Lear FO Pay

[CDogg]

Just curious what some other folks out there are making, either in the 20's or the 30's, we fly all 35's and 36's. Our salary for FO's is 2k/mo and up to 3k/mo after 90 days with 40/day perdiem while on the road with a 20 on, 10 off schedule, and pushing for a 14/7 schedule now, averaging about 80-90 hours a month with a fair ammount of international flights (mostly the islands and South/Central America. Captains make 60/year salary... no bennies, which makes me want to go elsewhere.

 

[Daytonaflyer]

I am F/O on the Lear 24/25's. 0ur pay is a guarantee of $2000/mo plus mileage and $1.50/hr per diem.
Most F/O's here average between $30,000-35,000/year depending how busy we are.
We have medical and dental, but no vision. Approx $40/mo.
Our schedule is 5 on 2 off, with some varation.

 

[Dr Pokenhiemer]

I have seen Lear F/O jobs posted for $20k/year and there are TONS of people trying to get those jobs. Don't sell yourself short and work for nothing. F/O pay should be alteast $35k with starting Captain paying around $57,000. Those are pretty much the industry standard. I'm sure you've heard, "You get what you pay for." If they pay crap, you'll be flying with crap--this means inexperienced people as maint. that sucks. $50/day per diem is reasonable. (more is better) The reason those jobs paying $20 are out there is because they know they can always find a sucker looking to build time. They run you ragged and expect you to always be willing to fly a mission regardless of how long you've been sitting around the hotel waiting--they say you don't really go on duty until you show up at the airport for the trip. Now, they call at 10:30pm giving you a trip from ATL-San Juan-Miami-Kansas City putting you off duty @ 2pm.

Sorry, getting back to the subject. Work for atleast what the industry standard calls for. The above comments refer to the air ambulance company I used to work for and do not accurately reflect the views of reputable companies, and the management of this station.

 

[CDogg]

Hey I've heard that story before... sittin' in Miami, just got released for the night, about 9pm the phone rings... Hey you have a trip to Santiago Chile tomorrow, wheels up at 6am. Gotta love it

 

[iflyabeech]

I was hired by your company starting at 48k, with good benny's and a home every night 2 on 1 off schedule. . .They just didn't mention that one day a paycheck would not come and benny's would get cancelled. . . .the funny thing is....they didn't mention the paycheck thing or the cancelled benny's until 2 weeks of work and 2 weeks after they cancelled the insurance!! Trust me It is a wonderful place to work!1

 

[CDogg]

Like I said i'm not praising it, was just mentioning how they were actually paying pilots now instead of pilots from Europe having to pay for lear time. Anyways, I know where you're coming from dude, our pay checks run days behind. I have to have them mail it to my parents so they can deposit my check because I am never home, or don't know when I will be home... plus the checks run days behind, and I think this week will be the last straw for me... would rather be working the line than here right now.

 

[Dr Pokenhiemer]

No matter how bad it is, there's always people standing in line trying to get it. On the flipside, it's just like a beautiful woman--Doesn't matter how pretty and smart she is, there's someone somewhere that's tired of her crap. (from a sticker on my motorcycle helmet, but they didn't use the word "crap")

 

[iflyabeech]

No matter how bad it is, there's always people standing in line trying to get it. On the flipside, it's just like a beautiful woman--Doesn't matter how pretty and smart she is, there's someone somewhere that's tired of her crap. (from a sticker on my motorcycle helmet, but they didn't use the word "crap")

This is an ugly ho. . .not a pretty lady. . . here is the dirt on the old company---->

http://www.faa.gov/news/press_releases/news_story.cfm?newsId=7169

 

[CDogg]

Yup, seen that... however, the Gilliland's are actually trying to get it right this time... well, atleast to the best of their ability, which may not be so great, time will tell, as long as I have a pay check and flying planes that are now maintained somewhat decent (compared to some of the other outfits out there) I can't complain too badly... it's easy when the checks stop coming, we stop flying, the pilots here now aren't putting up with any crap.

 

[iflyabeech]

Yup, seen that... however, the Gilliland's are actually trying to get it right this time... well, atleast to the best of their ability, which may not be so great, time will tell, as long as I have a pay check and flying planes that are now maintained somewhat decent (compared to some of the other outfits out there) I can't complain too badly... it's easy when the checks stop coming, we stop flying, the pilots here now aren't putting up with any crap.

Ha. so they say! I don't think that pencil whipped inspections are considered decent compared to anything. Good luck to you and be ready, cuz one day the paychecks will not come...The excuse will be that doug has no money. . .but he sure has new trucks, and keeps getting new planes. And doesn't mind jetting around the country. . . That stuff will continue even when your paychecks stop. . .I speak from experience.

 

[Nolife]

pay checks run days behind. I have to have them mail it to my parents so they can deposit my check because I am never home, or don't know when I will be home... plus the checks run days behind, and I think this week will be the last straw for me...

That'd be it for me too. No pay no work. If the paycheck is three days late... I'm three days late. Working for free ain't cool...

Now get that turd you have for a boss to set up direct deposit for you.

 

[iflyabeech]

That'd be it for me too. No pay no work. If the paycheck is three days late... I'm three days late. Working for free ain't cool...

Now get that turd you have for a boss to set up direct deposit for you.

If it makes you feel any better, we used to have direct deposit as well! But we were home every night so it wasn't such a biggie!

 

[Goose Egg]

...it's just like a beautiful woman--Doesn't matter how pretty and smart she is, there's someone somewhere that's tired of her crap.

Heh, heh... SO true.

-Goose

 

[AgreenFO]

35 K Plus a year, bennies, Perdeim at least 40-50 a day, Cap's 55k - 60 a year is what you should look for, and time off oh yes time off is KEY!!!! been doin the lear gig now for 2 1/2 years now, that's what I've seen is normal. But there is nothing normal in Lear world, ever

 

[iflyabeech]

Chipola=American Air Network=Doug Gilliland=BAD

 

[JasonAZO]

Just curious what some other folks out there are making, either in the 20's or the 30's, we fly all 35's and 36's. Our salary for FO's is 2k/mo and up to 3k/mo after 90 days with 40/day perdiem while on the road with a 20 on, 10 off schedule, and pushing for a 14/7 schedule now, averaging about 80-90 hours a month with a fair ammount of international flights (mostly the islands and South/Central America. Captains make 60/year salary... no bennies, which makes me want to go elsewhere.

LJ35 & BE30, BE20
FO: Start at 26,500 + 1,000 each year up to fifth year
PIC: Start at 36,500 + 4,000 each year up to fifth year
Schedule: 6 on, 2 off; 10 to 70 hours per month

Bennies are the worst I've ever had (I know, at least I have some), it comes out of your salary (the figures above INCLUDE bennies). $1000 deductible, minimum $20 co-pay just to see any doctor, $10 to $40 for prescriptions (most drugs fall in the $20 to $40 range). Insurance for a family runs about $8000/year (so subtract that from the salary figure above). I was paying $6000 a year with better coverage at a previous employer.

The LJs average about 4 overnights per month (so, not bad there). The BEs are always flying overnight, so you sleep in whatever hole of an FBO you happen to be at.

There is a rumor we get 5 days of vacation per year; I have not had a vacation request approved yet.

Oh yeah, no life insurance, no disability. You're on your own there. We do have a 401k however. Most people don't participate because they are scrounging up cash for food.

Sadly, after researching some of the regional carriers, I'm inclined to stay here. There just doesn't seem to be any benefit to jumping ship for less pay.

I may sound a little bitter.

 

[iflyabeech]

Its those who take these jobs who are to blame. The crappy company that hired you would have to raise the pay if there weren't suckers who would take jobs that pay less that pumping gas at your local station!

LJ35 & BE30, BE20
FO: Start at 26,500 + 1,000 each year up to fifth year
PIC: Start at 36,500 + 4,000 each year up to fifth year
Schedule: 6 on, 2 off; 10 to 70 hours per month

Bennies are the worst I've ever had (I know, at least I have some), it comes out of your salary (the figures above INCLUDE bennies). $1000 deductible, minimum $20 co-pay just to see any doctor, $10 to $40 for prescriptions (most drugs fall in the $20 to $40 range). Insurance for a family runs about $8000/year (so subtract that from the salary figure above). I was paying $6000 a year with better coverage at a previous employer.

The LJs average about 4 overnights per month (so, not bad there). The BEs are always flying overnight, so you sleep in whatever hole of an FBO you happen to be at.

There is a rumor we get 5 days of vacation per year; I have not had a vacation request approved yet.

Oh yeah, no life insurance, no disability. You're on your own there. We do have a 401k however. Most people don't participate because they are scrounging up cash for food.

Sadly, after researching some of the regional carriers, I'm inclined to stay here. There just doesn't seem to be any benefit to jumping ship for less pay.

I may sound a little bitter.

 

[JasonAZO]

Its those who take these jobs who are to blame. The crappy company that hired you would have to raise the pay if there weren't suckers who would take jobs that pay less that pumping gas at your local station!

I totally agree. I looked for a non-flying job for a little over 18 months. I have nearly a decade of experience in the insurance industry (we have two very large insurance companies headquartered in town here) and I couldn't get anyone to talk to me except aviation businesses (when I finally started getting desperate).

Almost all non-aviation employers think you will leave them the instant an opportunity opens up to fly. It's incredibly difficult to convince someone that you will be willing to work for what you know is more money doing a non-flying task when they think that all pilots are filthy rich.

And with this company, or any other 135 operator in this area (UPS country), there are probably 5x as many applicants as hired pilots. We are absolutely saturated with pilots. We just hired a truckload of pilots in the past two months; for the first time in years, we have more pilots than airplanes. So, sadly, if I weren't here building time, someone else would be in my place. One positive note (if you look at it that way), turnover is high enough that we typically upgrade to captain in 6 months or less.