History repeats itself. Pilots start thinking DOH matters

[FDJ2]

I would agree that USAir in this case midjudged the arbitraters decision but I still think DOH, Length of service does matter.

You are correct that DOH/LOS matters, it's part of the equation, but so does Category/status ratios and yes, career expectations.

Although all seniority integrations will turn on their own facts, of those three elements, DOH/LOS, Category/Status and career expectations, without question the biggest factor and the one which has dominated recent seniority list integrations has been Category/Status.

Career expectations and DOH/LOS have played minor roles, but their value is uncertain. If DOH had a standard value across the industry, we'd all upgrade within the same time period into the same equipment. The DOH of a pilot at CMR, for example, does not carry the same weight as the DOH of a pilot at DAL. Career expectations can also play a minor role, but the equity that has carried the most weight is the value of the job brought to the merger, Category/Status.

 

[becket]

I don't think he is whining. I think he is just having fun getting your blood pressure to spike.

How's that "binding thingy" working out? Furloughed yet?

The binding part is working out flawlessly. You cowards have spent multiple millions of dollars on a sham lawyer and foregone hundreds of millions of dollars in increased pay and benefits just to evade the "binding thingy".

Permanent Injunction.

You've failed every step of the way...that's an odor should should have grown accustom to by now being a AAA guy and all.

And no, I am not where you were when this merger was announced, hundreds of pilots deep in furlough.

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

Is it true that the final arbitrated award to USAIr was worse than what the USAir guys would have gotten in the negotiated integration?

What were the main differences between the award and the last positions in the negotiations?

Thanks!
cliff
NBO

 

[Turtle21]

The binding part is working out flawlessly...

Yeah I noticed.

 

[TWA Dude]

Is it true that the final arbitrated award to USAIr was worse than what the USAir guys would have gotten in the negotiated integration?

I'm afraid your question is moot because there was no negotiated integration and never would've been. The sides were too far apart.

What were the main differences between the award and the last positions in the negotiations?

The arbitrated list was very close to the AWA final position (relative seniority) and very far from the East's demand for DOH with meaningless conditions and restrictions.

 

[michael707767]

You are correct that DOH/LOS matters, it's part of the equation, but so does Category/status ratios and yes, career expectations.

Although all seniority integrations will turn on their own facts, of those three elements, DOH/LOS, Category/Status and career expectations, without question the biggest factor and the one which has dominated recent seniority list integrations has been Category/Status.

Career expectations and DOH/LOS have played minor roles, but their value is uncertain. If DOH had a standard value across the industry, we'd all upgrade within the same time period into the same equipment. The DOH of a pilot at CMR, for example, does not carry the same weight as the DOH of a pilot at DAL. Career expectations can also play a minor role, but the equity that has carried the most weight is the value of the job brought to the merger, Category/Status.

FDJ2 has it exactly right. The value of the job you bring to the merger is and should be the overriding factor.

 

[JoeMerchant]

Career expectations and DOH/LOS have played minor roles, but their value is uncertain. If DOH had a standard value across the industry, we'd all upgrade within the same time period into the same equipment. The DOH of a pilot at CMR, for example, does not carry the same weight as the DOH of a pilot at DAL. Career expectations can also play a minor role, but the equity that has carried the most weight is the value of the job brought to the merger, Category/Status.

"Career expectations" are a moving target that are in the eye of the beholder....There are pilots who were hired at Southern to fly Metros who then became Northwest pilots and now Delta pilots...How do they compare to the "career expectations" of TWA, Pan Am, and Braniff pilots?

When I hired on at ASA, there were no jets, and I hired into a plane that had 15 seats with no pressurization,FA, or lav.....Now ASA has only jets, including jets that are as big as the smallest DC9 that Northwest had...

Times change, and expectations change...Nothing is certain, except the fact that your expectations in this business will change and the end result will never be what you "expected"....Time for a different benchmark....

 

[eaglesview]

FDJ2 has it exactly right. The value of the job you bring to the merger is and should be the overriding factor.

What exactly do you mean "the value of the job you bring to the merger?" How do figure that out?

 

[General Lee]

"Career expectations" are a moving target that are in the eye of the beholder....There are pilots who were hired at Southern to fly Metros who then became Northwest pilots and now Delta pilots...How do they compare to the "career expectations" of TWA, Pan Am, and Braniff pilots?

When I hired on at ASA, there were no jets, and I hired into a plane that had 15 seats with no pressurization,FA, or lav.....Now ASA has only jets, including jets that are as big as the smallest DC9 that Northwest had...

Times change, and expectations change...Nothing is certain, except the fact that your expectations in this business will change and the end result will never be what you "expected"....Time for a different benchmark....

Joe, your lack of a college education and your 3 DUI's are really the main reasons why you have not and cannot leave ASA, right?


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[JoeMerchant]

Joe, your lack of a college education and your 3 DUI's are really the main reasons why you have not and cannot leave ASA, right?


Bye Bye--General Lee

Actually, I have the college degree, and no DUIs or failed checkrides....I haven't left ASA, because I have never applied anywhere else...Hard to get hired somewhere when you haven't applied...

Now would you care to address the issues I raised?