IBT NJASAP vote

[netjetwife]

More irony to the whole thing is that it is no secret RTS is/was no fan of the IBT. Going in house is actually something both sides agree on is to all our benefit.

I'll wager that soon after this split is official and company recognizes the new in house union that we get a pain free announcement regarding the official merge of NJA and NJI, well before the IBB language takes effect. ...

Sounds like a safe bet to me, Pervis. It's interesting that the independence movement started before the ink was barely dry on the IBB contract. Is it a case of making hay while the sun shines? Positive reinforcement of the idea to pull together as one team? An anticipatory good will gesture to the NJI pilots? A combination of all of the above? Regardless of what happens with NJI, though, a stronger in-house association is the next logical step for a strong Union.

 

[ProFracPilot]

It's interesting that the independence movement started before the ink was barely dry on the IBB contract. Is it a case of making hay while the sun shines? Positive reinforcement of the idea to pull together as one team? An anticipatory good will gesture to the NJI pilots? A combination of all of the above?

As I've stated here before, both publicly and privately, I found the timing of the independence movement VERY interesting (peculiar?). I think to discount the timing of NJA leaving 1108 immediately after the IBB was signed is to overlook the obvious: It was part of the deal. After all, Sanutulli is a smart man and understands that it is NOT in NJA's best interest for all the frac pilots to be in the same union. He also had made promises to NJI pilots that he had to find a way to keep. Enter NJASAP.

The same thing is happening with the majors and the destruction of ALPA. So much for solidarity. It's just bidness, y'all.

 

[HiSpeedFlyer]

As I've stated here before, both publicly and privately, I found the timing of the independence movement VERY interesting (peculiar?). I think to discount the timing of NJA leaving 1108 immediately after the IBB was signed is to overlook the obvious: It was part of the deal. After all, Sanutulli is a smart man and understands that it is NOT in NJA's best interest for all the frac pilots to be in the same union. He also had made promises to NJI pilots that he had to find a way to keep. Enter NJASAP.

The same thing is happening with the majors and the destruction of ALPA. So much for solidarity. It's just bidness, y'all.

Good guess, but a little off target.....

 

[netjetwife]

PFP, please explain why you think having frac pilots in the same Union could be a problem for NJA. Also, what promise does NJASAP allow RTS to keep?

I think his objections are tied to image, rather than inclusion. After all, the NJA and FltOps pilots have been in 1108 together for 2 yrs or so and NJA has had record profits that are definitely in their best interest. Perhaps Mr Santulli thinks an in-house Association is more in keeping with the business and it's pax/owners than the Teamsters' reputation. A lot of people agree with him, including many of the NJ pilots.

With the stigma attached to the IBT, you don't have to look far for a reasonable explanation. The NJA "splinter group" pilots knew that a long contract and a partnership with the Company was as good as it gets-- as far as timing goes. It was a safe bet that RTS would be happy to have the upgraded image. So are the pilots and so are their families.

 

[ProFracPilot]

Also, what promise does NJASAP allow RTS to keep?

The promise that none of the NJI pilots would ever be a Teamster. And other than those who have bid into NJI from the "A" side, none of them are - nor will they be.

 

[fischman]

As I've stated here before, both publicly and privately, I found the timing of the independence movement VERY interesting (peculiar?). I think to discount the timing of NJA leaving 1108 immediately after the IBB was signed is to overlook the obvious: It was part of the deal. After all, Sanutulli is a smart man and understands that it is NOT in NJA's best interest for all the frac pilots to be in the same union. He also had made promises to NJI pilots that he had to find a way to keep. Enter NJASAP.

The same thing is happening with the majors and the destruction of ALPA. So much for solidarity. It's just bidness, y'all.

There is actually a well thought-out timeline as to why the NJASAP leaders decided now was the time. I was told it once, and for the life of me can't remember exactly what it was. If you go to www.njasap.com and click on the "contact us" link you can send that question to them and they WILL answer it.

 

[ProFracPilot]

There is actually a well thought-out timeline as to why the NJASAP leaders decided now was the time. I was told it once, and for the life of me can't remember exactly what it was. If you go to www.njasap.com and click on the "contact us" link you can send that question to them and they WILL answer it.

The NJASAP website is no longer available to me. However, I had previously read what was published on the website when it was available for public consumption.

Don't get me wrong, I'm very happy for NJA pilots and what has been gained through the strength of 1108, the resultant industry leading CBA and now the IBB. But I also refuse to believe that these gains (especially the IBB) are not without some type of concession to NJA management, and Santulli in particular. I see NJASAP being just such a concession that happens to benefit not only the NJA pilots, but management as well. It certainly does not create any additional benefit to the solidarity of 1108. Quite the contrary. It seems the smoke-filled back rooms still exist.

(And please, NJW. I am fully aware of all that is being left in 1108 for the Flight Options pilots - thank you NJASAP. No need to rehash it here).

 

[netjetwife]

Actually, I wasn't thinking of that, PFP. I was wondering if we'd even notice much difference. Those of us who support the Options pilots' right to a contract will still be posting beside you guys after July 11th. Any of the 1108 leaders can pick up the phone and ask an NJASAPer for advice and/or assistance on setting up the office or running the message board and it'll be gladly given. The same for negotiations.

There is a point that I want to reiterate (I don't "rehash"... ) and that is that both sides signed an agreement to work together on future industry projects. That promise was freely given because of the solidarity that already exists. Camaraderie can't be forced; if it wasn't there to begin with then sharing a name wouldn't help. I think you're worrying needlessly, PFP. In reality the NJA pilots have been operating as an independent Union (in all but name) since they formed 1108 anyway. So fundamentally nothing will change. NJW

Yes, NJASAP is certainly a different name,
but the StrongUnion attitude is the same.

That difficult background we all still share,
forges a deep bond when both sides care.

NJA folks --not the IBT-- reached out to you,
and our pilots are the Union so nothings new.

 

[netjetwife]

The NJASAP website is no longer available to me. However, I had previously read what was published on the website when it was available for public consumption. The restricted access was asked for by the Teamsters during the meeting w/NJASAP.

Don't get me wrong, I'm very happy for NJA pilots and what has been gained through the strength of 1108, the resultant industry leading CBA and now the IBB. Thanks. But I also refuse to believe that these gains (especially the IBB) are not without some type of concession to NJA management, If you could read the NJ pilots' board you'd know it was scheduling (the 18 day) a new PTO system, and 100 bases for the post 2005 pilots instead of HBAs. and Santulli in particular. He got what he wanted: the FOs stopped leaving. I see NJASAP being just such a concession If you had witnessed firsthand the excitement when the NJA pilots left 284 (petitions flooded in) you wouldn't call it a concession. The true word is compromise and 1108 was it. A lot of the pilots wanted to leave then and that was way before IBB and any consideration for Santulli. that happens to benefit not only the NJA pilots, but management as well. The NJ pilots were part of the IBT for a long time and though management didn't care for the image they were used to it for sure. Make no mistake; it is a much bigger deal to the pilots who want full credit for their accomplishments and complete control of their dues. It certainly does not create any additional benefit to the solidarity of 1108. I disagree. Having their own local Local ) )office can increase the communication and efficiency of your leadership. That builds solidarity. And when the Ops pilots see new funds put to good use on their behalf I think they'll feel a strong sense of solidarity and appreciation for 1108. Quite the contrary. It seems the smoke-filled back rooms still exist. Sorry to spoil the drama but... it's you who insists on clouding the issue. My husband was there as part of the IBB team and he talked a lot about the atmosphere. It was clearly a brain-storming session with everyone tossing out ideas on how to improve things. A long contract helps the Company so the pilotgroup might as well make it work to their advantage, too. The splinter group was thinking along those lines during IBB when management first laid out the time line they wanted.
(And please, NJW. I am fully aware of all that is being left in 1108 for the Flight Options pilots - thank you NJASAP. No need to rehash it here).

It will make a big difference so it shouldn't be left out when examples are given. Things like newsletters aren't cheap but they're important for building a Strong Union and increasing solidarity. That said, the money was only a minor part of my posts. NJW

 

[AeroBoy]

PFP brings up a point I've been meaning to ask about -- what's with the NJASAP site not allowing any public access? Is the decision to make the WHOLE site password protected likely to be changed anytime soon? Would it really hurt to have a few publicly accessible pages for those pilots who are considering joining NetJets but haven't got on board yet?

Inquiring minds want to know.