Good read regarding Dubya

[Timebuilder]

I am not at all sure that Bush is doing a great job overall, but I do know that the Democrats selecting Kerry was a very stupid thing to do . . . . a tax-and-spend liberal from Massachussetts versus an incumbent is a pretty certain recipe for another four years for Bush.

The plan is to run the Hildebeaste for VP. This should be FUN.

 

[merikeyegro]

...

I think it's funny to watch a bunch of groupthink-prone conservatives create conflict. Not more than maybe 2 responses that weren't from rabid GWB fans and you guys are just drooling for more meat. I don't get it. However, you DO support GWB, so I can understand your plight.

If GWB is "easily" in the top 5 presidents, who are the other 4? Let's see...GWB drops bombs on two countries and...whoa! He's the greatest president EVER!!! You will look back in a few years and wonder where in the heck that comment came from. His record does not prove much in the form of competence.

Anyone can drop bombs and talk tough. All it takes is power to do that. It takes true leadership to be great. By your logic, Kim Jong Il is a great president.

I hope I can laugh all the way home from the polls in November. The death of "compassionate conservatism" is imminent...

 

[Timebuilder]

I think it's funny to watch a bunch of groupthink-prone conservatives create conflict.

I gave up groupthink, even before I went to the county seat to change my party affiliation in 1994.

And your excuse is.......?

GWB drops bombs on two countries and...whoa! He's the greatest president EVER!!! You will look back in a few years and wonder where in the heck that comment came from. His record does not prove much in the form of competence.

"Competance", in the mind of a democrat liberal, is to blindly adhere to ALL of their policies. I don't adhere to ALL of the republican policies (like immigration) but I can see the dangers in the ideas of the opposition party.

I am very happy that Kerry is the best the dems can run.

"Sauce, for the goose"
-Spock, The Wrath of Kahn

 

[mar]

Fair and Balanced...

chawbein--I have to admit I didn't find exactly what I thought I would find.

Brief summary: Bush completed UPT. Bush checks out on F102. Bush transfers, doesn't take a medical exam, is suspended from flight status.

Several different sources all cross check that information. There's obviously a lot of slant on those facts from both the Left and the Right.

I'll just leave it to you to read between the lines.

Here are links to the most factual and unbiased reports I could find.

Washington Post timeline of Bush's Natl Guard service

Similar story by Information Clearing House

Interesting PBS interview with Bush and others

Military records of GWB obtained thru FOIA

 

[bramafear]

If it looks like a dimwit.
And walks like a dimwit.
And talks like a dimwit.

No, you have it all wrong!

It's that smirk that makes him a TWIRP!

Can we go back to Junior High so I can beat that out of him?

 

[bart]

Management Consultant? Let me guess, you are a glorified computer programmer for someone?

 

[bramafear]

Who's the Real GWB?

Maybe the straight Bush is the problem: stiff, smirky, jerky, and above it all.

We need to campaign for Bush's going away party, and get Bush comode hugging drunk again. The bathroom is definately a safe place for him to be Then later, we can just wash & rinse his persona away

[ I don't care to spell correctly when talking about Bush, just in case I did ]

 

[bramafear]

Ha Ha Ha

Bart Quote:

Management Consultant? Let me guess, you are a glorified computer programmer for someone?

No Bart, however I do have 16 years in that field, but trying to save my company from Bondholders, I shifted and learned at their expense. We were the CIA behind the suits because we cared not just for our jobs, but for the other 3,000 folks that would be impacted and were because of the lack of leadership and accountability.

Bart, If I ever win the lottery big time, you bet I would bring it back again -- in a heartbeat.

Passion, Bart, passion, nothing else.

 

[Timebuilder]

My information is that GWB did not take the flight medical because they were no longer going to give instruction in the 102, and there was therefore no need for continued currency in the airplane, and Bush would not remain in the guard long enough to warrant the expense to the government of re-training in the new airplane.

This was an interview with a former guard member from that time period. I don't have the name.

 

[chawbein]

Mar -

I appreciate your honesty. I couldn't find anything in the records to state that dubya did not become a combat-qualified F-102 pilot. Therefore, he would have to be qualified to fly the jet by himself. That's the only point I wanted to make.

 

[bart]

Both the f-102 and f-106 were single pilot aircraft...

 

[Freddie Spencer]

Hey orphant,

Have you ever heard of TF-102, think the AF had over a 100 of them so bush could have IP's babysit him.

 

[merikeyegro]

who cares?

If GWB got a 1200 on his SAT, what's the huge deal? That's not exactly Einstein-like intelligence. It means he's a smart guy. That would be roughly equivalent to a 27-28 on the ACT. Respectable, but those scores don't get you into a good number of state schools, let alone Yale. Think he had a little help? Osama bin Laden sounds like a smart guy. Dimented as all get out, but probably kinda smart. So was Ted Kasczynski. Just because you're smart does not mean that you're a good leader.

People compare Bush and Hitler because of the remarkable similarities as to how they both became popular, their political rhetoric and word choice, their religious beliefs and practice habits, and even born-again status (no drinking, etc.). Equating Bush to Hitler is not tantamount to equating the USA with Germany. There is a huge difference between 1930s Germany and 2000s USA, notably the accessibility of information, strength of governing constitution, and opposition to the ruling party. Also, sheer size of country has to come to mind, as 1930s Germany was much easier to rule in totality (based on executive forces needed and population) than is the 2000s USA. The economic conditions are also different, as Germany was in a deep depression (jobless recovery does not count). Nonetheless, Bush and Hitler share similar roots and, thus, the comparison. Type the two into Google and read a bit. Intriguing, but a little bit of a stretch. Take it for what it's worth.

Homeboy that wrote that article leans a bit right (like Ann Coulter leans a bit right), if you ask me. Again, take it for what it's worth. Let Fox News have the article. I'm sure they'll enjoy it.

 

[Timebuilder]

That would be roughly equivalent to a 27-28 on the ACT. Respectable, but those scores don't get you into a good number of state schools, let alone Yale. Think he had a little help?

No.

When Bush took the test, he had no help, no Kaplan, and a tougher test. That means that adjusted to today's available test prep and lowered standards, he would indeed be admitted to any college he chose.

People compare Bush and Hitler because of the remarkable similarities as to how they both became popular, their political rhetoric and word choice, their religious beliefs and practice habits, and even born-again status (no drinking, etc.).

No again.

People who compare Bush to Hitler are striving to make a connection that cannot be made.

Go back to listening to "just a couple of things considered."

 

[mar]

And now, the shamelss speculation

Chawbein wrote, <<Mar. I appreciate your honesty.>>

Yeah, well, some of us would never survive an actual political campaign (relax, I'm only talking about myself).

But to be *perfectly* honest, I think the point of my "Quack, Quack" post (not my proudest flightinfo contribution BTW) still stands.

The facts are GWB received some very expensive pilot training and then asked for and received a transfer!!!

Doesn't that strike anyone as odd?

His transfer was approved, yes, but to remain on flight status he needed to subject himself to medical examination.

<shameless speculation commences here>

A medical examination that would include a drug test...?

Ok, look. Even if he wasn't strung out on drugs perhaps he simply got flakey about flying fighters as an indefinite career path--as he indicated on a letter signed by him (included in the FOIA documents).

Either way, it doesn't speak much to his character.

I don't care how you slice it, GWB ain't cut from the same cloth as his dad or Teddy Roosevelt or JFK or any other leader who has actually heard a bullet tear the air next to his ear.

It's pathetic to watch the Republican die-hards follow the bull thru the china shop straightening up the mess and blaming the shopkeepers for putting china in such a stupid place...

Let's ALL BE HONEST!!!
How about that for a change?

 

[Typhoon1244]

Re: And now, the shamelss speculation

...some of us would never survive an actual political campaign (relax, I'm only talking about myself).

No, you're talking about all of us. Doesn't matter if you're a Democrat or a Republican--or even an independent--even if your record is clean, the other side will either (1) twist something from your past into something sordid, or (2) make something up. It's how politics works in this country now.

When you start diggin into this slime, you find an equal amount of evidence to support Kerry being a hero and a traitor. Same for Bush. And Clinton, and the other Bush, and Reagan, etc., etc., etc. Stories from the past have become so clouded that I might just have to decide who to vote for based on [gasp!] real issues!

 

[Typhoon1244]

Re: And now, the shamelss speculation

Let's ALL BE HONEST!!!
How about that for a change?

Carter tried that. Look where it got him.

 

[Timebuilder]

It's pathetic to watch the Republican die-hards follow the bull thru the china shop straightening up the mess and blaming the shopkeepers for putting china in such a stupid place...

Actually, it is pathetic to see people continuing to try to de-construct the current president because they are fresh out of new ideas. They don't like a conservative president, and they think that the powerful forces in this country, including the very wealthy democrats, will allow them to change America into a socialist paradise.

News flash: it isn't going to happen anytime soon.

Only by continuing to try to nip away at Bush do these fresh-out-of-ideas-people have any chance of beating him. So they infer, imply, and outright lie in order to make a real leader appear less than he is.

Only by this method could they win, and they are 100% fine with this subterfuge.

 

[mar]

You mean the lust in his heart?

Carter. I consider him to be the *most* productive former president.

And talk about a proven leader: Naval Academy grad. and commander of a nuclear sub.

A weak president? Well if we're talking about legacies his will be a story that spans decades.

Not a four year term.

 

[dpilot_citation]

Kerry supporters please respond

A REAL Vietnam Vet's Perspective



Open Letter to John Kerry:

My wife had rotator cuff surgery earlier this year, and the recovery is terribly painful. Then, she developed a staph-epi infection, and they had to cut the same scar open and operate on her again. Just thinking about the pain and anxiety of facing that painful surgery a second time in the same wound, makes me cringe. That experience, however pales in comparison to what I am going through right now, in my heart.

The old hurts are surfacing and the feelings of betrayal by fellow citizens, and their leader stirring them up, are breaking my heart again. I am being cut in the same scar. How did we who served in Vietnam suddenly become cold-blooded killers, torturers, and rapists, of the ilk of the Nazi SS or the Taliban? Most of us were American soldiers who grew up idolizing John Wayne, Roy Rogers, and all the other heroes. That was why I volunteered. But for political expediency, John Kerry has rewritten history, again.

After spending only four months in the country of Vietnam, John Kerry testified before Congress in 1971 with these exact words about incidents he supposedly witnessed or heard about from other vets: "They personally raped, cut off ears, cut off heads, taped wires from portable telephones to human genitals and turned up the power, cut off limbs, blown up bodies,
randomly shot at civilians, razed villages, shot cattle and dogs for fun, poisoned food stocks, and generally ravaged the countryside of South Vietnam."

I was a green beret officer who volunteered for duty in Vietnam and fought in the thick of it in 1968 and 1969 on a Special Forces A-team on the Ho Chi Minh Trail, just for starters. We were the elite. We saw the most action. Everybody in the world knows that. But we did not just kill people, we built a church, a school, treated illnesses, passed out soap, food,
and clothing, and had fun and loving interaction with the indigenous people of Vietnam, just like our boys did in Normandy, Baghdad, Saigon, and everywhere American soldiers ever served. We all gave away our candy bars and rations to kids. Our hearts to oppressed people all over the globe.

My children and grandchildren could read your words, and think those horrendous things about me, Mr. Kerry. You are a bold-faced, unprincipled liar, and a disgrace, and you have dishonored me and all my fellow Vietnam veterans. Sure, there were a couple bad-apples, but I saw none, and I saw it all, and if I did, as an army officer, it was my obligation to stop it, or at the very least report it. Why is there not a single record anywhere of you ever reporting any incidents like this or having the perpetrators arrested? The answer is simple. You are a liar. Your medals and mine are not a free pass for lifetime, Senator Kerry, to bypass character, integrity, and morality. I earn my green beret over and over daily in all aspects of my life.

Eight National Guard green berets, and other National Guard soldiers, have been killed in Iraq and Afghanistan, and you totally dishonored their widows and families by lumping National Guard service in with being a draft-dodger, conscientious objector, and deserter, just so you can try to sabotage the patriotism of our President who proudly served as an Air National Guard jet pilot. I have a son earning his green beret at Fort Bragg right now, and his wife serves honorably in the Air National
Guard, just like President Bush did, and I am as proud of her as I am my son. I volunteered for Vietnam and have no problem whatsoever with President Bush being our Commander-In-Chief. In fact, I am proud of him as our leader.

John Kerry, you personally derailed the Vietnam Human rights Bill, HR2883, in 2001, after it had passed the House by a 411 to 1 vote, and thousands of pro-American Montagnard tribespeople in Vietnam died since then who could have been saved, by you. Earlier, as Chair of the Senate Select Committee on MIA/POW Affairs, you personally quashed the efforts of any and all veterans to report sightings of living POW's, when you held those reins in Congress. You have fought tooth and nail to push for the US to normalize relations with Vietnam for years.

Why, Mr. Kerry? Simple, your first cousin C. Stewart Forbes, CEO, of Colliers International, recently signed a contract with Hanoi, worth BILLIONS of dollars for Collier's International to become the exclusive real estate representative for the country of Vietnam.

"Hanoi John," now that it works for you, you beat your chest about your Vietnam service, but to me, you are a phony, opportunistic, hypocrite. You are one of those politicians that is like a fertilizer machine: all that comes out of you is horse manure, and you are spreading it everywhere. Medals do not make a man. Morals do.

Don Bendell
Canon City, Colorado

Don Bendell served as an officer in four Special Forces Groups, is a best-selling author with over 1,500,000 books in print, a 1995 inductee into the International Karate Hall of Fame, and owns karate schools in southern Colorado.

B]Something to think about![/B]