"heavy" callsign usage

[Turtlesfly]

oh, ok I didn't know that about the -200 . . . thx

 

[Spooky 2]

Brett- I think you're right about the ATA 757-200's. I was in the conga line at LGA the other day and they cleared an ATA 757 "Heavy" for takeoff. I looked extra hard to make sure it wasn't a -300 and it wasn't. I know your run of the mill Delta/United 757-200 tops out around 230,000 MTOW. So they must have a mod on the 752 to make it over 255k. Interesting.

Okay, here is the no BS on the Heavy B757-200. There are a few, not many B757-200's that gross out at 255.5K. I can can tell you the N756AF is a 255.5K airplane and N757AF is a 255.0K airplane. Just to keep it simple, the crews use the Heavy term for both aircraft. The fear was that someday someone would tip over behind one of these airplanes and having not used the Heavy call sign would have incriminated the flight crew. Easier to say Heavy every time as opposed to say, "gee what airplane am I in today"? End of story.

 

[DC8 Flyer]

So, do you know many guys who don't include "heavy" in their call sign? Are they being lazy? Figuring it doesn't really matter that much anyway? Trying to keep their calls short to avoid congestion on the radio, kind of like GA guys only use the last three digits in subsequent transmissions to ATC after using the full call sign first?

It is laziness, on my part at least. Including the heavy callsign doesn't make anyone else, other than a controller who already knows I'm a heavy, do anything different. If you are waiting behind me for takeoff, you can see I am a heavy, if enroute and our paths cross, ATC will move whomever to get required seperation, etc etc.

 

[fokkers&beer]

Dr Procs correct for the rest of the world, but not the US, or Canada. The US requires that heavy is used for all communications, and Canada only requires it for the initial call. The rest of the world uses ICAO rules, so you only use heavy with approach and tower.
If I don't use it in the US, its probably because I've been in working in Europe, and just forgot where I was.

 

[bubbers44]

I've sometimes flown trips that sometimes swap a 757 for a 767. The flight number is the same but one is heavy and one isn't.

 

[Sampson]

Here's the skinny

The Heavy call sign is used by all A/C that are certificated north of 255,000 including 757's due to the wake turbulence issue with those aircraft, regardless of the current weight of the A/C, IE if your on a ferry flight and are light as a kite you still use the Heavy call sign.

It is only used for tower, approach and departure.

It is basically a backup reminder for the controller ( as its already designated on your strip) to give adequate separation. Center controllers give everyone the same separation so no need for the Heavy call sign.

It also helps the pilot behind you adjust accordingly to stay out of your wake zone, IE flying one dot high or slowing down.

Hope this helps.

 

[fokkers&beer]

I will disagree with Sampson on this issue. In the US, you must use Heavy with all calls, tower, ground, clearance, appoach, departure, and en route controllers. If you forget often times they will respond to you with the heavy call sign (or on a clearance frequency they will ask if you are heavy sometimes).
In Canada when you check in with a facility you will make the initial call with the Heavy callsign, thats it, you don't need to tell Moncton you are heavy every call.
In Europe, and the rest of the world I do agree with Sampson, the call is only for tower, approach and departure. They are the only ones you will use the heavy callsign for.

F&B

 

[time builder]

It also helps the pilot behind you adjust accordingly to stay out of your wake zone, IE flying one dot high or slowing down..

Another instance comes to mind where a captain told me to waive the wake turbulence advisory when we were given "position and hold" after a departing learjet. Our plane was larger, so not much risk.

Sure enough, the controller cleared us for takeoff right away. If it were a "heavy" we could not waive the advisory, from what he told me.

 

[IHateMgmt]

You got a wake turb advisory from an Lear?

 

[time builder]

You got a wake turb advisory from an Lear?

Yep, out of BUR at 3AM.

 

[MikeMD80]

-ATA's 757s are certified heavier than standard 75s, thus the "heavy" call sign. -300s are the same.

- As for non-heavy 757s, they get there own classification for wake separation. Heavys get 5 miles in trail, 757s get 4 miles on take-off.

As for the use of "Heavy" in the call sign, only in the terminal area. No one gives a sh*t how much you weight in the flight levels, in trail spacing is always the same .

 

[Midnight Flyer]

As for the use of "Heavy" in the call sign, only in the terminal area. No one gives a sh*t how much you weight in the flight levels, in trail spacing is always the same .

I agree with you 100%, but why do we always hear people calling Center at altitude using "heavy" after their callsign when we're at FL330?

 

[filejw]

The people saying "heavy" with the center are just uninformed I guess or lazy. "Heavy"is not used in most of Europe the ME or parts of Asia that I have flown in.

 

[fogrunner]

Do none of you have a hobby? Two pages and 28 posts about the heavy call sign.

Originally Posted by fokkers&beer
I will disagree with Sampson on this issue. In the US, you must use Heavy with all calls, tower, ground, clearance, appoach, departure, and en route controllers. If you forget often times they will respond to you with the heavy call sign (or on a clearance frequency they will ask if you are heavy sometimes).
In Canada when you check in with a facility you will make the initial call with the Heavy callsign, thats it, you don't need to tell Moncton you are heavy every call.
In Europe, and the rest of the world I do agree with Sampson, the call is only for tower, approach and departure. They are the only ones you will use the heavy callsign for.

F&B

What he said is correct basically right out of the FOPM.........

 

[UndauntedFlyer]

The Polish airlines flight flies every day from Chicago to Warsaw as "a lot too heavy." Lott airlines flt 2 is a B767.