Logbook Multipliers for Southwest

[BH618]

Does anybody know what Southwest's current policy on multiplying hours or a conversion factor for military trainer pilots? The last I heard was .3 per sortie.

 

[P3 Tweek]

.3 conv factor

http://www.southwest.com/careers/pilots.html

.3 is correct! Check the small print at the bottom of the pilot requirements page.

LUV it!
Tweek

 

[BH618]

Thanks

I guess it helps to read the fine print.

 

[P3 Tweek]

SWA

No problem `BHarris'. Glad to help in even a little way.

God Speed to you Sir!

P3 `Orion' Tweek

 

[thebluto]

Maybe old school, but...

The pre-9/11 gouge SWA was putting out was that if you didn't need the conversion to meet the mins, don't use it. The conversion was only really meant for military folks that couldn't reach the 1000 PIC unless they used it.

A couple of months ago, I went to a conference in San Antonio with SWA and HPA, and I asked that question again. They didn't specifically say not to use the conversion, but they eluded to the fact that it may not help you that much. It seemed that they were thinking that when the process gets cranking, and the interviews start, the hours won't matter that much.

Currency, gaining qualifications and a 737 type rating were more important to the mix, provided you meet the mins.

Just my $.02, take it or leave it.

 

[YeOldeProp]

Adding a sidenote to "TheBluto" comment, guys in our flight room went back and forth on the need to add the .3 conversion to your totals if you already met the mins without it. We finally got word from one of our buddies who had joined the LUV team to follow what the SWA guidance says...which is to add the .3 per sortie as advertised on the website. He said it's the SWA way of "equalizing" all the times out there into one accepted format that was the most acceptable to the hiring folks.

Admittedly, the new e-application will probably have lines of code built in to figure a better way for SWA to rank us. Also, the first years worth of interviewees will probably have thousands of hours of quality time, so it won't matter anymore. But, as the hiring continues into the later part of the decade (we hope), it may become a player again. The currency issue is probably gonna be a factor for some folks. Cessna time probably won't hack it, even though it keeps us happy to be in the air every once in a while. Good luck...

 

[Snoopy58]

Also, the first years worth of interviewees will probably have thousands of hours of quality time, so it won't matter anymore.

This is just a guess from somebody who is NOT involved with the hiring/interviewing process, but I doubt that the first year or two of hiring will exclude the 8-12 year military segment. Granted, those guys don't have thousands & thousands of hours, and probably zero -121 time, but SWA has traditionally had a mix of tactical jet, military heavy, corporate, and -121 pilots in class, as well as a range of ages & experience levels. While I agree that there are some very highly qualified candidates out there, I don't think that their presence will so dominate classes that the guys who need the .3 conversion to get 1000 TPIC should assume that just because they do, they're automatically out of luck for the next few years.

If you want to work for Southwest, by all means, apply!

Snoopy

 

[Big Air]

mil multiplier and helo time

Request a sanity check:

I have mil and civ time: piston, turboprop, jet and helo hours. And meet the 1500 hours TURBINE total and the 1000 PIC in Turbine aircraft (FAR PART I) using only fixed-wing time. So no worries there.

I plan on applying the 0.3/sortie to all my mil time (including helo).
Because the "Total Flight Hours"page on the SWA site says "We prefer you use the military conversion factor if applicable." My interpretation is that although I cannot use helo hours to meet mins, helo hours are part of my "Total Flight Hours".

And confirm the definition of a "sortie": one takeoff and landing. So, if I flew 4 legs on a log run, 4 sorties.

Thanks,

 

[Falconjet]

Sortie

I think the .3 conversion is to account for the fact that most of the sevices log flight time from taxi out to landing time, without accounting for the taxi in. When I applied, the directions said to add a conversion, so I did, even though I had well above the mins. I never heard of the gouge to not include it in that situation and was trying very hard to follow the directions explicitly.

In the CG we would continue to log flight time for a taxi back or quick opstop if the engines weren't shut down and we were heading right back out. So on those types of multiple legs I only added one final .3 conversion for the final leg. If, on the other hand, you did 4 separate legs and shut down each time, I would add .3 per leg.

The bottom line is be clear and concise in your logbook so the folks who check it can clearly determine how you logged what you did and that it matches your resume and app. I don't think I would include the helo time in the total unless they say that its ok to do so. Might be worth a call to LL to avoid any possibility of goofing it up.

Good Luck.

FJ

 

[llowwelll]

Regarding the .3 per sortie thang: I remember as I was filling out the application that there were instructions accompanying it that stated something to the effect that they would prefer that you DO use the .3 conversion. Don't remember exactly how they phrased it, but I definitely remember reading it. Anyone else remember that?

 

[thebluto]

DO THE CONVERSION

The new app says they prefer military use the .3 conversion per sortie. I'm glad I invested the time with my logbook and an excel spreadsheet before I filled out the app.

 

[Snoopy58]

There should be a column on your military printout of flight time that lists "number of sorties." Take THAT number and multiply it by the .3 to get your total. IIRC, that count is broken down in the military records by aircraft type, so you can do the same. If you end up using a different number and multiplying it by the .3, you'll create a question for the logbook checkers. If your count is lower, that's fine, they'll probably just use the printed number & adjust your total hours up by a bit. If your number is higher, umm, that's not a good thing!

 

[menacef15]

From my 8 months of experience at SWA, I think Snoop was right about the types of folks SWA will hire - they will continue to want a mix of folks fromvarious backgrounds, and will not simply go down the list from highest to lowest amount of flight time to make the calls for interviews. The 737 type will definitely get you a call alot earlier, tens of thousands of hours won't. Above all else, they look for who will best fit into the company culture. Best of luck to all the wannabees........

 

[Big Air]

not in the Navy

There should be a column on your military printout of flight time that lists "number of sorties." Take THAT number and multiply it by the .3 to get your total.

Snoop,
I had to go back into my Navy logbook and count each leg. The only listing of the legs I have is in my LogbookPro.
But for a particular flight I can show why I claim it to be 3 legs (i.e. KABC-KDEF-KGHI-KABC).

What is the general opinion on listing helo time with total time. Like I said earlier in this tread, I meet the mins using f/w hours. But plan to include my helo hours with TT.

 

[Falconjet]

Air Force

I think Snoopy is referring to the computerized flight record and printout that the AF apparently keeps for its pilots. They often assume that any "military" pilot also has that, but I don't know of any other service that does, although the CG was trying to computerize their records when I retired. So Naval Aviators will have to do the log the old fashioned way, in the little blue books.

Good luck.

FJ

 

[cgmason1]

Re: not in the Navy

I meet the mins using f/w hours. But plan to include my helo hours with TT.

You can do what ya want and being a prior Helo guy myself I don't agree with this-but the SWA website says they don't even consider helo time.
I wish they did. But you can only hose yourself by going against what they list as their criteria and what they want on the app.

Fly Safe
Chuck

from the SWA website:
Flight Experience:
2500 hours total or 1500 hours TURBINE total. Additionally, a minimum of 1000 hours in Turbine aircraft as the Pilot in command2, as defined by FAR PART I is required. Southwest considers only Pilot time in fixed wing aircraft. This specifically excludes simulator, helicopter, WSO, RIO, FE, NAV, EWO etc. NO other time is counted.

 

[Snoopy58]

Falconjet, you're quite correct, I was generalizing from my AF experience. I think that counting ABC to DEF to GHI to ABC as 3 legs is a perfectly sound method for counting your sorties, and I agree that it's a shame that helo time doesn't count for anything besides good "there I was" stories with SWA. Sorry!

 

[Falconjet]

Helo time

I don't think I'd even mention helo time on the app. SWA doesn't seem to recognize helo time, so I wouldn't include it in the total time. You know the old joke that I'd rather have VD in my health record than helo time in my logbook (or some other not so savory variation)? Perhaps they have heard too many of those.

Good luck.

FJ

 

[Aplus9]

Falcon is right:


Flight Experience:
2500 hours total or 1500 hours TURBINE total. Additionally, a minimum of 1000 hours in Turbine aircraft as the Pilot in command2, as defined by FAR PART I is required. Southwest considers only Pilot time in fixed wing aircraft. This specifically excludes simulator, helicopter, WSO, RIO, FE, NAV, EWO etc. NO other time is counted.



http://www.southwest.com/careers/pilots.html


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