Heard it all now

[flydog]

Timebuilder

Its true about Singapore and many other European and Asian airlines. A lot of the carriers have cadet programs where they basically take people from zero or low time, train them and put them on the line flying the heavy iron.

British Airways has the same type of programs as does Lufthansa. My FO was called for interviews at Alitalia and British Airways when he had less than 1000 hrs.

The mind set in Europe is different. They are very selective about who they hire and dont care about total time. The theory is that it is better to train someone from scratch to your standards than to hire someone with 10,000 hrs of ingrained bad habits.

If you can learn a foreign language and spend about 12k and a year abroad on your JAA licenses you may find it easier to get on with a foreign carrier.

The pay scale at some of these carriers especially the government owned union carriers is also outstanding and in some cases better than the US with MD-80 Captains making over $200,000 USD and MD-11 Captains over $400,000

www.pprune.com has info about the selection process at some of these airlines

 

[Spencer]

25k hours

That does sound awfully high. I know guys that retired from United after 30 years that don't have that much time. Where do they get these guys and how good can an 80 year old guy be

 

[ArcticFlier]

25000 to sit left seat...............What a load of crap. They must be wadding up equipment left and right (or the owner is a cheap-a@@.

IMHO
AF

 

[capt_zman]

The owner is current long-time American, the chief pilot is retired Delta and the other captain is retired TWA. I'm just wondering what the defibrillator policy is.

Do they have AARP fuel discounts that I don't know about?

 

[Timebuilder]

Could be "DNR".

 

[Captain Over]

"The owner is current long-time American, the chief pilot is retired Delta and the other captain is retired TWA. I'm just wondering what the defibrillator policy is."

I'm pretty sure they needed 25,000 hours before they could fly PIC for their airlines, didn't they? Sounds like a load of you-know-what. I would say it's either a typo, or they just don't like you and it's a nice way of saying hit the road.

BTW, how much time do Air Force One PICs have? Or Bill Gates' pilots?


..."the mins are 1500 for PIC Jet with Simuflite and no mins for FOs"

Looks like I meet the FO mins. Where do I sign up?

Andy

 

[capt_zman]

I thought the same thing, that maybe it was a nice way to say see-ya. But I checked with another FO and he said that policy was correct (he had ~10k hours).

I'm sure it's monetary related via the insurance premium. By the way, have you ever flown corporate ops with a freshly retired airline pilot? It seems to be a pretty large learning curve to come back to the reality of flight planning, fuel planning, weather, filing, weight and balance and flying regs, among other things. No disrespect here, just my experience.

 

[ILS JNKY]

AARP

I once over heard this older guys talking in the locker room about insurance rates that they got from AARP, they went on on to say how they got screwed on insurance rates,.

may be the owners are getting their insurance from AARP bendover was here.

25,000 sounds a like just ploy to keep people a way .

 

[enigma]

Was offered a position flying a BE400 today for a 91/135 company. When I inquired about upgrade, I was told that "due to insurance mins, we have a 25,000 hr requirement for PIC's."

Ok, I'm 32 and if I fly 1000 hours per year, I can upgrade when I'm 54. Geez, I must be special to land a winner like this.

What does this job pay? I have no problem with their requirements if they are paying accordingly. If they pay the usual 135 peanuts, either they are smoking crack or our profession is in worse shape than I thought.

8N

PS. I imagine that the PIC requirement is for street captains. It seems likely that the upgrade requirements are probably less once you've become a proven employee. Good Luck.

 

[FlyinBrian]

The owner is current long-time American, the chief pilot is retired Delta and the other captain is retired TWA. I'm just wondering what the defibrillator policy is.

It sounds to me like three retirees running a business. They plan on being the only captains in the company, and they probably get a huge insurance break by requiring so much time. Seems like an ideal way to retire if you ask me.

My question is unless you can fly the 91 legs, why would anyone want to be an SIC at a company where it is certain you will never sit in the left seat. (Then again, I am waiting to get called back to Eagle.)

 

[Austpilot]

Timebuilder, Fosters?

C'mon mate - Fosters is the crap we export to you guys! I prefer Crown Lager myself - seriously, they are bright young guys that come into the airline - they get through the flight training, and beleive me, Singapore Airlines does not skimp on training! they are sharp young guys that can fly as well, and the good thing about Singaporean kids - they have a good grasp of English!!

Till they get mixed up with us Aussies, then they learn all the bad habits!

 

[bobbysamd]

Foreign airline flight training

It is true that comparative low-timers find their way into foreign airline cockpits. Singapore is only one example. I've been around a couple of foreign airline training programs. You could call it reverse P-F-T.

Many foreign airlines will have would-be pilots apply to them. The airlines screen the applicants and hand-pick the best ones. Then, they train them, on the airline's nickel at its own school, or through a contract program at someplace like FlightSafety. It's extremely serious and structured training. Not a moment is wasted. Airline training captains are breathing down the students' necks at all times. The end result is a very well-trained pilot.

I worked in the Alitalia program at FlightSafety. Asiana, Air France, Air Inter and Tyrolean had contract programs at FlightSafety when I worked there ten years ago. At times, FSI has trained Saudia students. I believe that Swissair was the first foreign airline to establish a contract program at FSI. Dunno what's happened to it after Swissair went bankrupt.

 

[banned username 2]

Was offered a position flying a BE400 today for a 91/135 company. When I inquired about upgrade, I was told that "due to insurance mins, we have a 25,000 hr requirement for PIC's."

Ok, I'm 32 and if I fly 1000 hours per year, I can upgrade when I'm 54. Geez, I must be special to land a winner like this.

At my Company (Fortune 100 Corporation) we fly many high level people around, several are Billionaires (yes, Billion with a B)... we require 5,000 hours minimum for a Captain slot (Falcon 900EX)... and typically require 4,000+ for F/O's (Falcon 50EX).... 25,000 is a load of crap... We fly all over the world (no offense but I don't hear many BeechJets over the Atlantic or on the Pacific routes)

I am 34 and I fly 500 hours a year, I will be 70 before I have 25,000 hours... I plan to retire at 55 or 60 at the latest... If I hit 20,000 hours I will be lucky...

Either these guys are stiffing you or it was a simple mistake... hopefully the latter....

Fly Safe!

 

[DC9stick]

The point was made these are three long term airline guys that are the captains no one else will ever upgrade until these guys decide to retire or can no longer get a medical. Insurance rates only go so low and the lowest rate break is probably around 10K depending on time in type, a pilot with a lot of time in type would bottom out the rate at less total time. These guys just want you to know you will never be a captain! I seriously doubt they will type you either.

 

[Austpilot]

Wee willy wankers!!!

I once applied to an operator in the Australian outback that had Piper Cheiftains and he used them on mail runs etc. He required, 2500 hrs total,1000 multi-engine command, etc - I thought the PA-31 must of been really hard to fly with those requirements - turned out when I did get to fly one it was obvious the old coote was full of **CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED**e. This was before the days of big insurance premiums etc.

Nope, I stand by my claim, it's a classic case of the right hand doing the five knuckle shuffle on the urine pump, and the good thing is - the crusty old buggers that promote or condone this kind of moronic attitude are by and large nearly at retirement age.

An aeroplane is an aeroplane - your a wanker if you think that no one else can do the job, I mean they did teach an ape to fly a Mercury space capsule.

 

[Timebuilder]

....and just like Atta, the monkey didn't have to know how to land the thing.

 

[con-pilot]

I’m going to have to agree with overall opinion of most of the respondents on this thread.
I will turn 55 on the 29th of this month. I have been flying professionally since I was 19. That’s 36 years (You would have thought I would have figured it out by now).

Anyway, I have right at 22,000hrs. For any organization to require 25,000hrs for a PIC is plane stupid or there is some type of hidden agenda.

Someone pointed out how low the flying time is for command with a lot of foreign air carriers. They are quite correct. Check out the accident reports on some Asian airlines in the last couple of years. (I aint going to name names, ok.)