Global 7000 & 8000

[X-rated]

Great conversation, gents. Bombardier has a history of overstating performance estimates. Also, demand seems to be soft for the 5000 and 6000, in spite of the lower price, somewhat to my surprise. I agree with Gutshot in every respect. However, if I were an owner, I would go with the Global, but most owners prefer Gulfstreams and their brand loyalty is very strong. Again, to my surprise.

I'm not taking one side over the other. It just seems to me long term Gulfstream guys often like to slam the Global. I'm here to tell you that's not justified. I do agree Bombardier likes to overstate the Range. When I got typed in the Global, The XRS was supposed to fly 6150nm. The 6000, which is the same airplane except for the Avionics, has been revised down to 6000nm. The reality is probably closer to 5800 for an average crew. But, since we rarely stretch the range that tightly, I don't care that much. I love the quiet roomy cockpit and crazy short field performance.

The whole Large cabin market has slowed and resale values even for the G650 are dropping quickly. China is cracking down on graft and inappropriate use of funds which is slowing deliveries there. Russia has also slowed to to a crawl due to sanctions and the devastated economy. Oil rich nations are also feeling the pain due very low energy prices. So, it's not a great environment for Large Cabin Business Jets. From my non-scientific observation, Gulfstream dominates in the US, and Global seems to do significantly better overseas. I see a lot of Globals compared to Gulfstreams in Europe and the M.E. I'd guess that's why their business seems to be falling off faster right now. But, make no mistake, the entire large cabin environment is feeling the pressure.

 

[SkyGlider3]

Warren Buffett

I truly believe WB has the best interest of both NetJets as a profitable Company and the Pilots . He's not become wealthy by being foolish . He knows there's a Pilot shortage coming and I believe will act accordingly . A raise is coming . It's just matter of how much . Naturally he wants to delay that as long as possible without it backfiring .

 

[gutshotdraw]

I truly believe WB has the best interest of both NetJets as a profitable Company and the Pilots . He's not become wealthy by being foolish . He knows there's a Pilot shortage coming and I believe will act accordingly . A raise is coming . It's just matter of how much . Naturally he wants to delay that as long as possible without it backfiring .

Pretty much incorrect in every respect.

Warren Buffet doesn't give a crap about his employees (at ANY Berkshire Hathaway subsidiary), the company DOESN'T believe a pilot shortage will affect them, and their last pay proposal doesn't even make up for the inflation since the contract became amendable.

We had to publicly embarrass Buffet enough to broom his hatchet man lawyer. Apparently, he needs a reminder of that embarrassment in order to open his wallet a bit wider. He's going to get that reminder next Thursday.

And what this is doing in THIS thread is beyond me.

 

[Pervis]

Gut, true to form we see yet another troll with few posts, only to post when the need for FUD presses the EMT. Don't feed him.

 

[gutshotdraw]

Gut, true to form we see yet another troll with few posts, only to post when the need for FUD presses the EMT. Don't feed him.

True enough.


Apropos of the original thread, @X-Rated, would it interest you to learn that the Gulfstream Demo 650ER was photographed on the ramp at Bridgeway in CMH today?

Things that make you say "hmmmmmmmmm..."

 

[X-rated]

True enough.


Apropos of the original thread, @X-Rated, would it interest you to learn that the Gulfstream Demo 650ER was photographed on the ramp at Bridgeway in CMH today?

Things that make you say "hmmmmmmmmm..."

Very interesting. The long range high speed Globals won't be available for a very long time, so G650's make an awful lot of sense. I wonder how quick they could get their hands on some. Seems like there are plenty of of folks looking to flip their deliveries, and the market is softening big time. It could certainly happen though it would probably be hard to get typical NJA pricing in the short term.

That could potentially open the door to the 500/600's too. Is the new regime more Gulfstream friendly? I heard there was a petty big falling out between NJA and Gulfstream.

 

[gutshotdraw]

Very interesting. The long range high speed Globals won't be available for a very long time, so G650's make an awful lot of sense. I wonder how quick they could get their hands on some. Seems like there are plenty of of folks looking to flip their deliveries, and the market is softening big time. It could certainly happen though it would probably be hard to get typical NJA pricing in the short term.

That could potentially open the door to the 500/600's too. Is the new regime more Gulfstream friendly? I heard there was a petty big falling out between NJA and Gulfstream.

There was a HUGE falling out between Sokol and Gulfstream and that antagonism was carried forward by the idiot lawyer. The cancellation of NJ's standing orders and the tone of the re-negotiations on maintenance by Sokol REALLY pissed off the now-retired CEO of Gulfstream. The cancellation fees NJ had to pay were north of $50 million but the relationship was severely damaged.

Fortunately, the new CEO of Gulfstream and the returning COO of NJ have a much better relationship and I expect an announcement, perhaps as early as NBAA in Las Vegas.

Given the "challenges" Bombardier is experiencing with the 7000/8000 development, I also expect an announcement canceling those orders (hopefully we'll also cancel the orders for that gawd-awful 605). The one thing Sokol DID do right was negotiate cancellation escape clauses with Bombardier.

 

[G4dude]

There was a HUGE falling out between Sokol and Gulfstream and that antagonism was carried forward by the idiot lawyer. The cancellation of NJ's standing orders and the tone of the re-negotiations on maintenance by Sokol REALLY pissed off the now-retired CEO of Gulfstream. The cancellation fees NJ had to pay were north of $50 million but the relationship was severely damaged.

Fortunately, the new CEO of Gulfstream and the returning COO of NJ have a much better relationship and I expect an announcement, perhaps as early as NBAA in Las Vegas.

Given the "challenges" Bombardier is experiencing with the 7000/8000 development, I also expect an announcement canceling those orders (hopefully we'll also cancel the orders for that gawd-awful 605). The one thing Sokol DID do right was negotiate cancellation escape clauses with Bombardier.

The good news is the owners will determine what planes we get, and they seem to want Guffstreams. Sounds good to me.

 

[ghostrider64]

Word is the meeting in CMH went well with Gulfstream. You'll see orders for them in the future. The question is, will we see a new CBA first?

Busy on September 10th?

 

[gutshotdraw]

Word is the meeting in CMH went well with Gulfstream. You'll see orders for them in the future. The question is, will we see a new CBA first?

Busy on September 10th?

Yep. Busy earning my third picket pin.