Is there a Black List?

[captnmayday]

Fellow Pilots:


A pilot buddy of mine is convinced that he is in a
black list and hence he can not advance in his aviation
career. I never believed him until recently that we both
applied to ExpressJet. Within a day we both had our phone
interviews and answered the same questions.

I was told that I should expect another interview in 60-90
days and he received an email within few hours stating that
they could not find a job that matched his qualifications.
This has made me wonder about his claim about a black list.
He is more qulaified than I am, however he was fired once
from a part 135 operation.

Does anyone have any idea if such a thing as black list exist
in our industry and if it does, how can one prove his/her
innocence and be off the list?

Thank you in advance

 

[AA717driver]

Considering the history of this industry, your friend should get used to not being hired and having less qualified people hired ahead of him.

Sad but true.

I would imagine he is on a run of bad luck. Plus, the competition is really tough now.TC

 

[bobbysamd]

Blacklisting

He is more qulaified than I am, however he was fired once from a part 135 operation.

In my $0.02 opinion, therein lies your answer. The airlines want to hire nothing but saints. Anyone who falls short of that standard loses.

Were your interviews alike? Was your friend given the chance to explain his termination and what he learned from it? Based on airline interviews I attended, I'd bet anything the answer to the second question is "no." They saw "termination" and summarily sh!tcanned his app.

While I personally believe there are pilots of a particular class which routinely experiences discrimination, I do not believe there is a formal "blacklist," except for scabs and the like. Wish your friend the best and hope that a more enlightened company calls him. If you haven't stubbed your toes somewhere along the way, you really haven't gained much life experience.

 

[350DRIVER]

I know of a guy who was a COEX 1900 ground instructor (still do not have any clue how he got hired with just a pvt at the time & JD on the interview board), he was fired due to sexual harrasment and the fact that they had to re-teach two entire classes over. About 8 or so months later he was hired by Great Lakes as a 1900 ground instructor/first officer, guess what.? He was also fired for the same reasons that COEX let him go. A few months later he was hired by Colgan as a first officer. Present day he is employed by someone else flying a SF340. 4 chances.?? Ask yourself again whether there "really" is a "black list" and just how effective it is.... I was absolutely amazed by how this individual is still employed as a pilot present day. There was also a corporate 91 gig in there somewhere along the lines flying a Falcon. All in less than 3.5 years.

3 5 0

 

[350DRIVER]

oops.. I forgot to mention that he was also a "1900 ground instructor" at Colgan before they took that away from him and then he was strictly a first officer... All saints as airline pilots?? Come on..... The above should clearly state that a black list if it does "exist" within is not very selective... Go figure.


3 5 0

 

[mar]

Yeah, there's a blacklist....

...but it's pretty much for guys that have crossed an ALPA picket line.

I would be very surprised if being fired from a 135 job would place your name on some list available to every employer nationwide.

More than likely: Someone at the company recognized his name and spilled the beans.

It's my understanding that Skywest will post the resumes of prospective pilots in the crew lounge and company pilots are encouraged to "provide feedback".

I think this might be a similiar situation.

Good luck.

 

[Hugh Jorgan]

Re: Blacklisting

The airlines want to hire nothing but saints. Anyone who falls short of that standard loses.

Hogwash.

They want regular folks. I know of people who have been hired by MAJOR airlines in the past three years with such things as DUI, other arrests, failed checkrides, terminations, you name it. It's not so much your record as who you know and how well you can talk about the adversities you have faced. You walk into an interview with a perfect record and answer "no" to every "have you ever..." and they will just think you are a liar. I've seen too many people of too many varied backrounds hired at too many airlines to believe there's any real discrimination other than trying to discriminate between a$$holes and not-so-a$$holes.

 

[Hugh Jorgan]

Re: Yeah, there's a blacklist....

...


More than likely: Someone at the company recognized his name and spilled the beans.

yep.

...
It's my understanding that Skywest will post the resumes of prospective pilots in the crew lounge and company pilots are encouraged to "provide feedback".

Happens at NUMEROUS companies, so be nice.

 

[bobbysamd]

SkyWest

It's my understanding that Skywest will post the resumes of prospective pilots in the crew lounge and company pilots are encouraged to "provide feedback".

Perhaps companies do that, but it is tacky. It also makes one wonder.

I started applying to SkyWest in late 1988. I heard nothing, but that might have been because I applied when I was a little under their mins. (1000 total-100 multi-100-instrument; I had about 950 total-50 multi.) Be that as it may, I continued to apply there and update. I met people in aviation, but none from SkyWest. This was before I had really met anyone in the business, much less at SkyWest.

I continued to apply and update with SkyWest. I stopped applying and updating in late 1994. That is six years. During this time, it hired at least two former Riddle instructors. One was a young lady with whom I (and others) had clashed - and - another gal who was one of my students who had walked in an app and new app fee for me. I already had paid the fee once, so my check was returned. I was never called. Perhaps the former individual dissed me, but one would figure a hand-delivered app would trump a possible diss and badmouth - but who knows??

I don't recall how many regionals I applied to in all, but I can count on less than two hands the ones which had people I had met or knew. The percentage of regionals where I had met people versus ones where I had not met people was miniscule. The vast majority of regionals to which I applied didn't know me from Adam, which leads me to believe that, in my case, something else was afoot.

I still believe that regionals in particular hire according to a set profile, and the coneheads in regional H.R. lack the wherewithal to accomodate a slightly square peg in their round little hole. Being a saint is part of that profile.

Best of luck to everyone trying to be hired. You need it.

 

[New2Flying]

Who is your friend putting down as a reference at the company he was fired at? From what I know, an employer can only be asked a few questions - if the pilot worked there, how long, what position, salary (if pilot gives consent) and if they would be available for rehire.

I know many companies have gotten sued for telling any more info than that. My current company has a very strict policy on giving out info. In fact, they have a computer based system that gives all the information for employment verification. It does not say terminated on the website either - just when you separated.

Sounds to me like your friend needs to hire a background check company to see what is being said.

As for Skywest putting the resumes up on a board, that to me is dangerous and I suspect if it was public knowledge, that would stop immediately. Seems to me that could be a lawsuit in the making if someone wanted to pursue it. But then again, I am not expert...