How big are tips in the frac industry?

[GEXDriver]

Good, bad, or otherwise, I believe that is one of the tradeoffs of having a CBA and an organized shop.

That's exactly right. It's only in union shops that you'll find pilots delegated to positions based upon date of hire rather than experience and ability.

 

[Mr. Irrelevant]

Diesel is right on the money.

In the two positions I've had since leaving the military, the company Ops Manuals have specifically prohibited the acceptance of gratuities.

On a personal level, I consider myself to be a professional just as an airline captain is or as is a doctor or a lawyer. I would never consider trying to push an envelope with a tip enclosed under the reinforced cockpit door for the 777 captain who had just given me a smooth flight to Paris. Nor would I attempt to slip a Benjamin into the hand of a cruise ship captain at the completion of a particularly nice Caribbean cruise. I have also never considered tipping my doctor for a good surgical procedure or my dentist for a nice cap or my lawyer for executing a legal document professionally. I think they would be insulted even though two of them are performing "touch" labor.


GV

What you are absolutely completely missing is that since leaving the military you've been employed in positions that probably paid very, very well! Maybe better than that. When you're in a position for the purpose of gaining experience and flight time yet have problems making the rent and bills, a position many charter pilots have been in, you'll accept that $25, or $50.

I'd guess half the positions in the industry pay so little that when supporting a family becomes a going concern, accepting a gratuity is a no-brainer. Not everyone works for Gulfstream or a Fortune 500.

Never let pride get in the way of incurring a late payment fee!

Mr. I.

 

[Ultra Grump]

That's exactly right. It's only in union shops that you'll find pilots delegated to positions based upon date of hire rather than experience and ability.

This shows how little you know about aviation outside your priveleged little world. Try getting on at Skywest, for example, at the top of their list. Or FlexJet, or Citationshares. Oh, that's right, you can't. Even though they're non-union, there's still a seniority list. How about at NJI? Are new-hires jumping straight into G550 captain slots?

 

[netjetwife]

Give up Diesel!.... NJW knows more about your job and the aviation industry then the rest of us.

By the way NJW, how did your husband's election bid go?

I found the whole process disappointing, including the low voter turn-out. I was surprised at the results for several positions (given the contributions made by the candidates) and share the concerns of those who worry that the NJ pilots may be too complacent to stay actively involved these days.

On the other hand, there is a school of thought that things happen for a reason and that things have a way of turning out for the best. It appears that that may be the case for my family. Needless to say, I wish the MEC well and will continue to fully support the NJ pilots in their efforts to improve their career opportunities.

SCT, please don't assign to me claims that I have never made. I do follow along closely and that is all that I have posted.
NJW

 

[netjetwife]

....What I'm annoyed at is njw's exception that we are all so downtrodden that we need these tips to help those poor fractional pilots. Someone has to say that we are profesionals and tips do come but to not count on them and not to add them into some sort of mysterious budget.

When was the last time you tipped your doctor or lawyer for a job well done?

Clarification: Acknowledging the reality that some frac pilots can certainly use the tips does not in any way condone the reason that is the case. I don't see anyone on this thread suggesting that pilots should count on tips. I have specifically stated that the recognition for providing extra service is what matters most to those pilots paid fairly. It is human nature to enjoy being appreciated and I have included that aspect of the issue in my posts.

It's fair to say that I have been a vocal supporter of professional compensation for frac pilots and have repeatedly given them all credit for their skill. Perhaps I haven't posted my tag line enough lately?

PILOTS ARE PROFESSIONALS AND SHOULD BE COMPENSATED AS SUCH

Doctors and lawyers are compensated for performing the duties they are hired for. Pilots who are tipped receive extra for giving extra service above and beyond their job description of flying the airplane. Owners pay pilots to fly them safely--not to carry/load their bags, set out catering, fix them a drink, and arrange their ground transportation. Those pax who tip (whether owners or card holders) are showing their appreciation for the additional personal service that was not required to fly the plane. Etiquette experts say that is the socially correct thing to do. I think that at the very least we can all agree that it certainly is their choice and it should be respected.

In my research on the tipping issue I learned that some doctors and lawyers have received "gifts" showing appreciation and though it isn't money they looked upon it as a "tip". What it all boils down to is that there are people who like to show their appreciation to those who extend them special considerations. Kindness is often rewarded in like fashion and there is nothing wrong with that.

 

[transpac]

PILOTS ARE PROFESSIONALS AND SHOULD BE COMPENSATED AS SUCH

Doctors and lawyers are compensated for performing the duties they are hired for. Pilots who are tipped receive extra for giving extra service above and beyond their job description of flying the airplane. Owners pay pilots to fly them safely--not to carry/load their bags, set out catering, fix them a drink, and arrange their ground transportation.

Unless things have changed since I left, the pilots are paid by NJA, not the share owners. And, NJA certainly does expect pilots to provide services in addition to flying the airplane. Any pilot who refuses to set out catering, load bags, etc. will have a short and unhappy career at NJA or at any other fractional.

 

[SCT]

"Owners pay pilots to fly them safely--not to carry/load their bags, set out catering, fix them a drink, and arrange their ground transportation. Those pax who tip (whether owners or card holders) are showing their appreciation for the additional personal service that was not required to fly the plane. Etiquette experts say that is the socially correct thing to do. I think that at the very least we can all agree that it certainly is their choice and it should be respected."

Njw- this statement shows how ignorant you are about corporate and fractional aviation.

 

[Muddauber]

NJW -

If I give my passengers a particularly nice ride from DAL to LAS should I be disappointed if they don't pass the hat and give the flight attendants a healthy tip for the cockpit crew?


Muddy

 

[netjetwife]

My post is based on common sense. Most travelers accept the fact that it is their personal responsibility to take care of their own luggage, refreshment needs and transportation arrangements for after they land. My husband tells me of pax that have expressed their gratitude for all of those extra services. The point is that what seems routine to the pilots may be perceived differently to those who choose to tip. Since you disagree with my logical deduction, SCT, feel free to explain just why some of the pax tip....

 

[netjetwife]

Muddy, according to the etiquette rules the answer is-- not unless you performed personal services for them outside of the cockpit as most of the frac pilots do who fly planes without FAs. Good manners, which are at the root of tipping, dictate that it is rude to take the help of others for granted and likewise offensive to appear grasping and only motivated by money.