Is I.O.E. considered dual recieved?

[328dude]

This question got brought up yesterday and I wasen't sure. Anybody have the low-down on this?

 

[Sphincter Boy]

I do not know what type of flying you are talking about, but under CFR121 flying I believe it is logged SIC, even if you are doing a Captain upgrade.

I was an IOE checkairman at COEX and I instructed my students to log all their flight time as SIC until they finish the FED ride. Hope this helps.

SB

 

[DoinTime]

If you never recieve any instruction how do you become qualified for a position at a 121 carrier, either SIC or PIC? Yes, your sim training and OE are dual recieved because they are both required to become qualified for the position.

 

[Sphincter Boy]

Its called a FAA Fed ride or a Line Check. That is how you satisfy the 121 regs for air carrier ops. For a two pilot crew under 121, you have to have a PIC and a SIC. So tell me, if the First Officer can't log SIC, who is the Second in Command then?

It is logged SIC. Trust me.

 

[vclean]

I don't believe you can give dual during a 121 dispatched revenue flight.

 

[DoinTime]

Its called a FAA Fed ride or a Line Check. That is how you satisfy the 121 regs for air carrier ops. For a two pilot crew under 121, you have to have a PIC and a SIC. So tell me, if the First Officer can't log SIC, who is the Second in Command then?

It is logged SIC. Trust me.

All due respect but I don't think you understood the original question. The question was do you log dual recieved during O.E.? The answer is yes you do. O.E. is considered a part of the required training to become qualified for a PIC position under 121 and it is performed with company IP's/check airmen (usually on revenue flights) and therefor is considered dual recieved.

I was mistaken in my original post about SIC's. O.E. is not a required part of the training before they become qualified for their position. However, O.E., sim training, line checks, and fed rides are all instruction recieved and should be logged accordingly whether it is required traning or not.

 

[Smoove Ride]

loggin' sim....

i'm sure many will disagree.... but, as i know it, you can only log sim time if you have a type in the aircraft. whenever i went thru the sim i never had any of the instructors sign my logbook, and they never asked. however, all your training is recorded in company internal paperwork.

most who are typed in said aircraft probably don't need to log it anyway... dual or otherwise. -sr.

BTW.... a fed ride is NOT dual given. they usually make that very clear before a checkride... you are PIC for the flight.

 

[frenchy]

IOE is not considered as dual. You are SIC. I had that discussion with the FAA 3 years ago, now sometimes you get different answers from 2 people who work for the same organization, but that answer came from Washington.

 

[328dude]

WOOOOOO!. What's this about logging sim time if your not typed? Anybody can log sim time my friend. So your saying that the sim time you can recieve for your instrument training is of no value? Level D sim time in order to get qualed in a perticuler aircraft is not able to be logged? What FAR's are you reading? The original question was whether IOE counts as dual. Apparently is does not. But, you are able to log any sim time whether your typed or not. I just don;t think it can count towards your total time.

I spent 34 hours in a level D since I was hired and even though it's not worth much except for training purposes, it's still in the book.

Anybosdy else want to jump on this horse?

 

[Smoove Ride]

i won't go into specifics on a topic that's been beat to death in these forums....

yes you can log sim time. yes it counts towards your instrument. do airlines count class 'd' sim time as multi-turbine time towards your total time? probably not. -sr.