LOT! What next? Aeroflot? TC

 

[empenage]

Be careful flying Aeroflot....

The last time I was in Domodedovo the pilots were on the other side of the road across from the terminal drinking Stellas. They should at least take thier Bar's off and put them in thier shirt pockets.

 

[G100driver]

Be careful flying Aeroflot....

The last time I was in Domodedovo the pilots were on the other side of the road across from the terminal drinking Stellas. They should at least take thier Bar's off and put them in thier shirt pockets.

That was Adam and Jimmy filming for the Man Show.

 

[empenage]

That was Adam and Jimmy filming for the Man Show.

Holy Pete. What an idea though.

I mean they're not trying to hide or anything.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

Who carries a "Tech" with them on the International trips?

We dont. I have to over see all maint. on the road. The last was a 3 day windshield change in Beijing.

If you do need maint. on the road in the Pacific Rim try Jet Aviation out of Singapore. Ask for Graham. He's hard core.

I cant see the need to carry a tech.....unless maybe Africa or some a$$ place like that...

everywhere else has tech support pretty avail for Gulf/Bomb/Falcon products from my experience....

 

[empenage]

I cant see the need to carry a tech.....unless maybe Africa or some a$$ place like that...

everywhere else has tech support pretty avail for Gulf/Bomb/Falcon products from my experience....

We go to those places. Plus we put put about 1200 hrs. a year on each Global. At Kodak we took a tech on all the international trips. It worked out great.

The duty times get very tiring though. After about 6 months to a year you get this deep down tired that you cant shake.

 

[G550Driver]

Thanks for all the advice and comments by people on this web site.

We ended up flying (via airlines) two pilots to PHNL. Then two guys flew the plane from KJAC to PHNL. The two guys positioned in PHNL flew 12+45 to WADD (Bali, Indonesia).

Great flight (Flew at M.83 the entire flight and landed with 3900lbs of fuel), never flew over so much water (about 12+40 of the 12+45 flight). Talking to SFO was different. They are WAY less formal than when you cross the Altantic.

Oh, Bali is awesome by the way. You know you are far from the U.S. when we have yet to meet anymore Americans.

 

[2000flyer]

For future reference,, Flight Safety Foundation published a guideline in February, 1997 called Principles and guidelines for Duty and Rest Scheduling in Corporate and Business Aviation." It deals with duty times during the "Window of Cercadian Low." That time is best estimated to be the hours between 0200 and 0600 for individuals adapted to a usual day-wake/night-sleep schedule.

Their recommendations for duty time are the following:

2-Pilots
OFF DUTY
Per 24-hour period: 12 hours
Per week: 48 continuous hours in 7-day peoriod following multiple duty periods in circadian low.
Other: 48 continuous hours on return home following duty periods across multiple time zones.

DUTY PERIOD
Per 24-hour period: 14 hours
Per week/monthly/annually: There is not sufficient scientific data to provide specific limitations in this area, nevertheless, maximum cumulative duty periods should be adjusted downward over increasing time frames.

FLIGHT TIME
Per 24-hour Period: 10 hours
Per week/monthly/annually: There is not sufficient scientific data to provide specific limitations in this area, nevertheless, maximum cumulative duty periods should be adjusted downward over increasing time frames.

NO TWO PILOT EXTENSIONS RECOMMENDED

3-pilots
OFF DUTY: 12 hours
Per week: same as above

DUTY PERIOD
Per 24-hour period: Reclining seat 18-hours. Supine bunk 20-hours.
Per week/month/year: same as above.

FLIGHT TIME
Per 24-hour period: 16 hours ** (having rested in reclining seat)
18 hours ** (have rested in supine bunk)

Per week/month/year: same as above.

**Each flight crew gets maximum sleep opportunity with a minimum four hours total; maximum two consecutive duty periods with 18 hour off duty.

Regards,

2000Flyer

 

[AA717driver]

We take a tech with us on those trips in part because most of the problems with the 550's (ours are early-build and have gremlins). The problems don't warrant a mechanic, just an occasional reseating of a card or two. And, the tech assists in the cabin.

We did LAX-Nagoya. One day in Nagoya then on to Shenzhen. Next day to Hanzhou. Next day Beijing. Next day Genoa AND Pisa. Next day Naples and Rome. Next day Luton. Next day EWR. Airline home because the principal had a meeting in NYC then on to the West Coast.

The Beijing-Genoa-Pisa day was tough. 18 hours of duty.

Just my .02.TC

 

[G550Driver]

We know about gremlins. We have 5002 and 5027.

We always take our mechanic with us (overseas). He watches movies, takes up space, drinks all the sodas, wrinkles up all our newspapers and raids all the goodies in the crew area. Just kidding, he is great addition to the crew when you're sitting in places like Bali for 10 days. Extra drinking buddy.

Plus he takes care of covers, general services, lav service, H2O service, Tips, and any other problems that pop up on the flight like "why can't I get this printer to work", "why won't the airshow work" and "hey tube 3 has a big RED X on it again".

 

[Jack Schitt]

and any other problems that pop up on the flight like "why can't I get this printer to work", "why won't the airshow work"

and then the mechanic says: "Well.....did you turn it ON???"

 

[AA717driver]

We know about gremlins. We have 5002 and 5027.

We always take our mechanic with us (overseas). He watches movies, takes up space, drinks all the sodas, wrinkles up all our newspapers and raids all the goodies in the crew area. Just kidding, he is great addition to the crew when you're sitting in places like Bali for 10 days. Extra drinking buddy.

Plus he takes care of covers, general services, lav service, H2O service, Tips, and any other problems that pop up on the flight like "why can't I get this printer to work", "why won't the airshow work" and "hey tube 3 has a big RED X on it again".

LOL! 5002!? You're a brave man! Now, we're finding that Cert B has screwed up even more things... They were right about never buying a serial number below 100.

Has your APU siezed yet? Our second one did the day before we left for Asia. Fortunately they had another one in Ohio and they were able to truck it to LAX.

Well, I have to run--the TV repairman is going to meet us at the airplane in an hour. TC

 

[murfdawg998]

Who carries a "Tech" with them on the International trips?

We dont. I have to over see all maint. on the road. The last was a 3 day windshield change in Beijing.

If you do need maint. on the road in the Pacific Rim try Jet Aviation out of Singapore. Ask for Graham. He's hard core.

Graham is definitely the man!!! Really nice guy...