If you could do it all over again...

[I.P. Freley]

Ah, yes, the enviable "lawyer route".

Here's a quick story. My dad was valedictorian in his high school. Turned down a full academic scholarship to UVA to go to Yale... Graduating top 10%. Got a masters in Elementary Education from Columbia, turning down a full ride to their PhD in Education to go to UVA Law school, where he got a partial scholarship and made law review. Got on with what was then the largest law firm on earth and gave that up after two years to work for what is now a Fortune 15 company as a corporate attorney in their legal department.

And you know what happened?

He got "furloughed" after 20 years with the company. They replaced him with two hot shot young'uns out of law school who didn't make as much annually (combined!!) as he did in 6 months.

So... Guess what! Even a well-educated, talented attorney can end up pounding the pavement just like a 20-year seniority airline pilot. And you know how many jobs are waiting a 50+ year-old corporate attorney, regardless of his qualifications?

Don't assume that taking a "real job" has any more security than an airline. Unless you work for the guvmint, you are always, ALWAYS taking a chance.

Good luck to you.

 

[UALjan15]

LT,

I've got one word for you........PLASTICS

Seriously, though, I've got both of your bases covered. I'm a 18 year pilot, and my wife is on her 6th year as a lawyer. Commercial aviation has chewed me up and spit me out (going on 3 uniforms in 4 years), but that is just bad timing and choices on my part. My 14 years in the AF were great, and I should've done 20, but didn't want to miss out on the great hiring/furlough wave. Listen carefully to those talking about the ANG and Reserves...they speak with great wisdom.

My wife is currently getting the life sucked out of her as a senior associate in a law firm. She has been through 3 firms, and one of them was good, the other 2 horrid. It is a tough job, and she works a hell of a lot harder for her paycheck than I do. There are some good firms out there with quality people that have lives outside of the law, but those places are rare gems. My advice, if you go to law school, is to take a little extra time to specialize. According to my wife, specialties like tax law and intellectual property are always in demand. Her other piece of advice is to work your a$$ off in law school--the school you attend and your standing within your class will follow you around like a jilted lover, at least until you make partner somewhere.

Going forward, I want to treat commercial aviation like a great part-time job. I would also like to pick something completely unrelated to flying that I can also pursue part-time, just in case my third airline flops.

Good luck!

 

[NTXPilot]

Thank you so much for your replies. As far as the internship goes, I'm looking into an internship at the Dallas County DA's office. We'll see if that goes through. It seems the take home message everyone has said so far is do what makes you happy. The lawyer thing...I have no doubt in my mind that it would be difficult, one lawyer I spoke with said that at a "big firm" they would be responsible for working at least 180 hrs per month and many times over 200 hrs per month, and she said plan on working saturdays. That would be rough...no doubt about it. With a BA in Psychology my options would be limited without a masters...so we'll see.
Purple Haze, thanks for your response about life as a pilot in general. I'm really trying to do my research as far as what kind of life I can expect being a pilot. My dad has run his own business for as far back as I can remember, he will support me with anything I decide to do, I know that; I'm know he just wants me to be passionate about what I decide to do. I know I am that way with flying. Thanks again everyone.

Langston "LT" Theis

 

[climbhappy]

NTXpilot....no armchair quarterbacks allowed.....

ever heard the cliche "timing is everything"?....I took my first lesson in '85....
switched careers 13 years later during the height of the dotcom bubble...the career looked something like this.......fly a turboprop...get a type...some PIC turbine and "boom" you're at a major....

things have changed......MAIN POINT: looking back is not an option as a pilot
you go with your gut based on the data you have available. when we decide to go to our alternate, it is based on data.....when we go missed...it is based on data......"at the present time"

You must look forward and be committed and like it, or get out of it...If the airline career path were a straight line, THEN MINE WOULD LOOK LIKE A ROADMAP OF CLEVELAND.

Finally, the spouse must be supportive and if the griping or whining comes nip it in the bud. You must lead your household and set the tone just like the Captain does in the cockpit.

MAY YOUR CAREER PATH BE BLESSED AND MERRY CHRISTMAS!

 

[NEDude]

I would do it again without question. I know many people who have spent their entire professional life in aviation and all they do is talk about the greener grass on the other side.

I have been on the other side, working in marketing and then software development. Yes I made more money than I do now. But here is somthing that may be news to people who have never worked outside of aviation - you still stress about much of the same things you do in aviation. Pay, work rules, benefits, promotions, management decisions - those worries exist in every profession. In both of my previous jobs I worked 8 to 5 M-F, fought rush hour traffic to and from work, spent a minimum of ten days a month on business trips, worked over weekends and late at night to finish projects or reports and stressed over whether my work was going to be good enough and if I would be in line for a pay raise. At work I had a boss two cubicles away from me who monitored my work all day long.

Even though the money was better, I would never want to go back.

 

[sleepy]

Why do you assume that an attroney makes over 100,000 dollars after there second year.It takes a lot of time just to make partner at most firms.People think that all attroneys make bank but its not true.Go look in the yellow pages there are tons of them out there.

I don't assume it, I know it. That is what my wife started at about 7 years ago as a new associate. Yes, I know that there are plenty of solo attornys making a lot less, but if you are a top 10% graduate of a Top 25 law school, that is the going rate in Atlanta (it is much higher in NYC, Chicago or LA).

 

[IAHERJ]

I think many of us (myself included) have turned this into a money thing. Do what is going to make you happy. NEDude hit the nail on the head. Keep asking questions to both attorneys and pilots. You will ge all types of answers. Like someone said earlier, make the decision and always keep a backup plan in mind.


IAHERJ

 

[Jim Smyth]

Quality of life is a big issue for sure. If you go the Airline route, in the beginning you will fly the junior flight schedule which is all the $hit trips while on reserve/callout, on a beeper, nights, weekends, and all the holidays. Then you move up the senority ladder as your airline grows (or down if it shrinks) and get better lines, better vacations, better money until you switch seats and then it starts all over again in the new seat position. So you need to stay flexable and having an understanding wife sure helps!

The good thing IMO is when I finish a trip I put my Kit Bag in Flight Ops and take the bus to the parking lot. I go home for 3-4 days and forget all about work and the Airlines. Alot of jobs you have to take home 7 days a week.

I worked with my lawyer a few years back setting up our finacial future with a living trust. His desk had papers pilled 3 feet in the air and you couldnt see any wood grain! I asked him how long it takes to get that pile down to size. He told me his desk has looked like that for 25 years and it never goes away. Plus he brings alot of it home on most nights. So for me I wouldnt like that very much. But we are all different.

If you are fortunate enough to get with an airline that stays the course and does well over your entire career you will absolutely think its the best job ever. Good pay, Good benefits, Good time off. When you get some senority you will work 3 days on and have 4 days off each week. On your 3 day trips you work 8-10 hours each day. You get to the hotel, go work out, eat dinner with the crew and have a few barely pops. Go back to your room and watch TV and surf the web for a few hours before you retire for the evening. 3 days of that and you get 4 days off to recover. ;-) Pretty good life if you ask me. I know we are not all in the same boat and my road hasnt been all paved with gold but this last paragraph pretty much describes my current airline life.

 

[sleepy]

The bottom line is that nobody ever gets rich working for someone else. If you want to make a lot of money, go into business (the wealthiest people that I know own their own business), or go into something where your pay is based on your own performance (law partner, commissioned sales, etc...) Then if you are good at it and work hard, you income potential is unlimited.


If you love flying, then fly. You can, if you are lucky (and don't chose the wrong job, have a terrorists attack, or high olil prices, or bad management, etc......), make a good steady income and have a pretty good QOL enjoying what you do. You will never get rich flying, those day are long gone.

 

[Guitar Guy]

You have to do something you love, I think. But I guess if one loves money, then find a high-paying career. Being a pilot is tough and you don't make the big bucks starting out like you might as an attorney or a computer programmer. But if being a pilot is what you truly feel passionate and you are realistic in your expectations, then go for it. I had been an aeronautical engineer for 11 years before I switched to flying and there's honestly not a day that goes that I don't say a prayer to God for my job. I still am not making big bucks, but my wife and I are getting by and we are both happy that I've got the opportunity to follow my dream career.

 

[Huck]

Graduated college, engineer for 2 years, went to law school, started flying corporate part time in the second year, graduated with 1500 hours, never took the bar, never looked back.

During law school I clerked for the biggest aviation attorney in the region. I watched him work 60 hour weeks, while watching the associates make $30,000/yr for 5-6 years until a decision was made on partners - and only about 20% got that.

Of the law school friends I've kept up with - only one is successful in the field at a big tax firm. The rest are in various corporate non-law jobs, except one state senator and me - and guess who has the most fun?

You can make a good living in law, but trust me, you will never work harder for every dollar.

 

[klhoard]

I think I'll just stick to playing piano in a house of ill repute. . .

 

[SirFlyALot]

It seems to me that the question you are essentially asking yourself is "what should I do with my life?" Seeking advice from others like you are doing is a great step to take. Just remember that you have to realize what works for one person may not work for you. I'm sure you've heard it before, but you have GOT to know yourself to make a good decision. For some personalities, a career in flying is the answer and they will tell you it's the greatest thing in the world. Other personalities hate it and will tell you to not go near it. There are lawyers out there who wouldn't be happy doing anything else and there are lawyers who regret the day they ever took the LSAT. The key to making a good decision is figuring out where you lie on the personality spectrum and what kind of lifestyle you can live with. A really great book to read to help you examine some of these questions is called "Succeeding" by John T Reed. Here's a link to it: http://www.johntreed.com/succeeding.html.

For example, some personalities absolutely love working in an office environment every day and relish the challenge of office politics. Other people (myself included) cannot stand it and wouldn't work in that kind of environment unless their lives depended on it. I don't think I could be happy working in an office every day from 8 to 5 and dealing with all of the related hassles. In that respect, I'm very glad I chose flying. On the other hand, there are some serious problems with flying as a career: the instability of the industry, the slashed payscales over the last few years, time away from home, the precariousness of your medical certificate, and commuting to name a few. To me, flying is better than most jobs, but not the best. To be totally honest, if I had it to do over again knowing what I know now, I would probably try to go into business for myself or for a very small company. However, that is me and not you. You might detest that kind of work. Again, the key, as is inscribed on the Oracle at Delphi, is to "know thyself".