Letter Of Discontinuance?

[nufft]

I recently went for my Private Pilot check ride. After a little while I relized that my examiner was very agitated & frustrated with one of my techniques, at which point I started thinking that there was no way that this guy was going to pass me. So asked for a letter of discontinuance. His reply was "I haven't failed you yet." He ended up failing me later on a petty technicality.

My question is: "What options do I have open to me to try and get this black mark removed from my record?"

Any and all comments will be appreciated.

Thanx Much,
Nufft.

 

[BoDEAN]

Hey there:
Don't get down on yourself. I failed my Private Pilot ride. We ALL fail sooner or later in our pilot training. Don't believe those who say we don't; we are human. This will NOT, will NOT, affect your future in aviation. You have to take this as a positive experience, a learning experience, and move forward from it. Don't take it as a negative experience.

First lesson you should note, never "give up" or ask to quit during a checkride. By law, the examiner is suppose to state at the time given appropriate, that you fail. He CAN NOT just wait to the end of the ride, and say you failed due to a bad maneuver.

So you need to do each maneuver, and when its done, no matter if it is perfect or not, if you don't hear "You Fail" by the examiner, you move on to the next maneuver. HE MUST tell you at that point if you fail, not wait til the end. So if you just give up because you think he is going to fail you, you need to keep going forward. The more you complete, the less you have to redo on your makeup exam!

Hope this helps. Keep your chin up!

 

[172driver]

You probably have no options. Of course, you weren't very specific about the 'technique' he didn't like or the 'petty technicality.' You can not discontinue a practical test just because it's not going well and you think you might fail. Weather and illness are valid reasons, poor performance is not. Nice try though. Like gizbug said...a failed checkride is not the end of your aviation career. Don't sweat it too badly.

I'd like to hear the details. Keep in mind though, as you progress in aviation, people don't want to hear that it was the examiner's fault. Take responsibility and say what you learned from the experience.

 

[dogg]

it may be hard to imagine at this point, but failing a private checkride will have zero bearing on your career. Two or three pink slips along the way are just normal. And they give youu something to talk about at an interview, so relax and don't ask for a letter of discontinuance again.

 

[tarp]

Sounds like you gave up on yourself before the examiner did.

A lot of folks on this board have seen a lot of examiners. Let's see, I've been through ten so far. I have seen good and what I will call bad, but the one thing all these folks have in common is a measuring stick that has two scales on it. Every single one of my examiners has stressed that Safety of flight is their number one goal - no matter what else - the checkride and all my future performance will be predicated on my ability to be safe. The second scale was the PTS. Now the good and bad in my opinion was in the application of the PTS but nobody has ever expected me to exceed the limits as written in the PTS. I was dismayed when on one manuever, the PTS gave me -0ft and +100ft and I flew to -5ft and +50ft ending up in a bust - now that was one tough examiner who explained his thinking that the floor I went through was a safety issue - he would have given me -0 to +200 in his mind (explained later) but a bust below was a bust. I was more angry at my CFI for not having insight into this examiner and for maybe not stressing the importance of nailing this altitude.

The PTS lays everything out for your ride. So review the ride in your head and ask yourself how many items did you nail and how many did the examiner let slide? He also may have done you a favor by failing you on a "technicality". You seem to think its trivial - he may have made it easy for you to get your licence since you only have to return and do the one "trivial" maneuver. This is much better than having a laundry list of items on your pink slip. What if you messed up your stalls, your soft field landings and your diversion manuevers (ala the PTS) but he only brings you back to do a Soft Field landing. That's a gift!

Also, please remember that the PTS requires the examiner to attempt to distract the candidate from performing some function. I know one of my examiners did just what you are talking about - it drove me crazy as he was questioning me about my technique for performing a maneuver - I started second guessing but ultimately just stuck to my guns and said "No, this is what I have to do and everything is right". He later congratulated me on sticking to my guns - he laughed that about 90% of the folks fall for the distraction but he never fails anyone for taking the bait.

Checkrides are extremely stressful events. It's hard to have a perfect ride and most folks don't. I'm luckier than most in only getting two pink slips in my career yet the airline I work for still seems to think that I'm a good pilot - in fact, at our airline, they like the fact that most of us have failed at one time and learned from our mistakes - including getting a little taste of humility that comes with being flawed. I feel a lot safer sitting next to a guy who doesn't think of himself as a divine inspiration to the flying world - send me a guy or gal who questions my judgement and doublechecks that frequency.

Now let's say that you do end up with that Private Pilot certificate from Attila the Hun. Are you a worse pilot or a better pilot for getting a ticket with the nastiest examiner's signature on it? There's many an airport where you would be legendary - like my CFI ticket. I remember afterward. "You took your ride with ____?", folks at the flight school asked. "...and you passed?" "How many rechecks did it take?" was the next question. Everyone knew I basically went up against a dragon and ultimately won the battle. Sometimes a pink slip is a badge of honor.

If you are now a holder of a PPL certificate, be proud, hold your head up and strut around a little. You did it. Revenge and jealousy are too petty of emotions for pilots - we're above all that.

 

[nufft]

Thanx Much

Thank you all for your post, and I am sorry that it has taken me so long to get back here, but life keeps getting in the way.

I appreciate everyone taking the time to post a reply. They all helped.

A little update. I did call my local FSDO and inquire about my options. The long and short of it is that I would gain nothjing from it, and it would just be a lot of paperwork & aggrivation for no gain. As a result, I have decided to let it lie where it is.

One thing that I tried to be very careful about, and I seemed to have failed, was I do take resposibility for failing my check ride. The "petty technicality" that I was failed on was that I just bearly encroached on my target during my turns around a point. Again, I did do it, no way around that, and I do take responsibility for it.

GIZBUG & TARP: Thanx so much for your postings, I took them to heart, and will continue to ponder your words of wisdom.

Thanx again to everyone for your posts!

Nufft.

 

[brucek]

I'm a private pilot, and got busted at the end for poor approach planning. And I knew I had done so, I was so tired and fatigued after all the study, tension and worry, the oral and the ride. I went back in 2 weeks, did 3 landings and he was OK, took about 30 minutes flying time.

The ironic part that was neither me nor my CFI was aware that I did not have my required hours simulated instrument. The DE discovered when he was issuing a the "pink slip". He then indicated that it was as much his problem as my CFI's, as he had not noted it either during the logbook inspection prior to the oral. So, the FAA records no doubt show that I got my license on the first try- albeit a 30 minute 3-landings ride .

I learnt more from that DE in 3 hours than I have with 2 CFI's over a course of many months.

Good luck,

Bruce.

 

[EOpilot]

I don't know about that logic, Bruce. Let me tell you a story.

I arrived for my multi-commercial checkride oral and the examiner looked through my logbook. He noted that I did not have the proper endorsement. He issued a pink slip. Not only that, but while reviewing my 8710 form to issue the pink slip, he noted that I did not have the required cross country time for a commercial certificate (since I already held a commercial single engine certificate I had assumed wrongly that I was qualified to apply for an additional class) and included the lack of x-country time as a reason for unsat. Record time for a pink slip - 5 minutes.

Don't fret, though. I told this very story in my interview at ACA and I was hired nonetheless. I just took responsibility for being so unprepared.

 

[brucek]

I don't know about that logic, Bruce. Let me tell you a story.

Interesting. I had done the entire check-ride (and oral) before he noticed. So, even though I was getting a "pink slip" (which I never did get, the DE just said "come back and do the landings, and we'll pretend that today never happened"), I also would not have qualified for a temp certificate either! He only discovered the discrepancy when entering my info into a computer application, where it requested all the relevant pre-qualifying info the be entered. I think he thought that if the required hours were not logged prior, that it made his "pink slip" report look like he should be getting it!

Bruce.

 

[172driver]

Jeez, EO, that's a tough bust. Can he do that? Did you go back up with this monster? I can see holding a CFI applicant to those standards but I don't think a Comm. applicant is responsible for knowing endorsements...Hope your CFI paid for the ride.