Is Mesa cat II certified?

[asayankee]

Trying to get on a flight to IAD with RVR 2200 and captain comes out and says they can't go and have to wait out the weather. Are they not Cat II authorized?

 

[brokedash]

Cat I only

 

[asayankee]

Great...

 

[SoberIrishman]

Just did a round trip there. Pretty messy when we left. Good luck!

 

[asayankee]

TAF shows 1/4sm until 1am too. I think I'm hosed.

 

[SoberIrishman]

Are you going out of atl? There's a delta at 940 out of A3

 

[asayankee]

It's a TDY assignment so I'm forced to wait on the United stuff. Wouldn't break my heart if it cancelled and I got to go home.... It's just a question of how long this thing gets drug out.

 

[SpauldingSmails]

Not meant to be disparaging toward Mesa pilots, obviously they don't make the decision for their airline to seek CATII approval or not, but why the hell would an airline contract to fly a jet with a carrier that isn't CATII!?

Come on, multi-million dollar aircraft that have the landing capability of a Cessna 150. Unbelievable.

 

[WSurf]

2200 RVR??? Many approaches allow CAT 1 to go down to 1800RVR using an AP/FD.... I don't have IAD plates in from of me.

 

[WSurf]

Not meant to be disparaging toward Mesa pilots, obviously they don't make the decision for their airline to seek CATII approval or not, but why the hell would an airline contract to fly a jet with a carrier that isn't CATII!?

Come on, multi-million dollar aircraft that have the landing capability of a Cessna 150. Unbelievable.

Might be the training cost.... How many CATII's do you shoot a year on the east coast?

 

[SpauldingSmails]

I'd say I shoot about 2 CATII's a year, can't say specific to east coast, I go too many places.

Given the competitive nature of the regional market, and the emphasis placed on completion factor that most would assuredly be CATII qualified.

I'm sure with Mesa, being Mesa, that cost containment is the primary driver of not gaining CATII approval, just surprised that the mainline partners are a-ok with it.

 

[LJ45]

2200 RVR??? Many approaches allow CAT 1 to go down to 1800RVR using an AP/FD.... I don't have IAD plates in from of me.

yep !

 

[CFIT]

Maybe the guy was high mins?

If it's anything like SkyWest, there's lots of movement.......

 

[WSurf]

I'd say I shoot about 2 CATII's a year, can't say specific to east coast, I go too many places.

Given the competitive nature of the regional market, and the emphasis placed on completion factor that most would assuredly be CATII qualified.

I'm sure with Mesa, being Mesa, that cost containment is the primary driver of not gaining CATII approval, just surprised that the mainline partners are a-ok with it.

There lies a problem with your thinking. Given the competitive nature of regional market "Cost" is way above CATII qualified. And if you are only doing 2 a year it might be an easy choice to go with the cheaper costing carrier.

 

[jetfueljunkey]

mesa is currently going thru the training cycle to get all cat II qualified. not sure why it took this long....

 

[Carl_Spackler]

Doesn't matter what the current RVR is until you get to the FAF. If the TAF says 1/4 then they can't even launch. They could file to an airport that has a legal TAF and then "divert" to IAD. I bet some DXers would try something like that.

 

[ASApuppy]

Cat II is 80% on the Maintenance side of the house. The mechanics and the parts all need a higher level of certification.

 

[WSurf]

Doesn't matter what the current RVR is until you get to the FAF. If the TAF says 1/4 then they can't even launch. They could file to an airport that has a legal TAF and then "divert" to IAD. I bet some DXers would try something like that.

Good point.... I guess I just remember having to shoot 2 RVR 1800's. But you are right.

 

[Mercyful Fate]

Doesn't matter what the current RVR is until you get to the FAF. If the TAF says 1/4 then they can't even launch. They could file to an airport that has a legal TAF and then "divert" to IAD. I bet some DXers would try something like that.

So, if the taf is not legal to launch as a destination, how the hell you propose it would be legal to list as an alternate?

That is some kooky sh*t right there.

 

[rettofly]

So, if the taf is not legal to launch as a destination, how the hell you propose it would be legal to list as an alternate?

That is some kooky sh*t right there.

Not really.

You don't list is your legal alternate..you just change your destination if the wx is legal for an approach when you get close to it.

Example: KTEX is a popular "change of destination" from KMTJ if you're flying an aircraft of Cat C min approach speed and the weather at arrival cooperates.

 

[ackattacker]

Not really.

You don't list is your legal alternate..you just change your destination if the wx is legal for an approach when you get close to it.

Example: KTEX is a popular "change of destination" from KMTJ if you're flying an aircraft of Cat C min approach speed and the weather at arrival cooperates.

Rettofly, you must be talking private jets.

That kind of thing doesn't fly in the airline world. They do something similar with re-dispatch enroute to save fuel on some flag routes, but never to launch for a destination that's illegal due to weather. I think the FAA would come down on that hard. Your real destination isn't exactly a closely held secret in the world of scheduled airlines.

 

[Mercyful Fate]

Not really.

You don't list is your legal alternate..you just change your destination if the wx is legal for an approach when you get close to it.

Example: KTEX is a popular "change of destination" from KMTJ if you're flying an aircraft of Cat C min approach speed and the weather at arrival cooperates.

Curious on what carriers run their operations like this??

 

[BigPappa]

It is not legal to dispatch that way in the 121 world.

 

[wms]

Might be the training cost.... How many CATII's do you shoot a year on the east coast?

2 in the last week.

 

[WSurf]

2 in the last week.

Well 2 in one week might be all you've done all year. I've diverted once this year and once last year because of our CAT 1 limits. And I flew a ton.

 

[rjacobs]

Doesn't matter what the current RVR is until you get to the FAF. If the TAF says 1/4 then they can't even launch.

Its possible using the RVR rule(which isnt technically a rule I guess), but the flight has to be under an hour in length. At least we can use this at XJT. I have never used it, but it is an option.

The reasoning for this rule, as I understand it, is because of the location of the sensors. The sensors for the METAR/TAF could be on the tower, which could be in the fog/clouds/whatever is causing the low vis to be reported. However the RVR sensors are, obviously, on the runway which could be reporting 6000RVR.

Got to call the tower, get the RVR, get their opinion(since, in theory, they know the way weather behaves at their airport) on whether the low vis will continue, get better, get worse, etc...

 

[propsarebest]

It is not legal to dispatch that way in the 121 world.

It's 100% LEGAL. Smart- no.

There is no rule that says that you can't change your destination enroute (as long as the airport to which you are changing to is listed in ops specs C070)... as long as you have the fuel to fly to the destination thence fly to the farthest alternate listed.

 

[wms]

I think if I was scheduled on flight xxxx to airport A, I wouldn't accept a release to airport B. In 121 I don't think that would be legal unless it was a planned fuel stop situation.

 

[propsarebest]

You are still going to A... just a different A.

 

[Mercyful Fate]

You are still going to A... just a different A.

I would hope and pray I never have you as a dispatcher with that logic