JetBlue pilots lose more domestic flying.

[Smarta$$]

Kee-rist.....um...do YOU?

Yes, I used the wrong spelling. Congratulations jack@$$.

 

[Dan Roman]

I'll try to respond without the chest-beating I'm sometimes guilty of. In a nutshell, you're correct Dan. It likely is a win for both companies and I'm looking forward to being able to ZED my son out to Hawaii on you guys.

The heartburn for us is that as a pilot group we have precisely ZERO input or limiting factors for this type of flying. I believe we are up to 13 of these agreements now, with more on the way. Most are with longhaul carriers such as Singapore, Lufthansa, Aer Lingus, etc. I'm well aware that my A320 isn't going to HI or Europe anytime soon, but I'd like to think that in a few years I could take an A330 or A350 (or DC-10, if I'm dreaming) with a JB tail number. But as long as JB can put our customers on everyone elses's jets, we don't exactly need to expand into that type of flying.

I hear you and understand were you are coming from. That said though, it seems to me the best way for JB to expand into the A330/350 type of flying will be to first build up a network of the types of feed you are doing, then add your own wide bodies. You can really lose your ass fast if you start up a bunch of wide body type flying without a solid foundation that the codeshares give you. At least that's my take on the deal.

 

[Flyby1206]

I hear you and understand were you are coming from. That said though, it seems to me the best way for JB to expand into the A330/350 type of flying will be to first build up a network of the types of feed you are doing, then add your own wide bodies. You can really lose your ass fast if you start up a bunch of wide body type flying without a solid foundation that the codeshares give you. At least that's my take on the deal.

I agree, but to play devil's advocate.. How much feed did Hawaiian have when you guys started up the recent Asian expansion from HNL?

I think there is enough existing O&D traffic in the NYC area to support some Europe and South America flying without counting the existing jetblue feed (which we do have a considerable amount of traffic flowing through JFK/BOS for our current Domestic ops).

I do think we will make a jump to the widebody flying in the next few years, but I think it is more of an infrastructure limitation as opposed to creating more feed. We need to finish construction on the T5i (customs/immigration and more widebody capable gates) and somehow gain new slots to do this widebody flying. Cannibalizing our existing slot portfolio in order to put a few heavies out there would hurt the feed foundation that we already have.

 

[Lake Alice]

While I doubt we'll ever do wide body flying because JetBlue would rather outsource the slot issue will fix itself with the 321's. The north/south Florida market is suppose to lose frequency once the 321's arrive therefore alleviating some slot pressure.

 

[$$$4nothin]

I agree. Yes I would love to get all the flying that our interline partners do. However we all know that we aren't getting 330's/340's to do all of that flying any time in the near future. Regardles of a union being on property. I am going to try and think of this on the bright side however and think that the 296 people that Hawaiin brings to us every day will fill up 2 A-320's or 3 E-190's. So yes we are giving up a planes worth of jobs to Hawaiian each day, but they are giving us 2 to 3 planes worth in return. Granted some people might by New Yorkers or Hawaiins that just fly back and forth from NY to Hawaii, however many will travel via the JB sytem to connect to the islands, and alot of islanders will connect via the JB sytem as well.

You have got to look at it like giveing up $1 to get $2 or $3 in return.

 

[Hair-on-Fire]

Where did Hawaiian get the JFK slot for the new service? Did JetBlue give it to them?

 

[n757st]

While I doubt we'll ever do wide body flying because JetBlue would rather outsource the slot issue will fix itself with the 321's. The north/south Florida market is suppose to lose frequency once the 321's arrive therefore alleviating some slot pressure.

This is also the reason for the lga slot purchase. Convert those slots to north south flying and alleviate slot pressure in JFK.

 

[mozzer]

I agree. Yes I would love to get all the flying that our interline partners do. However we all know that we aren't getting 330's/340's to do all of that flying any time in the near future. Regardles of a union being on property. I am going to try and think of this on the bright side however and think that the 296 people that Hawaiin brings to us every day will fill up 2 A-320's or 3 E-190's. So yes we are giving up a planes worth of jobs to Hawaiian each day, but they are giving us 2 to 3 planes worth in return. Granted some people might by New Yorkers or Hawaiins that just fly back and forth from NY to Hawaii, however many will travel via the JB sytem to connect to the islands, and alot of islanders will connect via the JB sytem as well.

You have got to look at it like giveing up $1 to get $2 or $3 in return.

You have management written all over you.

 

[Lake Alice]

The rationale, according to leadership, for jetblue to form these alliances/future code shares was to test the viability of these markets for a later entrance. BS. Call it what it is. A method to give our customers travel options without EVER having to do the flying ourselves. It's just business shrouded in "values".

 

[$$$4nothin]

You have management written all over you.

Yup. You got me. I am a management lacky. (deep sarcasm if you can't read into it). Just because I am trying to see a bright side in an otherwise crappy situation doesn't mean I have management written all over me. However I wouldn't mind an upper management style parachute so I don't have to worry about my retirement.