Horrible Airline Experience

[eggman76]

I am a frequent visitor to this site, but have never posted. I enjoy reading about the professional side of the flying business. I regularly fly a PA-32 for business and pleasure, and have no desire for a professional flying career.

I would like to post my experience and get comments on whether I have the right perspective. Comments are welcome. Please do not take me as a troll, I genuinely interested your comments on my experience.


My family was traveling from Orlando to Des Moines on a Delta flight operated by ASA/Comair that had a layover in Atlanta. I had my wife, 2 1/2 year old and a 5 month old - we had three tickets for the 4 of us. We made the first leg fine and completed the journey to our connecting gate approximately 45 minutes before the scheduled departure of the last leg to Des Moines. Checked in at the counter and got a gate check tag for the stroller - the gate attendants knew we were there. Twenty minutes before scheduled departure and before the gate attendants had opened the doors for boarding the two year old decides to fill her diaper. Wife and I decide that it would be better to change her in the terminal rather than on the aircraft. 17 minutes before scheduled departure the doors are opened and boarding begins. 10 minutes before departure, my wife had not yet returned to the gate when the gate attendant called final boarding. I was at the door with my 5 month old in my arms telling the attendant that my wife was walking back from the restroom, I could see her. The attendant says, "sorry, schedule to keep", and shut the door. This was 8 minutes from scheduled departure time. This effectively stranded us in the airport overnight. The gate attendant check her computer and sad that the best she could do was a 11:40 pm booking the next night - 32 hours later. We ended up taking our complaint through a couple levels of supervisors until we got booked into Cincinatti for a 2:00 am arrival this morning, with a 9:20 am departure to Des Moines this morning. The airline was kind enough to pay for our hotel. I am writing this in the same clothes I put on 30 hours ago after getting the kids down for their naps. I am still beside myself that this could possibly be company policy at Delta/Comair/ASA, to close the gate on a family of passengers when all of them were accounted for and the agent knew the people were in the terminal.

First off I do appreciate the needs of the airline to keep to the schedule - especially during the holiday. I also appreciate that this same airline had experienced a computer meltdown the previous week and that everyone was frantic. I'm also aware that Delta employees are facing an unplesant employment situation and facing salary/wage reductions.

However, IMNSHO the actions taken by the Delta employees in this case are illustrative of the reason this airline is in trouble. I will NEVER fly with them again. My company will never use them for travel again. And I am going to happily relate this tale to anyone who will listen.

 

[gordon24]

Sounds like a typical ATL gate agent. Sorry that had to happen to you. Please, I repeat, please do not give Delta any more of your money. Stay away from them at all costs.

 

[surplus1]

Could you be a little more specific? Who closed the door on you, was it Delta, Comair or ASA? I know they're all supposed to be "the same" but the fact is they are not.

 

[eggman76]

Could you be a little more specific? Who closed the door on you, was it Delta, Comair or ASA? I know they're all supposed to be "the same" but the fact is they are not.

It was ASA.

While I was getting the midnight reroute to CVG there was another flight that was to go to Rochester. The flight could not depart due to a missing FA. The gate attendants had made many calls to the folks waiting that the FA was on the way and the flight would leave. After two hours of waiting the FA arrives, 10 min later the captain comes to the gate counter and tells the staff that he is timed out and the flight can not leave. I was standing at the counter when this happened. There was a guy going to Rochester that heard it too and announced it to the waiting area. I thought there was going to be a riot, the Comair staff had to call security, very ugly.

 

[Angus]

I would like to post my experience and get comments on whether I have the right perspective. Comments are welcome. Please do not take me as a troll, I genuinely interested your comments on my experience.

It remains to be seen if you are "genuinely intrested in comments on your experience".

My family was traveling from Orlando to Des Moines on a Delta flight operated by ASA/Comair that had a layover in Atlanta.

Actually two completely different companies employing seperate employees.

Wife and I decide that it would be better to change her in the terminal rather than on the aircraft. 17 minutes before scheduled departure the doors are opened and boarding begins. 10 minutes before departure, my wife had not yet returned to the gate when the gate attendant called final boarding. I was at the door with my 5 month old in my arms telling the attendant that my wife was walking back from the restroom, I could see her. The attendant says, "sorry, schedule to keep", and shut the door. This was 8 minutes from scheduled departure time.

There is one obvious truth to your story, and that is the part where you state "Wife and I decide that it would be better to change her in the terminal rather than on the aircraft." That was a bad decision. Where do you think the agents should draw the line. Here is a suggestion.... why don't you camp out at a typical airline gate for just 1 day abd see the amount of personal B.S. that passengers pull 10 minutes prior to every flight. If they wait for you to change the diaper, what about the couple that are only 2 minutes behind you changing their kids diaper etc. etc.

The airline was kind enough to pay for our hotel. I am writing this in the same clothes I put on 30 hours ago after getting the kids down for their naps.

You're lucky... because you certainly were NOT entitled to a free room. Also... don't whine about being in the same clothes... after all YOU decided it more importatnt to get on the internet and rant about you and your self serving, self righteous attitude, rather than change your clothes.

I am still beside myself that this could possibly be company policy at Delta/Comair/ASA, to close the gate on a family of passengers when all of them were accounted for and the agent knew the people were in the terminal.

No... lets get the FACTS here..... if they were "accounted for" they would have ALL been on the aircraft or at least AT THE GATE. YOU and one child were at the gate... but your wife and other kid WERE NOT.

First off I do appreciate the needs of the airline to keep to the schedule - especially during the holiday. I also appreciate that this same airline had experienced a computer meltdown the previous week and that everyone was frantic. I'm also aware that Delta employees are facing an unplesant employment situation and facing salary/wage reductions.

No... you obviously DO NOT "appreciate the needs of the airline to keep to the schedule". They did exactly that and you are here "beside yourself".

Also... you cannot even identify the airline... so how do you know about a "computer meltdown" and wage concessions.

I will NEVER fly with them again. My company will never use them for travel again. And I am going to happily relate this tale to anyone who will listen.

Yeah... right... blah blah blah.

 

[babydoll]

That is absolutely insaine. From what I understand, Pilots for Delta are getting a 32% pay cut, I dont know about the rest of the Delta/ASA employees, but irregardless, that was uncalled for. I had a similar situation happen while I was flying American from Miami, FL to Ohare. Only I was the one in the restroom. The people behind the counter were nice as can be, but complete morons. The flight that I was schedualed to be on, kept on changing gates, one end of the airport to the other. Great workout though. So I ended up at the original gate, have 15 minutes to board, and I hear last call, fortunately the attendants opened up the door for me, only I had to do a little leap onto the aircraft.

 

[GogglesPisano]

Closing the door 8 minutes prior and not letting someone out who's standing right there is pretty Nazi.

There'so excuse for that.

I doubt you'd see that at SWA.

 

[deez_nutz2000]

Hey Angus,

Didnt they make a movie about you? You tubby little bastard.

 

[chperplt]

I doubt you'd see that at SWA.

You don't think so? Watch the airline show on A&E and you'll see SWA using some horrible customer service skills. They seem to piss on customers just as much as the rest.

 

[ksu_aviator]

The biggest problem I see here is the lack of communication between the airline and its customers. If the airline didn't schedule the pushback at the same time as the displayed departure time there wouldn't be a problem. What I mean is, schedule time for the gate agent to close the door and move back the gate. As it stands right now, all airlines expect that to happen simultaneously. It can't, that just isn't physically possible. The thread starter could have made a better decision had he know that the door closed 10 minutes prior to departure he probably wouldn't have had his wife go change the baby. Most of us pilots know this because we either work for an airline, have worked for an airline, or travel on airlines way to often and know all the ins and outs. Most passengers don't and that is where the problems start.

 

[ksu_aviator]

You don't think so? Watch the airline show on A&E and you'll see SWA using some horrible customer service skills. They seem to piss on customers just as much as the rest.

SWA goes out of their way, even on airline, to accomodate passengers. The problem is that passengers have unreasonable expectations.

 

[chperplt]

As it stands right now, all airlines expect that to happen simultaneously. It can't, that just isn't physically possible.

Not true at all. Airlines have signs up everywhere that states when the doors close. On mainline flights that is generally 10 minutes before departure and on connection, or express flights, it it betwen 6-10 before scheduled departure.

Should they have held this flight for this guy, absolutely. It's the last flight of the night during a busy travel week. A little customer service goes a long way... on both ends.

 

[eggman76]

Thanks all for the discussion.

 

[chperplt]

SWA goes out of their way, even on airline, to accomodate passengers. The problem is that passengers have unreasonable expectations.

Did they go out of their way to accomodate the family of 5 returning from a Florida vacation to find their connection flight oversold and seats given away? SWA knew this family was inbound from JAX and knew exactly when the flight was going to arrive. Did they go out of their way to hold boarding cards for them? No... they had to drive from BWI to upstate NY to get the kids home in time for school.

You're kidding yourself if you think SW is any more passenger friendly than anyone else.

 

[eggman76]

Closing the door 8 minutes prior and not letting someone out who's standing right there is pretty Nazi.

There'so excuse for that.

I doubt you'd see that at SWA.

I enjoy flying SWA. I appreciate their flexible ticketing, good service, and family friendly policies. I fly commercial 25 - 30 times/yr and SWA is a favorite.

 

[FL000]

It appears that you just got a gate agent that was having a bad day...or a bad life, not sure which. I wouldn't say it's routine, but we frequently hold flights a couple of minutes for passengers that are accounted for, but just not right there right then. In fairness, most of those cases are due to late inbound flights or a connecting bag, but I personally don't see any reason that you should have been shut out of that flight. Had I been your captain and known you were there, I would have come up there and gotten you myself. I think most others at ASA would have done the same.

We run late for all sorts of stupid reasons, and sometimes for no reason at all. 8 minutes is plenty of time to account for you and your family, your bags, put you in the paperwork and get you in your seats. Some of our gate agents see the passenger as a hinderance to their smooth days. I'm sorry you found one of them.

A couple of years ago, we had a company-wide overhaul of boarding, paperwork, etc., and 10 minutes was an absolute cutoff for being at the gate and ready. However, in the customer service business, you just can't have it black and white like that. There has to be exceptions and use of common sense. I don't see any reason to treat a customer like that.

I'm sorry you had such a bad experience at ASA. I think if you give us another chance, you'll find that we have a great set of workers in all facets with the ordinary and unfortunate exceptions you'll find at any company in any industry.

...oh, and don't pay any attention to that bonehead Agnes above who somehow fails to see who keeps him employed. If he flies for ASA, he if DEFINITELY an exception. But I don't think he does.

 

[semperfido]

flying on the airlines is not fun at all

 

[eggman76]

It remains to be seen if you are "genuinely intrested in comments on your experience".

I really do. This forum provides access to the opinion of professional aviators, dispatchers, etc. I feel really burned by this experience and want to get another perspective. I lurk here mainly because I am a 250 hr pilot and find that I can occasionaly learn something, but do not feel that I have acquired enough experience to give thgouhtful opinions on many of the topics discussed. I am currently enjoying the ongoing avbug/TonyC/mmmdonut debate on UnAnwsered.

Actually two completely different companies employing seperate employees.

I understand this however, my ticket/boarding pass says, "DELTA". I do not know enough about the internals of the Delta/Comair/ASA partnership. That is one of the reasons that I asked this question. To learn.

There is one obvious truth to your story, and that is the part where you state "Wife and I decide that it would be better to change her in the terminal rather than on the aircraft." That was a bad decision. Where do you think the agents should draw the line. Here is a suggestion.... why don't you camp out at a typical airline gate for just 1 day abd see the amount of personal B.S. that passengers pull 10 minutes prior to every flight. If they wait for you to change the diaper, what about the couple that are only 2 minutes behind you changing their kids diaper etc. etc.


I was at the gate, next to the door, my wife was in view of the agent 8 minutes before scheduled departure. This is the circumstance I'm inquiring about. I can't tell my two year old when to take a crap. We're working on it, but we're not there yet.


You're lucky... because you certainly were NOT entitled to a free room. Also... don't whine about being in the same clothes... after all YOU decided it more importatnt to get on the internet and rant about you and your self serving, self righteous attitude, rather than change your clothes.

I was a being gentleman and let my wife have the shower first. I was not in the mood to unpack and we had just gotten the kids down for their naps. I decided to sit at the computer and vent.

No... lets get the FACTS here..... if they were "accounted for" they would have ALL been on the aircraft or at least AT THE GATE. YOU and one child were at the gate... but your wife and other kid WERE NOT.

Given.

No... you obviously DO NOT "appreciate the needs of the airline to keep to the schedule". They did exactly that and you are here "beside yourself".

However, what I'm asking is should they do this at the expense of a customer for life?

Also... you cannot even identify the airline... so how do you know about a "computer meltdown" and wage concessions.

I was speaking of the Comair computer meltdown last week when they went over their 32,768 schedule changes their computer allowed. The 1,100 cancelled flights and 30,000 passengers stranded. I was trying to show sympathy to the employees by recognizing the week I'm sure they've been through.



Yeah... right... blah blah blah.

I'm stating fact, I will not travel Delta ever again. I have many other airline options and my job allows flexibility of schedule. I approve travel for the company that I work for and a memo to staff that they will not be reimbursed for travel on Delta is all it will take.

 

[eggman76]

It appears that you just got a gate agent that was having a bad day...or a bad life, not sure which. I wouldn't say it's routine, but we frequently hold flights a couple of minutes for passengers that are accounted for, but just not right there right then. In fairness, most of those cases are due to late inbound flights or a connecting bag, but I personally don't see any reason that you should have been shut out of that flight. Had I been your captain and known you were there, I would have come up there and gotten you myself. I think most others at ASA would have done the same.

We run late for all sorts of stupid reasons, and sometimes for no reason at all. 8 minutes is plenty of time to account for you and your family, your bags, put you in the paperwork and get you in your seats. Some of our gate agents see the passenger as a hinderance to their smooth days. I'm sorry you found one of them.

A couple of years ago, we had a company-wide overhaul of boarding, paperwork, etc., and 10 minutes was an absolute cutoff for being at the gate and ready. However, in the customer service business, you just can't have it black and white like that. There has to be exceptions and use of common sense. I don't see any reason to treat a customer like that.

I'm sorry you had such a bad experience at ASA. I think if you give us another chance, you'll find that we have a great set of workers in all facets with the ordinary and unfortunate exceptions you'll find at any company in any industry.

...oh, and don't pay any attention to that bonehead Agnes above who somehow fails to see who keeps him employed. If he flies for ASA, he if DEFINITELY an exception. But I don't think he does.

Greatly appreciated.

 

[TurboS7]

From a father of 7 next time change the baby in the airplane and hand the diaper to the Flilght Attendant.

 

[eggman76]

From a father of 7 next time change the baby in the airplane and hand the diaper to the Flilght Attendant.

I had a bad experience once on a flight to Copenhagen when I was 23 - 24. I had just started to eat the meal when a mother right behind me decided to change a diaper. I got the first bite to my mouth and caught a potent wiff of the diaper at the same time. Darn near puked right there.

I try to parent responsibly, and as part of that the wife and I try to do the dirtier parts of parenting out of public spaces. I realize that most people cringe when they see parents walking on a plane with kids. We try very hard to make it as pleasant as possible for all involved.

 

[Vik]

There was another thread by someone trying to non-rev on Delta in which I posted about how horrible they truly are even to frequent flyers like mylself that fly 100,000 miles a year with them.

[I stopped flying Delta some time ago]

Today I had yet another experience with them and this time not by my choosing. My father would like to travel with me on my business trip and my airline of choice, British Airways, is full.

My father is a Delta frequent flyer as well and stopped flying them around the same time as me, but today decides he would like to fly Delta. So we called up Delta, got the seats, 1st class, the tab came to almost $10k, paid it and to my surprise, they wanted us to go to John Wayne Airport (SNA) to pick up a physical ticket. No e-ticket. Yeah, ummm, OK .. are these guys still in 1925 or what? BA, LH, VS, AA, all have etickets .. it saves them money.

So we head on over to SNA. Its only 10 mins from my house. We get into the 1st class line, wait, wait, make eye contact with both workers behind the counter -- HEY, WE'RE HERE -- they continue to take 2-3 more sets of economy pax. Finally, 10-15 mins later, one of them calls us up.

OH -- YOU'RE NOT BOOKED ON THE 3PM FLIGHT? Its only 1:45 as per my watch. You'll have to go stand at the end of the econ line and wait for all the pax ahead of you in line before we can issue your ticket.

So without a word, we're at the end of the econ line. As luck would have it, one more agent showed up so the wait in the econ line was around 10 minutes.

Finally we get up there, and she issues the ticket. It took her less than 5 minutes to print out the ticket and we were out of there.

Anyway, I put that huge $10k ticket on my AMEX and once my father's round trip is over, I'll dispute some of that charge. AMEX allows you to dispute charges based on poor service and I'll probably dispute $2k of the nearly $10k RT fare.

Airlines make most of their profit from around 10%-15% of their customers that pay full, unrestricted fares. Thats people like myself.

Anyway, my father has now joined me as never wanting to fly DAL again. I pretty much had it when they lost my sister who at the time was only 12 or 13 at ATL .. yup, good ole ATL. Worst airport ever. I think all of DAL's problems are rooted at ATL. I rarely have issues at other airports.

Anyway, it felt great to vent -- thank you for starting this thread. I never start threads b!tching about terrible service as a pax but since your brought it up

I am a frequent visitor to this site, but have never posted. I enjoy reading about the professional side of the flying business. I regularly fly a PA-32 for business and pleasure, and have no desire for a professional flying career.

I would like to post my experience and get comments on whether I have the right perspective. Comments are welcome. Please do not take me as a troll, I genuinely interested your comments on my experience.


My family was traveling from Orlando to Des Moines on a Delta flight operated by ASA/Comair that had a layover in Atlanta. I had my wife, 2 1/2 year old and a 5 month old - we had three tickets for the 4 of us. We made the first leg fine and completed the journey to our connecting gate approximately 45 minutes before the scheduled departure of the last leg to Des Moines. Checked in at the counter and got a gate check tag for the stroller - the gate attendants knew we were there. Twenty minutes before scheduled departure and before the gate attendants had opened the doors for boarding the two year old decides to fill her diaper. Wife and I decide that it would be better to change her in the terminal rather than on the aircraft. 17 minutes before scheduled departure the doors are opened and boarding begins. 10 minutes before departure, my wife had not yet returned to the gate when the gate attendant called final boarding. I was at the door with my 5 month old in my arms telling the attendant that my wife was walking back from the restroom, I could see her. The attendant says, "sorry, schedule to keep", and shut the door. This was 8 minutes from scheduled departure time. This effectively stranded us in the airport overnight. The gate attendant check her computer and sad that the best she could do was a 11:40 pm booking the next night - 32 hours later. We ended up taking our complaint through a couple levels of supervisors until we got booked into Cincinatti for a 2:00 am arrival this morning, with a 9:20 am departure to Des Moines this morning. The airline was kind enough to pay for our hotel. I am writing this in the same clothes I put on 30 hours ago after getting the kids down for their naps. I am still beside myself that this could possibly be company policy at Delta/Comair/ASA, to close the gate on a family of passengers when all of them were accounted for and the agent knew the people were in the terminal.

First off I do appreciate the needs of the airline to keep to the schedule - especially during the holiday. I also appreciate that this same airline had experienced a computer meltdown the previous week and that everyone was frantic. I'm also aware that Delta employees are facing an unplesant employment situation and facing salary/wage reductions.

However, IMNSHO the actions taken by the Delta employees in this case are illustrative of the reason this airline is in trouble. I will NEVER fly with them again. My company will never use them for travel again. And I am going to happily relate this tale to anyone who will listen.

 

[dispatchguy]

Most airline ticket counters, not all, have a sign that says that when it is displayed, they are working current passengers for current day flights only, and that if you need future ticketing, you have to wait.

The agent working the counter doesnt know how long youre going to take, from 10 seconds to 45 minutes, and, to be honest, passengers leaving today and now have to have priority. You're not leaving now, you can wait.

For future reference, if you called reservations, they can look in the reservations computer and see what times future-day ticketing is recommended or not recommended.

 

[mmmdonut]

Next time change the diaper onboard and hand the dirty mess to the F/A.... I hear they love that.

 

[FL000]

From a father of 7...

SLC based?

 

[eggman76]

Most airline ticket counters, not all, have a sign that says that when it is displayed, they are working current passengers for current day flights only, and that if you need future ticketing, you have to wait.

The agent working the counter doesnt know how long youre going to take, from 10 seconds to 45 minutes, and, to be honest, passengers leaving today and now have to have priority. You're not leaving now, you can wait.

For future reference, if you called reservations, they can look in the reservations computer and see what times future-day ticketing is recommended or not recommended.

I think you misunderstood my post. I was booked weeks in advance, had boarding passes and was at the gate. They shut the door with my wife 300 ft away and in view of the gate agent. Like I said we had checked in at the gate with the same lady who shut the door, she had given us a gate check for a stroller.

 

[TDTURBO]

Eggman, why didn't you take your airplane? I fly from Chicago to Key West, Orlando, Phenoix and just about everywhere else every month. No way would I ever entertain the thought of flying commercial. I only own a 182rg too. I do know for the MDW-ISM trips, it's a lot faster private vs. commercial. Was it the wx? I still would have waited it out.

 

[Vik]

I was there at 1:45PM an the next Delta flight was 3:55PM or something like that, and there were half a dozen people in line.

Also, there was NO ONE in the 1st class line. Regardless, I know how things are supposed to work, and they work well at other airlines including American. They can't be this screwed up at Delta.

Also, I spoke to reservations and found out when the next flight out of SNA was going to be and asked if around 1:45PM was a good time to go before I left b/c I didn't want to get in anyones way. I live 5 mins away, so it didn't matter when I went there.

Most airline ticket counters, not all, have a sign that says that when it is displayed, they are working current passengers for current day flights only, and that if you need future ticketing, you have to wait.

The agent working the counter doesnt know how long youre going to take, from 10 seconds to 45 minutes, and, to be honest, passengers leaving today and now have to have priority. You're not leaving now, you can wait.

For future reference, if you called reservations, they can look in the reservations computer and see what times future-day ticketing is recommended or not recommended.

 

[Vector4fun]

My parents are retired DAL, and it's truly a shame that their customer service has deteriorated to this. Eggman, I might be able to understand the Gate Agents actions if it were 10:00 am and there were a half dozen later flights they could have put you on. To do that when there was no chance of putting you on a later flight was downright mean. I can't even remember how many flights I've sat on that were held at the gate 10-15 minutes for passengers who were in the terminal but not yet at the gate to board.

And regarding SWA, I was on a SWA flight several years ago out of DAL that was already running 40 minutes or so late due to T-storms. We finally taxied, and got nearly to the departure end of the runway, but returned to the Terminal to pick up a half dozen connecting passengers who had just arrived, because it was the last flight out that night. When the crew made the announcement, sure there were a few groans in the cabin from folks in a hurry, but I was amazed at the obvious care for their customers there in Dallas. I also know that very, very, rarely happens, because I've worked enough Ground Control to know.

Of course, probably only SWA could put six more folks on, compute the new W&B numbers, fix the paperwork, and still get airborne in 20 minutes....

Ladies and Gentlemen, welcome to Air Travel in the 21st Century....

 

[Stifler's Mom]

Eggman check your IM.

Wake up folks, we are in the business of moving people from A to B. This Gate Agent sounds like he/she needs to not be in a Cutomer Service oriented profession.