If you're voting YES...

[jetstream]

Maybe its time the pilots dangle a carrot in front of mainline management for a change. We come up with a pay scale for 100+ seat aircraft that is cheaper than the mainline pilots will fly them but more than what we make now. Then we tell mainline if they get scope relief we will fly them for that rate. Fight fire with fire.

The result could be growth and higher income earning opportunities at the regional level.

 

[wms]

I'd say demand equal or more than ml to fly the same planes, then ml will move even more capacity up creating more ml opportunities for pilots.

The regional pilots reps have been distracted by trying to keep regional jobs, not realizing we should be demanding more to make increasing capacity at the ml even more attractive to ml managements.

 

[JustaNumber]

I'd say demand equal or more than ml to fly the same planes, then ml will move even more capacity up creating more ml opportunities for pilots.

The regional pilots reps have been distracted by trying to keep regional jobs, not realizing we should be demanding more to make increasing capacity at the ml even more attractive to ml managements.

That may sound good, but certain interviewing/hiring decisions indicate that they may prefer to hire younger, more pliable type pilots. Translation--the guys making decent money at the regionals now, with experience and a backbone, may not be the ones moving up to ml.

Examples:

--Delta's preference for military pilots. Common sense says it's easier to train a guy to move from flying 121 pax out of C concourse, to flying 121 pax out of B concourse, than it is to train a guy who's used to flying single-pilot single-engine combat trips for the same job. Yet they prefer the military jocks because they have been indoctrinated to say "yes sir! how high sir?!"

--U.S. Airways' requirement for a training cycle within the last five years--keeps out the older, more experienced, more opinionated guys

--every major's preference for dangling interviews in front of pliable regional pilot groups. If you drink the kool-aide, you get the job.

If all regional guys stood to move right into those mainline jobs, regionals would have been integrated into the majors long ago. They don't want certain ones of us on their seniority lists. Be careful what you wish for.

 

[jetstream]

I'd say demand equal or more than ml to fly the same planes, then ml will move even more capacity up creating more ml opportunities for pilots.

The regional pilots reps have been distracted by trying to keep regional jobs, not realizing we should be demanding more to make increasing capacity at the ml even more attractive to ml managements.

You seem to be operating under the assumption that everyone wants to go to mainline. Not so.

 

[PBRstreetgang]

For the skitzo!

 

[1.3XVso]

yes voter have no will to speak up. beside the only answer you will get are:

1 I have to feed my family.
2 I'd rather collect a check than being at the unemployment line.
3 they will shut us down.
4 I'd fly that jet for free.

 

[JustaNumber]

yes voter have no will to speak up. beside the only answer you will get are:

1 I have to feed my family.
2 I'd rather collect a check than being at the unemployment line.
3 they will shut us down.
4 I'd fly that jet for free.

I would like to actually engage some yes voters, to ask them about these things.

1) You get to feed your family with a no vote as well, in fact you can feed them more.
2) There is NO credible evidence that a yes vote will allow you to avoid the unemployment line.
3) There is NO credible evidence that a no vote will cause a shut down. The difference to the company is a 2% cost in ONE department; if that breaks the camel's back, we weren't going to make it anyway.
4) You can pick up as many of my trips as you want, if you transfer the pay to me. Fly the left seat for free!!

 

[Clutch]

The latest Eagle offer could be thrown in there as reason to vote yes

 

[Mickey Mouse]

yes voter have no will to speak up. beside the only answer you will get are:

1 I have to feed my family.
2 I'd rather collect a check than being at the unemployment line.
3 they will shut us down.
4 I'd fly that jet for free.

You are right. Some guys are gay. That doesn't mean the rest of us have to be.

 

[pave driver]

That may sound good, but certain interviewing/hiring decisions indicate that they may prefer to hire younger, more pliable type pilots. Translation--the guys making decent money at the regionals now, with experience and a backbone, may not be the ones moving up to ml.

Examples:

--Delta's preference for military pilots. Common sense says it's easier to train a guy to move from flying 121 pax out of C concourse, to flying 121 pax out of B concourse, than it is to train a guy who's used to flying single-pilot single-engine combat trips for the same job. Yet they prefer the military jocks because they have been indoctrinated to say "yes sir! how high sir?!"

--U.S. Airways' requirement for a training cycle within the last five years--keeps out the older, more experienced, more opinionated guys

--every major's preference for dangling interviews in front of pliable regional pilot groups. If you drink the kool-aide, you get the job.

If all regional guys stood to move right into those mainline jobs, regionals would have been integrated into the majors long ago. They don't want certain ones of us on their seniority lists. Be careful what you wish for.

You obviously have never been a military pilot.... so STFU.

 

[livin'thesim]

Military pilots take much longer to develop the necessary cynicism about management's motives and methods.

That much I can assure you. Fine pilots, they are, but they have not yet learned not to drop the soap in the shower. Also, they are less likely to hold the company to the contract, since collective bargaining agreements are new to them.

If I was trying to improve the QOL of a pilot group, and I had to choose between having an all-regional or all-military pilot group, I know what I would choose.

No knock on their piloting skills at all. It's just that most regional pilots come with the FUPM machinery already installed and running.

 

[1.3XVso]

Military pilots take much longer to develop the necessary cynicism about management's motives and methods.

That much I can assure you. Fine pilots, they are, but they have not yet learned not to drop the soap in the shower. Also, they are less likely to hold the company to the contract, since collective bargaining agreements are new to them.

If I was trying to improve the QOL of a pilot group, and I had to choose between having an all-regional or all-military pilot group, I know what I would choose.

No knock on their piloting skills at all. It's just that most regional pilots come with the FUPM machinery already installed and running.

Problem with the military guys is that they are still mission orientated. They can't see the logic behind frank Lorenzo airline 101 course vs operation condor.

 

[1.3XVso]

I would like to actually engage some yes voters, to ask them about these things.

1) You get to feed your family with a no vote as well, in fact you can feed them more.
2) There is NO credible evidence that a yes vote will allow you to avoid the unemployment line.
3) There is NO credible evidence that a no vote will cause a shut down. The difference to the company is a 2% cost in ONE department; if that breaks the camel's back, we weren't going to make it anyway.
4) You can pick up as many of my trips as you want, if you transfer the pay to me. Fly the left seat for free!!

Just look at the endevour thread and look at what type of faggfets I have to work with.

 

[PBRstreetgang]

It's just that most regional pilots come with the FUPM machinery already installed and running.

And a sidecar of "lets burn this to the ground and see what happens"!
Anybody who has flown for the likes of Hulas or JO, isn't likely to "take one for the team" and help Skrew Skeduling out with an extra round trip.
This industry has created the monsters, and will have to deal with us, our numbers are too great.

 

[livin'thesim]

I hope you regional guys can use part 117 to bring your management "teams" to their knees in frustration.