From the AFS100 Database, Something to think about

[t-bone]

Be careful what you wish for there amigo. A lot of our colleagues are pounding the table demanding 117 be applied to our operations without considering the law of unintended consequences.

EVERY 121 pilot I know HATES 117. EVERY 121 pilot I come across and casually ask HATES 117.

It requires more days of work per month to meet minimum bid lines, you need an iphone app to track your duty time because it's so frickin complicated, and they're NOT any better rested.

We need SIMPLE, easy to apply rest requirements in a new contract. NOT more stupid BS from the Fed.

They are paid hourly though...

 

[gunfyter]

They are paid hourly though...

Yes ....

I use 117 as my fatigue guideline

 

[gutshotdraw]

It's still horribly complicated and doesn't improve rest at all.

 

[t-bone]

It's still horribly complicated and doesn't improve rest at all.

Agreed. My impression is that 121 guys don't like it because it makes their trips less efficient...more time away from base for the same pay. Haven't heard much grumbling from a fatigue perspective, it's all been financially driven in my limited experience. Something us salaried guys do the to contend with. Sitting in a hotel pays just as mush as flying a trip,

 

[AftCG182]

Agreed. My impression is that 121 guys don't like it because it makes their trips less efficient...more time away from base for the same pay. Haven't heard much grumbling from a fatigue perspective, it's all been financially driven in my limited experience. Something us salaried guys do the to contend with. Sitting in a hotel pays just as mush as flying a trip,

Keep in mind who we're who we're talking about here... It's the "get the most out of them for the least amount of pay" Management mentality versus the "do the least amount of work for the most pay possible" groups.

The true victims are the passengers, whose comfort has been compromised in the interest of "optimizing" cabin size in the interest of efficiency. (Read: Profit)

I'm getting f-ed monthly with a schedule of 15/13 and these guys are whining about 4 days away from home? Cry me a river, bitches...

 

[dime line]

Keep in mind who we're who we're talking about here... It's the "get the most out of them for the least amount of pay" Management mentality versus the "do the least amount of work for the most pay possible" groups.

The true victims are the passengers, whose comfort has been compromised in the interest of "optimizing" cabin size in the interest of efficiency. (Read: Profit)

I'm getting f-ed monthly with a schedule of 15/13

and these guys are whining about 4 days away from home? Cry me a river, bitches...

Not really fair to complain, you took the job.

 

[ghostrider64]

Fractionals have surpassed the amount of deviations per 1000 hours percentage that was previously held by 135 operations. Six times the rate of all 121 per 1000 flight hours, supplemental included.

The winners:

top of the list Flight Options with 26 active pilot actions pending, most are not in the category eligible for civil penalty mitigation.

Delta Private Jets quickly moving up the list with 23 actions pending.

Netjets right in there with 21

While the focus is on union votes and rules the bottom line is the industry is falling into statistical realities that may have negative consequences.

Those numbers are meaningless unless they are broken down by each company's individual rates. Netjets is doing over 400 flights per day, not including empty segments. Rates of deviations at netjets are way below what is alluded to in this post.