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Icing questions?

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SDdriver

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 29, 2001
Posts
238
Does anybody know where I can find some really good reading on flying a twin turbine in Icing conditions? I know all of the basics, but I would like to know more about flying in icing conditions from people that are really experienced. I am from the south and we don't get much down here, but this winter I will be fling farther up north and want to get better prepared for what I might encounter. Such as landing on snow covered runways and taking off in icing conditions. The plane I fly is fully certified into known ice with the exception of freezing rain.

Any advice would be appreciated!

SD
 
After the ATR indiana crash, a lot of manufacutuers made aircraft specific iciing videos. I know Embraer made one and I think you can order a NASA video from sporty's or something. The NASA video was actually really informative and discusses tail plane stalls and stuff. Look around for videos and books at pilot shops, and I'm sure you'll find plenty of info out there.
 
NASA Video

The NASA video is excellent. Great because of the actual flightdeck footage during icing upsets. Also, I think it's less than $10.
 
Re: Icing

Cornelius is correct. When I was flying the Mu-2 we had to watch a video of a Mu-2 flying behind a tanker getting covered with a reddish orange water spray that would ice up the Mu-2. Then we talked about icing conditions and got signed off. The company gave us a certificate/card that said we knew what we where doing and we went back to the job of flying crummy under-powered Mu-2's in icing conditions.

Sporty's Pilot Shop sells a small book by Porter J. Perkins and William J. Rieke called In-Flight Icing. Very good and goes into detail about the different types of icing and what to watch out for.

Good luck, RJ
 
Thanks to everyone who responded, I will definitely look into all of that material.

THanks again.

SD
 
As nike says. JUST DO IT. I don't recommend anyone staying in icing conditions no matter what kind of airplane they are flying.
 
Here is a couple of high points for you:

1) Blow your boots and blow them often.
Many pilots used to say to blow your boots after about 3/4" of accumulation has built up. That was true of older boots (like those on DC-3's), but the theory was passed down for generations of pilots even though it was no longer necessary to follow that advice. The newer boots can break up smaller amounts of ice with out the concerns of pushing the ice out without breaking it off (bridging). So when you start to see some build up don't be afraid to blow it off too early. If it all doesn't come off, blow them again, it's no big deal.

2) Limit your use of flaps in icing conditions.
Using your flaps increases the exposure of the underside of the wing to the ice. When ice builds under the wing, in unprotected areas, you can create a serious hazard. That ice cannot be removed by boots. I am not saying that you shouldn't use your flaps, just don't put them out prematurely in the ice or especially when holding.

3) Turn the autopilot off if you can.
Many manufacturers now recommend that you hand fly the airplane in icing conditions. That may be a bit of overkill, however they want you to keep the feel of the flight controls to know when a problem may be starting. This was a contributing factor in the AE ATR and Comair Brazilia crashes. However, IMO, if you are single pilot and in a critical phase of flight, use the autopilot.

4) Avoid Freezing Rain!!!
When freezing rain is occuring, the ice doesn't always freeze on impact with the leading edge. Rain may strike the wing and not freeze until it has trailed back on the wing behind the boot. If this occurs, you will be unable to remove this ice on the top and bottom portions of the wing. This will change the aerodynamics of the wing possibly leading to an early or unexpected stall. The best way to notice this type of icing is if you start to see ice streaks forming on the side cockpit windows. GET OUT ASAP!!

5) Don't hang out in the ice.
Icing of moderate or greater intensity usually is only prevelent in 1000 to 3000 foot bands. You can usually get out of this type of icing relatively quickly. If this heavier stuff goes from the surface to 3000', ask for a quick climb or stay a little higher on arrival....ATC will usually help you out. If its around your cruise altitude range, change altitude. You can usually find an area of no ice or only light icing within 2000' of your current altitude.

Icing will not be a problem, if you avoid it as much as possible. Icing conditions can be very unpredictable. Sometimes you will be in a situation totally amazed by the fact that ice is not forming, other times it will be building for reasons also unexpected. Boots do a fine job of keeping you safe if used in the proper situations and if used correctly. Make sure you check them before takeoff when anticipating icing conditions. Also, blow them every once in a while if you haven't used them lately, expecially in the summer.

Good Luck,
JetPilot500
 
I second the recommendation of the book by Perkins and Rieke -- this is a very quick read that can save your life. I had the opportunity to meet Bill Rieke -- he is THE GUY at NASA on icing research, but the book is very practical (rather than scholarly) and contains info that I've never found anywhere else.

Best to you with the Short -- this is an aircraft that **cannot** tolerate heavy ice loads, per a former test pilot I met.


Excellent training videos available from NASA:
http://icebox.grc.nasa.gov/ext/education/video/video.html

Incredible footage of actual icing test flights.
 
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If everyone here is discussing the same NASA video, it's of a Twin Otter and tailplane iceing. VERY AMAZING footage. They actually get a full tail plane stall condition.

I realize the thread was based on trubine aircraft, but for those operating a piston in ice. I had a friend who managed to bag both vac pumps on a navajo while he was trying to keep up with the ice.... The maintance guru's think he overheated them....
 

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