Learjet destroyed during engine runs?

[westwind driver]

Sounds kinda fishy, that or the techs didn't know what they were doing. If you lose power lever control over the engine (DEEC) you can always push the FIRE button which closes the fuel SOV. I've heard of power lever jams and DEEC malfunctions but never an inability to shut down the engine. Sounds like whatever happened they panicked and forgot about the buttons.

LR45 dont have DEEC

 

[westwind driver]

"MOST" are competent????? Thats just great, what about the incompetent ones????? Well, hopefully you get the incompetent ones, I don't want them. How do you know which mechanic is NOT competent? YUP...after he bends the airframe in a ditch like this Learjet did.

How do you know which mechanic is going to act quickly and appropriately when the brakes fail during an engine run-up? Do your mechanics get any training on how to stop a plane, emergency brake system, SOV's, reversers, etc...? Hell no..... Yeah, they know what they are and where they are...but they aren't like pilots in the proficiency department.

I can't tell you how stupid of a statement that is. Those are line personnel jobs that take place when an aircraft is "OFF", parked or totally powered down. Don't even need battery power for most of those ops. An aircraft can't go flying across an airfield out of control from line personnel and get totalled, or kill someone.


Again, jobs for line service. They get training on all that stuff.


For the most part, yes, mechanics will do just fine with engine runs. Its the time when a plane gets destroyed where this becomes the topic of discussion. If its not your plane, who cares, right.

A smart company owner would have his pilots taking care of engine runs. If not for total safety...liability. If I was an insurance company, I wouldn't cover non-pilots taxiing a plane around and doing engine runs.

Or, like "SWA tech" said......give the mechanics specific recurrent training on everything they would need to know to avoid a catastrophy. Nobody with half a brain can argue that.

.

And what about you? How do I know you are a competent pilot? Do I find out you are only incompetent after YOU, as the PILOT, CRASH?

 

[LJ45]

LR45 dont have DEEC

yes they do

The 45's DEEC's act like FADEC, except it still has a throttle cable for Hydromechincal control back up, just like the other 731's. The DEEC's due more then the DEEC's on older generation 731's, but they are still DEEC's

 

[rausda27]

LR45 dont have DEEC

You are right, they have 2 DEEC's.

 

[jet2work]

I thought about it but........

Then I read a thread here on the corporate board that said something like 90% of corporate airplanes have been rolled by pilots. I think I would rather take my chances with the once in a blue moon occurance of a mechanic screwing up a run up:nuts:

That's a joke y'all. I for one don't want to get my A$$ out of bed in the middle of the night to go do a maintenance runup (when does most maintenance occur? - middle of the night)

Most Mechanics (like Most Pilots) are competent and conscientious (then there are those that roll corporate jets). Do we have a few Bozo's among our ranks (uhhhh YES!). When we start making rules because of the lowest common denominator then I might as well have gone to work for the airlines.

If you make something idiot proof, someone will make a better idiot.

 

[bikeguy]

Type-rated pilots should be the only people running up engines or taxiing planes around.

Yeah a typed pilot has never wrecked a Lear....

 

[westwind driver]

yes they do

The 45's DEEC's act like FADEC, except it still has a throttle cable for Hydromechincal control back up, just like the other 731's. The DEEC's due more then the DEEC's on older generation 731's, but they are still DEEC's

Well I'll say I have not flown a LR45 or LR40, so truth be told I don't really know 100%, but I thought they had FADEC with throttle detents.

 

[LJ45]

Well I'll say I have not flown a LR45 or LR40, so truth be told I don't really know 100%, but I thought they had FADEC with throttle detents.

yes... the Lear 45 series does have detents for TO, MCT and MCR. That has nothing to do with FADEC. The "F" in FADEC stands for Full authority which the 45 series does not have. It has a mechanical backup. Small technical detail, but it is a difference.

 

[westwind driver]

yes... the Lear 45 series does have detents for TO, MCT and MCR. That has nothing to do with FADEC. The "F" in FADEC stands for Full authority which the 45 series does not have. It has a mechanical backup. Small technical detail, but it is a difference.

I yield to you because you have experience with the aircraft. So I don't doubt what you are saying to be true.

This is of course getting off topic from the original post, but I would be interested in a brief breakdown of how this pseudo fadec/deec works? The reason I ask, we had DEECs on the Westwind, but it was basically just full throttle and it would set your t/o power. Worked much much better than the EECs.

So I assume on the Lear 45 series, It is like having a 1 channel FADEC, but it's a DEEC because it has mechanical backup and not dual channel?

EDIT: Well I should say it has 1 channel electrical, and then mechanical backup. As where FADEC is dual channel electrical, no mechanical backup, and thus if both channels fail, no turbine turning

So it's like a hybrid in a since. Would this be a proper way to describe it?

Thanks for the knowledge!

 

[GSXR600]

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