Interesting: No rudder needed at all???

[UnAnswerd]

So I went up for my second lesson, and was introduced to making turns. My instructor would position a movable marker on the heading indicator, and have me turn to the heading. We did so at a 30-degree bank. The airplane turned solely with the use of aileron deflection. No rudder was ever needed. I really didn't expect this. Is this typical???? You figure in a left turn the left aileron moves up, decreasing lift on that wing while simultaneously increasing lift on the right wing, resulting in a bank to the left. But you'd think the right wing would also be developing more drag, causing the plane to actually want to turn right. Nevertheless, no rudder was needed. Can somebody please help me understand this?

Any information would be greatly appreciated.

 

[banned username 2]

You turn most likely wasn't perfectly coordinated, but it turns none the less... An airplane turns due to the horizontal component of lift, not the rudder...

Check out this diagram...
http://www.gleim.com/images/aviation/ltf/howturn.gif
and
http://www.centennialofflight.gov/essay/Theories_of_Flight/Performance_Class2/TH25G5.jpghttps://ntc.cap.af.mil/ops/DOT/school/L23CockpitFam/images/turn.gif

 

[SiuDude]

Most trainers require little or no rudder during left turns and a little rudder during right turns at cruise power settings.

 

[Lead Sled]

To put it quite simply (perhaps too simply), rudder input is required to counteract adverse aileron yaw. Older aircraft designs (ie J-3s and 7AC Champs), frequently didn't employ yaw reducing techniques such as differential aileron throws and require much more rudder input as a result. More modern designs such as Piper's PA-28 series are so forgiving that some students never really learn "what their feet are for". Some aircraft, like the MU-2, use spoilers for roll control and consequently have minimal need for rudder input.

Lead Sled

 

[midlifeflyer]

As other pointed out, the rudders are for coordination- to overcome adverse aileron yaw. The airplane will turn with aileron only, but the turn will initially be uncoordinated.

We'll use a right turn as an example. If you look out the window at the nose carefully, you will see the nose drift slightly left as you begin the turn and then "catch up" with the rest of the airplane. It's that initial tendency to drift in the opposite direction that you are correcting with your feet

That "catching up" is part of the airplane's stability. It "wants" to fly coordinated. You can demonstrate the same phenomenon with rudder-only turns. From straight and level flight make a right turn using rudder only. The airplane will yaw to the right, but the airplane will eventually bank

 

[lawfly]

No Rudder

And when you get to ILS approaches, you'll make heading changes of, say, two degrees, with rudder only...

 

[flyer172r]

If you ever fly a glider you definitely will have to use the rudder to make a turn. If you forget to the glider will remind you pretty quickly. Most airplanes are designed to not need a lot of rudder.

 

[Singlecoil]

Or it could be that you have a lousy instructor and he is moving the rudder with his feet while you fly.

Horrible technique on his/her part. You might ask him if he is doing that.

 

[mmmdonut]

And when you get to ILS approaches, you'll make heading changes of, say, two degrees, with rudder only...

No you wont! This is the stupidest thing I have ever heard taught by an instructor. Try doing that in a 757-300 with the passengers in the back moving 30 feet laterally when you yaw the plane about that axis. You'd have puke everywhere.

If you are off the localizer, make a normal turn a few degrees until you are back on and then turn back, applying any correction.

Using the rudder for small localizer corrections is lazy and no one should be teaching that.

 

[Lead Sled]

And when you get to ILS approaches, you'll make heading changes of, say, two degrees, with rudder only...

Bad idea. It works OK with little airplanes, but as mmmdonut said, it's not a good idea once you get into larger aircraft.

Over the years, I've given many instrument competency checks and I've seen pilots try just about every imaginable way to track the localizer. (The wildest was a Cessna 310 jock who insisted on using differential power!) The secret is not to let the error get too big. Stop the error from getting worse, then correct back to where you want to be. With all respect to your instructor, I would have to question his technique for anything other than very minor corrections. Aircraft with flight directors and autopilots fly the localizer with the ailerons. All in all, it's probably the best way to accomplish the task.
Lead Sled