Lear 45 Crash Today

[Gear Up!]

XC-VMC Crashed today in Mexico City!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7709877.stm

My thoughts go out to the families and victims..

 

[Tired Soul]

Mr Mourino had been in charge of security during the government's violent battle with Mexico's powerful drug cartels, and his death is a big blow, says BBC Americas analyst Warren Bull.

Hmmm....wouldn't be too sure about ruling out foul play.
Wouldn't be the first time the bad guys bring a plane down.

 

[Gear Up!]

ya probably sabotaged

 

[Fernando]

People down here are speculating abouta bomb onboard.

But there are other theories like if the Lear got too close to a B767 that was landing before them and got into their wake turbolence, and that was that drove them down.Besides the radar images showed on TV show the Laer Jet descending their airspedd down to 110 kts before it dissapeared

anyway the CVR was sent to Washington, lets see what happens.

 

[Basil]

Radar Video of accident

http://www.youtube.com/watch?=IpZrETheec8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XT5lBg8jDL8

I think that wake turbulence is a plausable explanation. If I read the data tags correctly, just before MXA1692 (the 767-300) makes the turn to final (2:53 in video), the Lear is at the same altitude, 4 nm in trail and 70kts faster! Then, at the location that XC-VMC has the event, they were 300ft lower than the 763 was at that point and they crossed it 1:24 after the 763.

I'd love for someone from ATC to give us their impression of the video.

 

[Fly91]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?=IpZrETheec8

whats this?

 

[Basil]

It's fixed now. Sorry for the wrong link!

 

[Fly91]

It's fixed now. Sorry for the wrong link!

Thanks for the fix.

1:24 should have been enough time for that wake to have dissipated, at least to a level beyond 300 feet below where the 767 was at that point.
You never know though.

Too bad they didn't slow down when they were told to. Don't understand why pilots would ignore an ATC instruction for 2 full minutes. Whats the rush. IF it was wake turbulence, they could have avoided this accident. ATC should have been more assertive and told them again to slow down immediately. But still, the pilots have control of the plane, not ATC, so..............

 

[g4800xp]

Read up on the Citation V at Billings about 15 years ago. My friend Dan, a new copilot rode to his and 7 or 8 others deaths, telling the as%fuc# they were flying up the tail pipes of a 757. It was the second GA crash behind a 757. That was when the lights were coming on regarding 75/76 turb. Sounds the same.

 

[Fly91]

Read up on the Citation V at Billings about 15 years ago. My friend Dan, a new copilot rode to his and 7 or 8 others deaths, telling the as%fuc# they were flying up the tail pipes of a 757. It was the second GA crash behind a 757. That was when the lights were coming on regarding 75/76 turb. Sounds the same.

Yeah, just a simple thing like actually listening to ATC, can save your azz.

Whats the damn rush with everyone.

If it was wake turb that caused it, chalk another one up to "pilot error". Or "crew error" actually.

 

[Gear Up!]

all speculation... lets wait for the facts.

 

[filejw]

Thanks for the fix.

1:24 should have been enough time for that wake to have dissipated, at least to a level beyond 300 feet below where the 767 was at that point.
You never know though.

Too bad they didn't slow down when they were told to. Don't understand why pilots would ignore an ATC instruction for 2 full minutes. Whats the rush. IF it was wake turbulence, they could have avoided this accident. ATC should have been more assertive and told them again to slow down immediately. But still, the pilots have control of the plane, not ATC, so..............

Not really, don't have the #'s but I'm sure its more than that.. I've been behind 767/757 in a bigger a/c and have gotten some real nice jolts and rolls...can't imagine what a corporate a/c would do. More reason to do one of those T6 upset courses.

 

[LJ45]

From AIN:

Sabotage Unlikely in Mexican Learjet 45 Crash
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Officials are all but ruling out sabotage in the November 4 crash of a Learjet 45 in Mexico City, which killed all nine aboard, including Mexican Interior Secretary Juan Camillo Mourino. Instead, a preliminary report suggests pilot error as a result of encountering wake turbulence from a Boeing 767-300 it was following on approach. Luis Téllez, Mexican secretary of communication and transportation, said an examination of the wreckage did not indicate any trace of explosives, and investigators determined that the engines were functioning at high speed and the aircraft did not explode in flight. “There was no indication of any sabotage whatsoever,” Téllez asserted. He said the evidence indicates the Learjet, which was on approach to Mexico City Benito Juarez International Airport, was 4.15 nm behind the 767. Standard flight procedures require a separation of 5 nm. The flight’s voice recorder showed that the crew felt the turbulence just before the pilot “lost control” and, according to Téllez, revealed that the pilots’ voices reflected “anguish, impotence and frustration.” The communication secretary emphasized that these were preliminary findings and it would likely be several months before all the facts are known. The NTSB is assisting Mexican officials with the investigation.[/FONT]