JetBlue and Dave Barger

[BabyBoy]

Talk about arrogance. So you are saying if you don't fly there then people don't need to go there. And when you do start flying there you will then assign people to travel. "Geez, Martha we have to go to BFE. JBLU is flying there now and they want us to go".

You must have missed the part where i said, FLY SOMEONE ELSE. It's not arrogance. It's the fact that we're a 5 year old company and we don't cover the entire map, nor are we trying to. If you want a direct flight that we don't provide, go elsewhere. If and when it makes economic sense for JB to enter the market, they will do so. I also pointed out that your example of FLL to LGB was flawed as we have a direct flight to these destinations.

BB

 

[Dave Siegel]

It's not arrogance.

Yes it is.

 

[BabyBoy]

Yes it is.

Coming from you, this comment holds little weight.

BB

 

[32LT10]

You can take your foot out of your mouth anytime since I do not fly for JB.
Rationalize all you wish, United pilots actions of late during the bankruptcy process does not give you the right to be chastizing others.

OHH really. I suppose the company you work for has at one time negotiated industry leading work rules and pay at one time or another? I suppose the pilot group you are associated with has continually outpaced other ALPA carriers in donations to ALPA PAC?

Since you are the great oracle on all things United. Please tell me what we should have done differently. UAL has emerged from BK, with route structure intact and the ability to fight another day. What should we have done Charlie Bryan? Tell me so I can see where we went wrong.

If you are going to harp on the retirees you must present a balanced view and all the facts. They had plenty of options in retirement and also they had ESOP stock when it had some value and they had the most money in their B-plans of anyone. If they chose a lifestyle of unsustainability; ie too many/mucg wives, kids, alimony, palimony, bad investments, psychotherapy etc. Then that is their own problem. Not mine or the rest of the UAL pilots. They had fair warning that this was brewing and to not take any steps for the inevitability is just wreckless. UAL and ALPA can not manage a guys finances for him. If he makes bad choices that is his problem.

 

[32LT10]

FLY SOMEONE ELSE. It's not arrogance.

I would love to have that on a bumper sticker! "Jetblue pilot says: FLY SOMEONE ELSE. It's not arrogance."

 

[Boeingman]

OHH really. I suppose the company you work for has at one time negotiated industry leading work rules and pay at one time or another? I suppose the pilot group you are associated with has continually outpaced other ALPA carriers in donations to ALPA PAC?

Since you are the great oracle on all things United. Please tell me what we should have done differently. UAL has emerged from BK, with route structure intact and the ability to fight another day. What should we have done Charlie Bryan? Tell me so I can see where we went wrong.

If you are going to harp on the retirees you must present a balanced view and all the facts. They had plenty of options in retirement and also they had ESOP stock when it had some value and they had the most money in their B-plans of anyone. If they chose a lifestyle of unsustainability; ie too many/mucg wives, kids, alimony, palimony, bad investments, psychotherapy etc. Then that is their own problem. Not mine or the rest of the UAL pilots. They had fair warning that this was brewing and to not take any steps for the inevitability is just wreckless. UAL and ALPA can not manage a guys finances for him. If he makes bad choices that is his problem.

Save the speech bozo. At one time yes, we had the industry leading CBA. By default I believe now we are also at the top as well. PAC WTF does that make a difference about? I have been an ALPA member for almost 30 years and I have never given a dime to PAC because I do not support some of their positions. BFD

I only mention the retiree issue becasue you sound like a hypocrite carping about retirement plans when your closet is full of ruined lives to save your own skins. Chaulking it up to "they had their warning" does not change the fact that you took an earned benefit. You may make yourself feel better about it but it doesn't change what actually occured.

What should you have done? I guess not bend over as far as you did? Seeing as how you did though shouldn't you keep your mouth shut about other carriers wages and benefits that approach yours? Or are you just so special that doesn't count?

I guess I have to chaulk you up to the die hard core over there that really still hasn't learned their lesson and didn't quite swallow all that humble pie.

 

[JB Bus Drvr]

Guys. Go to User CP, Misc., Ignore, add DS, 32 and whoever and they go away........ You don't even have to waste your time to read their nonsense.

 

[Hutchman]

...

If you are going to harp on the retirees you must present a balanced view and all the facts. They had plenty of options in retirement and also they had ESOP stock when it had some value and they had the most money in their B-plans of anyone. If they chose a lifestyle of unsustainability; ie too many/mucg wives, kids, alimony, palimony, bad investments, psychotherapy etc. Then that is their own problem. Not mine or the rest of the UAL pilots. They had fair warning that this was brewing and to not take any steps for the inevitability is just wreckless. UAL and ALPA can not manage a guys finances for him. If he makes bad choices that is his problem.

Did it ever occur to you that maybe some pilots at UAL have retired since 2001? ESOP stock could not be sold until you were retired. It has been almost 4 years since the stock took a nose dive. Lots of pilots hit age 60 in the last 4 years. Others took out a couple years early and saved many pilots from being furloughed. Those are the guys that took it hard. PBGC is paying less than 18k for a 57 year old retiree. This is over 50K less than the pension that was promised. You don't need extra wives to go through that money. Don't forget the retroactive PBGC takeover of the plan. Now the pilots have to pay back the extra money they were paid out of thier reduced pension(10% of thier check till it is paid back 15 years later). These people got the shaft, and tilton gets 50 million for 3 years of work.

On the other hand, people who retired in 2000 or before AND cashed out thier ESOP are probably doing quite well.

Do some research.

Walk a mile in thier shoes and you might take back your opinion.

 

[MD80DRVR]

Guys. Go to User CP, Misc., Ignore, add DS, 32 and whoever and they go away........ You don't even have to waste your time to read their nonsense.

AAAhhh! So much nicer now. Thanks for the tip.:beer:

 

[32LT10]

Did it ever occur to you that maybe some pilots at UAL have retired since 2001?

Do some research.

Walk a mile in thier shoes and you might take back your opinion.

Absolutely I realize many retired since 2001. But most of those guys had premium amounts in their B-funds. Research? I have done the research I live it here at UAL. The guys that did not take the lump since BK hosed themselves. A good friend of mine was 59 in 2002 before BK. He was convinced the A plan would remain intact. I tried to persuade him to take the lump (at the time he would have gotten around 200K with the penalty of -3%). This was on top of whatever he had in the b-fund. He chose to hang on and not take the lump and gamble. The A plan was gone from the beginning. If you go to LAS you gamble and lose then whose fault is that?

The guys had options. Some made good choices, Some made bad.

 

[Hvy]

Why does everyone have to attack Jet Blue at any opportunity? I don't work for them, but wish them and everyone else the best!

Exactly! I think people do it because of some deep seated insecurity issues and jealousy. Most that spout off on these boards wouldn't have the nads to say such things in person. It just shows what type of people they are (and that's not a compliment).

Oh yeah, I don't work for JetBlue either.

 

[Hvy]

People like you completely validate the opinions of people like me. Thanks for making my point. I just love the arrogance. I don't think you'd see such arrogance from Southwest, but then again, they are a better company than Jet Blue.

Really? Then you've never read posts by GuppyWN or SWAFO have you? They both go on other airline's boards and make disparaging remarks. JERKS.

 

[BabyBoy]

People like you completely validate the opinions of people like me. Thanks for making my point. I just love the arrogance. I don't think you'd see such arrogance from Southwest, but then again, they are a better company than Jet Blue.

I fail to see how acknowledging other airline’s service signifies arrogance. (However, your comment above isn’t arrogant at all…)

I am very happy when someone chooses to fly on my carrier from Florida to New York and on to the west coast. When this happens, it reaffirms the brand, the quality service and the amenities that jetBlue provides to the customer. However, I also realize that if JB doesn’t provide a direct service to a destination that a passenger chooses to fly to, they are capable to make a choice and select a different carrier. That customer may be time sensitive or have other issues that force a decision of this nature. The same argument can be held with Southwest. Passengers purchasing tickets solely on price may be inclined to make one or two stops enroute to a SWA destination a few thousand miles apart. Those that don’t wish to make these connections will choose alternate service.

So go ahead, pick one segment of my comment, quote me on it and make it seem as if I've said something that I haven't. We all know your feeling about jetBlue. Just remember there is a fine line between love and hate.

 

[coogebeachhotel]

Exactly! I think people do it because of some deep seated insecurity issues and jealousy. Most that spout off on these boards wouldn't have the nads to say such things in person. It just shows what type of people they are (and that's not a compliment).

Oh yeah, I don't work for JetBlue either.

I agree. Everyone should just chill the f&*k out. Don't wish ill harm on anyone it has a nasty way of coming back. I remember how badly CAL pilots were dogged by DAL,UAL,TWA pilots back in the early 1990's. Look who is the dog and fire hydrant now.

 

[Uppercrust]

Let's see. Here's a guy who came from a very secure and high paying job at CAL who risked everything to come to an idea without a single airplane. He's given less money than he left and is given stock instead. (Mind you, the stock is only worth the paper it's printed on). Then 8 years later, he takling what HE earned and is selling it for a descent profit. He's not taking money out of my pocket or any other employee's pocket. HE EARNED!. So who gives a rat's behind if he wants to take some profit. I've sold some of my stock too! Get a life there Hutch, or be grouped with 32, DS, UC and the rest of the bottom feeders.

You've also sold your soul with those 190 payrates.

 

[JB Bus Drvr]

You've also sold your soul with those 190 payrates.

Yeah, you're absolutely correct. I single handedly developed those rates, along with the Enron crisis, the burying of Jimmy Hoffa and the last sighting of Elvis. BTW, you're out a here, too. Ignored as having no relevance in this posting or for that matter, aviation.

 

[Uppercrust]

Yeah, you're absolutely correct. I single handedly developed those rates, along with the Enron crisis, the burying of Jimmy Hoffa and the last sighting of Elvis. BTW, you're out a here, too. Ignored as having no relevance in this posting or for that matter, aviation.

More angry threats from the BlueBird Bus Driver!

 

[Mamma]

Where was the threat? I think you might be a little paranoid.

 

[FADEC]

Uppercrust,

Sorry my friend but you sold your soul when you paid for training at Gulfstream.

 

[Uppercrust]

Guys. Go to User CP, Misc., Ignore, add DS, 32 and whoever and they go away........ You don't even have to waste your time to read their nonsense.

Good word to describe your thoughts!

 

[Dave Siegel]

More angry threats from the BlueBird Bus Driver!

If he's lucky, BlueBird may be hiring in ten years. I think his girlifriend, Gladys, works there. Maybe she can pull some strings. The clock's ticking.

 

[Mamma]

DS,
Why do you hide the identity of your employer? Just curious. Do you even have a dog in this fight? Also, what have the line pilots at JetBlue done to you to warrant such hostility? I mean it is a 90 plane airline with less than 400 flights a day and 1300 pilots. I see you have a huge emotional investment in the future of JetBlue and was just wondering where this was all coming from. The JB guys I know came from many airlines are great guys with mortgages to pay and families to feed. Why do you want to see them on the street? What is in this for you? I think it would be unfair to lump them all in with the 5% idiots that say dumb things on this board so what is the beef here?

 

[AKAAB]

Did someone mention Dave Barger?

 

[jbucpt]

You've also sold your soul with those 190 payrates.

we sold our soul??? thats priceless.........uppercrust you need a reality check........

let say the jetblue pilots took a stand last year and said "no" to the E-190 rates. what do YOU thinks dave and dave would have done??

i'll tell you what they would have done: 1-800- MESA (ALPA), OR 1-800 TRANS STATES (ALPA)/GO-JETS(TEAMSTERS) and have them fly the E-190 at those RATES under "JETBLUE EXPRESS".

and the funny thing is; these ALPA/TEAMSTER PILOTS would do it in a new york minute!! REALITY, REALITY, REALITY....


as far as dave selling is stock; good for him!! i also sold all my vested stock last year.......

 

[Lake Alice]

More angry threats from the BlueBird Bus Driver!

Dude, PFT at Gulfstream? And you're talking smack!

Many people who post on this board state factual and sometimes intuitive information regarding a company's future. Though we may not agree we do listen because the information is well presented and has a basis in fact. Those who post malicious comments or false, baseless accusations do so embarrasing themselves while ruining what little credibility they may have started with.

 

[XBOEINGDRVR]

Hey hutchman, did you know "alot" is spelled a lot? Just thought a smart guy like you would know that.....

 

[GuppyPuppy]

Ever met a JBLU pilot? Ever had to deal with those blueaid people? It is just like flyi except they have had some minor success.

What's that supposed to mean?

Dude....it's about a paycheck and days off. I like a nice balance, unlike my former employer where I had plenty of days off and no paycheck.

GP

 

[XBOEINGDRVR]

Gee, tell me something a dont know.....

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

we sold our soul??? thats priceless.........uppercrust you need a reality check........

let say the jetblue pilots took a stand last year and said "no" to the E-190 rates. what do YOU thinks dave and dave would have done??

i'll tell you what they would have done: 1-800- MESA (ALPA), OR 1-800 TRANS STATES (ALPA)/GO-JETS(TEAMSTERS) and have them fly the E-190 at those RATES under "JETBLUE EXPRESS".

and the funny thing is; these ALPA/TEAMSTER PILOTS would do it in a new york minute!! REALITY, REALITY, REALITY....
......

Surprised at this one... I think great companies like JB and SW will protect thier Brand and culture by keeping all flying in house. As a JB employee, you should know this...

 

[SUNDOWN]

More angry threats from the BlueBird Bus Driver!

Upper, outside of playing a mean rusty trombone and insulting other airlines do you ever do or say anything productive.