How much money is Virgin losing anyway?

[flyipilot]

First off, I am not trying to post a nasty thread against Virgin America. That being said, I just would like to know if anyone has any idea as to how much money VA has lost since they started? I know they have a business plan and expect to lose money for a few years. But, let us be real...they have lost far more than they ever planned. (no one knew oil would be $117). I know VA is trying to avoid posting their results for the first quarter but, hey Mr. Branson...if you want to play airline in our country ...then you should post your reasults like all the other players do. Now, I know you are privately held and might not have to desclose how you are doing..(this I am not sure of). But, you did post results for last year and I am just wondering why you will not now??? Is it because you really do need the 100 million just added to your pot to survive. I am thinking that is the case. In fact, I would bet that you have blown through almost ALL of your start up money and are needing the extra just to survive a tad longer.

If this was not the case, VA would 1) disclose their financial results and 2) not need the extra money because it was never in the orginal business plan.

If I go to a cassino with $100 and win win win..then I do not need to dip into my pocket..even to expland my operation..that should come from the profit.

Anyway, I am just curious as to how Branson can make such a statement that they will never go out of business as he is getting handed yet more loans and debt just to stay alive?? Hmmmmm, is this going to be a fad like Virgin Cola was here?

If they make it great... I do not want any one outof work but, I just want Mr. Branson to play a fair game here. But, if I were losing a ton of cash, I would not let the public know we might not be here either. I think he could actually smile and say nothing is wrong while standing on the deck of the Titanic. (if he was that old... )

 

[CopilotDoug]

not enough? Rising gas prices combined with their greed to be the cheapest will be the financial foot that holds their figurative head underwater until the thrashing stops.

 

[skiandsurf]

If I go to a cassino with $100 and win win win..

If I go to a casino and win win win.....you bet all those around me would know it. If I lost, I would quietly go to an ATM for more money and try to win win win. I would do that until the ATM denied me money. Hmmmm, sounds familiar.

 

[Colonel Savage]

I read somewhere that the $100 million was planned, and that it was provided on schedule.

The last earnings I saw posted by VA was Q3 of '07. I have not seen either a Q4 or a 2007 annual report. Skybus stopped reporting after Q3 '07, and we all know what happened there.

I am sure, however, that the investors that provided the latest 100 million are aware of the airline's current fiscal condition, even if we are not. Earnings reports are not required for a private company, however in order to go public a company must show profits in the preceeding two quarters before making a public stock offering.

 

[Max Powers]

I read somewhere that the $100 million was planned, and that it was provided on schedule.

Yea boss I'm sure they "Planned" to lose a 100 million fracking dollars.......These people have egos the size of Mack trucks the will never admit to a mistake.

 

[Beetle007]

The DOT will release 4th quarter 2007 results on 5/19/2008.

The DOT info is for both public and private companies. I've heard Virgin America is trying to get the DOT to keep their info confidentional and they don't want to play by the rules.

 

[LoveGun]

Maybe this Time Magazine article will answer some of your questions.

 

[Bavarian Chef]

Maybe this Time Magazine article will answer some of your questions.

An excerpt, page 2:

He starts small and usually shares the risk. When he wins, he wins big. Branson's initial $10 million investment in Virgin Blue, for example, earned him a payoff of an estimated $500 million when the company went public, although the stock has since declined. When he fails, he always has an exit strategy. "If it doesn't work, we'll bow out gracefully," he says of Virgin America, where his total investment is $72 million. He put $25 million into Virgin Nigeria, but problems with the Nigerian government contributed to $82 million in losses last year, considerably reducing the profits of Virgin Atlantic, which owns a 49% share. Branson says he may reduce his stake in that business, but he won't cut services at Virgin Atlantic to compensate, and the rest of the airlines are insulated from the loss. When you're investing in airlines, it helps to have a parachute.

My favorite quote in the article:

"When you're investing in airlines, it helps to have a parachute."

Wash. Rinse. Repeat.

 

[flyipilot]

I read somewhere that the $100 million was planned, and that it was provided on schedule.

The last earnings I saw posted by VA was Q3 of '07. I have not seen either a Q4 or a 2007 annual report. Skybus stopped reporting after Q3 '07, and we all know what happened there.

I am sure, however, that the investors that provided the latest 100 million are aware of the airline's current fiscal condition, even if we are not. Earnings reports are not required for a private company, however in order to go public a company must show profits in the preceeding two quarters before making a public stock offering.

I am pretty sure the 100 million was not planned at all. Otherwise it would not be such big news and from the few people I know work there were very surprised and pleased. I am more mixed about it. Yes, money is good but, loans and investments from the outside are not. It would not be great news to see someone invest 100 million into AA. Of course it means they would actually need the money. Just as a sigh of relief came over JetBlue when they got a huge cash infusion from Lufthansa of 300 mil. But, they have to give up a stake and control to get that and stay alive.

I know Branson is optimistic and he has no other choice. I think Branson does not really get the U.S. airline industry and how cut throat it can be. We are a whole different animal than Australia, Europe, and Nigeria. Here airlines will go bankrupt trying to put the other guy out of business and think that is a great way to curb the competition.

I hope that our govt will not fold and allow VA to not disclose their financial losses. UA announced today they lost half a billion dollars in the last 3 months, will lay off 1100 people and make drastic changes or they might not be able to make certain payments. Branson could not pick a worse time to start an airline and I for one am ashamed our govt. would allow yet another entrant into this dismal industry. On top of that they will probably give merging airlines a hard time.

I think it is time for our govt to buy all the existing airlines (3 years and older) and combine them all into one national airline. Then, the TSA, airline, airports, and ATC system can all be one. We already subsidize the airlines anyway. Fares would be reduced to that of mailing a letter , pay can go up (govt employees earn a very nice high ave. plus great retirement!), and since the govt keeps a list of all the pax flying, the airline would have us in the database for ease of checkin! Let our govt deal with the high price of fuel...I bet they would get an incredible hedge...

 

[ultrarunner]

I'm with Flyipilot!