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Frax vs. SWA
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CelticCitation
Larry Wannabe
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On Your Six
Well-known member
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- Mar 8, 2004
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- 4,507
airline#5 said:
For the frax (NJA and CS), some people like 7 days off in a row - it's like 2 weeks of vacation per month... Some people like the ability to fly multiple types of aircraft to a wide variety of non-routine destinations. One day you are in Jackson Hole or Aspen and the next day you are in Ocean Reef or Marco Island. You never know...
If you are dying to fly a 737 for the rest of your career then quickly apply to SWA. It's certainly a safe bet in this lame business...
Last edited:
Inspector 12
Active member
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- 25
Can anyone make a case for the frax vs. SWA?
You don't have to burn 7 grand or two weeks vacation at the fracs!
All kidding aside - They both have their advantages and disadvantages. Now that the fractional payscale seems to be coming up maybe it's not a bad deal. Yeah, the 7 on could suck but then again - commuting sucks!
Everything is a crap shoot! Lay all the cards on the table, talk to your family and make a decision that is best for YOU!
Good luck!
You don't have to burn 7 grand or two weeks vacation at the fracs!
All kidding aside - They both have their advantages and disadvantages. Now that the fractional payscale seems to be coming up maybe it's not a bad deal. Yeah, the 7 on could suck but then again - commuting sucks!
Everything is a crap shoot! Lay all the cards on the table, talk to your family and make a decision that is best for YOU!
Good luck!
TrumanSparks
turn left at band aid
- Joined
- Nov 30, 2001
- Posts
- 116
I flew for FlexJet for 5 years and for the most part I loved it. All the good things that people point out, mountain flying, the islands, etc were fun. The people were great and I'm grateful for the opportunity I had. If you're thinking about it I would say go for it.
Now having said that, I will say that the Frax don't come close to touching Southwest, for me that is. Granted everyone is different and SWA is not for everybody. I've been at SWA for 3 years and it has more fun than I could have ever hoped it would be. Most of the time it doesn't even seem like work. I feel that I'm part of something really good, not just working for a paycheck.
Now about the paycheck. When I left FlexJet I knew it would take about 3 years to replace my income (what I would have made if I stayed at Flex). If I fly the same number of trips for pay in 06 (4th year FO pay) that I did in 05, then I will be in the range of the highest payed Challenger Capt. (line pilot, not mngt) at Flex. So yes my career earnings will be greater and the number of days I work will be less.
But what it all boils down to is QOL. I spent my first year commuting to a base that was two time zones away, I was the bottom guy for nearly all of that year and I had the worst reserve line every month, and it was still better QOL than Flex.
That QOL was due to several things, SWA being a 121 scheduled air carrier (FARs), the work rules because of the CBA (union), the flexibility of my schedule, to name a few.
Now having said that, I will say that the Frax don't come close to touching Southwest, for me that is. Granted everyone is different and SWA is not for everybody. I've been at SWA for 3 years and it has more fun than I could have ever hoped it would be. Most of the time it doesn't even seem like work. I feel that I'm part of something really good, not just working for a paycheck.
Now about the paycheck. When I left FlexJet I knew it would take about 3 years to replace my income (what I would have made if I stayed at Flex). If I fly the same number of trips for pay in 06 (4th year FO pay) that I did in 05, then I will be in the range of the highest payed Challenger Capt. (line pilot, not mngt) at Flex. So yes my career earnings will be greater and the number of days I work will be less.
But what it all boils down to is QOL. I spent my first year commuting to a base that was two time zones away, I was the bottom guy for nearly all of that year and I had the worst reserve line every month, and it was still better QOL than Flex.
That QOL was due to several things, SWA being a 121 scheduled air carrier (FARs), the work rules because of the CBA (union), the flexibility of my schedule, to name a few.
Last edited:
coogebeachhotel
Well-known member
- Joined
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- Posts
- 650
YellowLab
Well-known member
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- Sep 30, 2004
- Posts
- 57
Netjets vs. SWA
I was a Netjets guy for almost 4 yrs after being furloughed from a legacy carrier and left for SWA back in June. I absolutely cannot say anything bad about Netjets. The only bummer was the contract negotiations but now that it is over and they pay rates are good it is not even a factor.
Netjets
The Good: The 7 on and 7 off in my opinion is the best schedule I have ever had. No commuting and every week of vacation is 3 weeks off. The crew food is incredible and hotels 2nd to none. The variety of flying is amazing. Ferry legs are a blast and if they are long one dude can sit in the back and chill out. The overtime and tip yourself money is incredible and you make well above your base salary. I paid my mortgage every month without ever dipping into my base salary. Health Benefits the best I've ever had. Incredible 401k program. Pilot group was awesome and alot of fun.
The Bad: When I was there the average duty day was 12 hrs long. Even if you werent flying the schedulers had you standby at the FBO. I think this has all changed now since the contract is done. No real beer time, and it's hard to really know how long you will be at a particular overnight if you want to do some activities. No cockpit door! Those transcons were long staring out the window...thank god for Ipods and small earpieces. Loadings bags was usually not too bad except for the golf and ski trips..can you say tetris. I think mgt is a total joke and the only reason the customers come back is the prestige and the customer service the pilots give. Mgt. wastes money like women go through toilet paper.
SWA
1. The Good: Pilot group is the best I've seen yet. Good group of people that all want to work for a common goal. Like the other guy said I really feel I'm part of something good therefore I don't mind getting strollers and putting on rubber gloves and helping the FA's clean the cabin. Not all do it but I feel it makes a difference and I do it because I want to.
The schedules are great and are very flexible. Overnights are nice and the social scene is a big plus. I laugh pretty hard at SWA. Workouts are easier to fit in. Money is good once you get past first year. If you live in domacile it is a really great schedule. Corporate culture is the best I've ever seen. For the first time in my life I'm drinking the Kool Aid and it tastes good. I like and respect Mgt. and feel everyone is here for the long haul. A cockpit door is nice for many reasons. Stock options and 401k program are good but the Health plans could use some tweeking but it's all for affordability to the company which is fine. It's good to have jumpseating and passes for my family again. All travel for family is free.
2. The Bad: If you commute or plan on commuting it is a buzzkill. Just takes alot of your time off but that has nothing to do with SWA as a company. My personal choice. Not knowing your schedule until two weeks before the month starts is kind of a bummer when planning vacations and stuff like that. Besides that I can't think of one bad thing to say about SWA.
Going to Netjets now would be a tough choice because it would be a long time until you get captains pay and you have to start out living in one of their 5 bases. If your at Netjets now and thinking of leaving for SWA it's a personal choice that will be hard to make. The airline life is not for everbody. As for me I could of been happy doing either job for the rest of my life. Leaving Netjets was the hardest decision I ever made (even before the contract). However, since being at SWA I have never looked back with regret and still feel comfortable with my decision. It was what was right for me at the time and my not be the best decision for someone else.
My age and career potential made a big factor in leaving for SWA. I think Netjets will be around for 10 more years but I think its a business model easily duplicated and I worry about Berkshire selling Netjets. Without Uncle Warren behind the Netjets name I think Netjets loses alot of credibility and brand name. SWA has to face the cut-throat airline industry but I believe it's employees and business model will make it work for years to come. I just hope 30 years from now I look back and say I made the right decision. No matter what you decide the two companies are the 2 finest in the industry in my opinion. I've been super lucky to of been part of both of them.
Who would of thought Pan Am, Eastern, (place any airline here) would of been gone. The Frax biz has also changed the face of aviation and the rich and how they travel. I've been furloughed once so I'm a little gun shy but it's the best thing that ever happened to me. It makes me recongnize how special and unique SWA is. Employees do make the difference and Mgt. at SWA realize this.
Best of luck with your decision either way you can't go wrong.
I was a Netjets guy for almost 4 yrs after being furloughed from a legacy carrier and left for SWA back in June. I absolutely cannot say anything bad about Netjets. The only bummer was the contract negotiations but now that it is over and they pay rates are good it is not even a factor.
Netjets
The Good: The 7 on and 7 off in my opinion is the best schedule I have ever had. No commuting and every week of vacation is 3 weeks off. The crew food is incredible and hotels 2nd to none. The variety of flying is amazing. Ferry legs are a blast and if they are long one dude can sit in the back and chill out. The overtime and tip yourself money is incredible and you make well above your base salary. I paid my mortgage every month without ever dipping into my base salary. Health Benefits the best I've ever had. Incredible 401k program. Pilot group was awesome and alot of fun.
The Bad: When I was there the average duty day was 12 hrs long. Even if you werent flying the schedulers had you standby at the FBO. I think this has all changed now since the contract is done. No real beer time, and it's hard to really know how long you will be at a particular overnight if you want to do some activities. No cockpit door! Those transcons were long staring out the window...thank god for Ipods and small earpieces. Loadings bags was usually not too bad except for the golf and ski trips..can you say tetris. I think mgt is a total joke and the only reason the customers come back is the prestige and the customer service the pilots give. Mgt. wastes money like women go through toilet paper.
SWA
1. The Good: Pilot group is the best I've seen yet. Good group of people that all want to work for a common goal. Like the other guy said I really feel I'm part of something good therefore I don't mind getting strollers and putting on rubber gloves and helping the FA's clean the cabin. Not all do it but I feel it makes a difference and I do it because I want to.
The schedules are great and are very flexible. Overnights are nice and the social scene is a big plus. I laugh pretty hard at SWA. Workouts are easier to fit in. Money is good once you get past first year. If you live in domacile it is a really great schedule. Corporate culture is the best I've ever seen. For the first time in my life I'm drinking the Kool Aid and it tastes good. I like and respect Mgt. and feel everyone is here for the long haul. A cockpit door is nice for many reasons. Stock options and 401k program are good but the Health plans could use some tweeking but it's all for affordability to the company which is fine. It's good to have jumpseating and passes for my family again. All travel for family is free.
2. The Bad: If you commute or plan on commuting it is a buzzkill. Just takes alot of your time off but that has nothing to do with SWA as a company. My personal choice. Not knowing your schedule until two weeks before the month starts is kind of a bummer when planning vacations and stuff like that. Besides that I can't think of one bad thing to say about SWA.
Going to Netjets now would be a tough choice because it would be a long time until you get captains pay and you have to start out living in one of their 5 bases. If your at Netjets now and thinking of leaving for SWA it's a personal choice that will be hard to make. The airline life is not for everbody. As for me I could of been happy doing either job for the rest of my life. Leaving Netjets was the hardest decision I ever made (even before the contract). However, since being at SWA I have never looked back with regret and still feel comfortable with my decision. It was what was right for me at the time and my not be the best decision for someone else.
My age and career potential made a big factor in leaving for SWA. I think Netjets will be around for 10 more years but I think its a business model easily duplicated and I worry about Berkshire selling Netjets. Without Uncle Warren behind the Netjets name I think Netjets loses alot of credibility and brand name. SWA has to face the cut-throat airline industry but I believe it's employees and business model will make it work for years to come. I just hope 30 years from now I look back and say I made the right decision. No matter what you decide the two companies are the 2 finest in the industry in my opinion. I've been super lucky to of been part of both of them.
Who would of thought Pan Am, Eastern, (place any airline here) would of been gone. The Frax biz has also changed the face of aviation and the rich and how they travel. I've been furloughed once so I'm a little gun shy but it's the best thing that ever happened to me. It makes me recongnize how special and unique SWA is. Employees do make the difference and Mgt. at SWA realize this.
Best of luck with your decision either way you can't go wrong.
Last edited:
ratherfish
Well-known member
- Joined
- Dec 29, 2001
- Posts
- 63
Diesel
TEB Hilton resident
- Joined
- Nov 25, 2001
- Posts
- 4,394
yellowlab-
I didn't realize you had left. Had to go back and check that you actually had. Too bad man you allways had a great view and SWA is lucky to have you!
Both are great companies. Both have their pluses and minuses. There are a bunch of times i wish i was here or there but i do enjoy it here.
plus the ferry flights you can just take out your anger and have some fun.
By the way did you leave after 91k? That has totally changed this type of flying. Now there are no more phone calls. Some fracs do it differently but we know on shutdown when we have to be at work the next day. Finally can have some fun.
I didn't realize you had left. Had to go back and check that you actually had. Too bad man you allways had a great view and SWA is lucky to have you!
Both are great companies. Both have their pluses and minuses. There are a bunch of times i wish i was here or there but i do enjoy it here.
plus the ferry flights you can just take out your anger and have some fun.
By the way did you leave after 91k? That has totally changed this type of flying. Now there are no more phone calls. Some fracs do it differently but we know on shutdown when we have to be at work the next day. Finally can have some fun.
SWA/FO
5 Star Senior Member
- Joined
- Nov 26, 2001
- Posts
- 3,520
CaptainMark,
You always bring up money....maybe not this time but you usually do.
This year CaptainMark, I'll be a young Capt. too. I don't need to fly a fat french made jet to be happy. I'll do ok flying my BOEING 737 around the lower 48 and loving every minute of it.
it will be SWA/737 CAPT (daytime flyer/night sleeper)
You always bring up money....maybe not this time but you usually do.
This year CaptainMark, I'll be a young Capt. too. I don't need to fly a fat french made jet to be happy. I'll do ok flying my BOEING 737 around the lower 48 and loving every minute of it.
it will be SWA/737 CAPT (daytime flyer/night sleeper)
FNG_that's me
Well-known member
- Joined
- Dec 28, 2004
- Posts
- 194
SWA/FO said:
Man, how old are you, 6, maybe 8, tops? If you'd stop trying to one-up everybody and stop caring what everyone else thinks, you'd not only live longer, but actually have some friends too.
Oh yeah, get a sense of humor too, it goes a long way and after puberty you will appreciate how the ladies respond to that kind of thing.
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SWA/FO
5 Star Senior Member
- Joined
- Nov 26, 2001
- Posts
- 3,520
SWA/FO
5 Star Senior Member
- Joined
- Nov 26, 2001
- Posts
- 3,520
You meant to say "In my opinion you are not funny". Thats OK what are you doing on a SWA v. Frax thread anyway? You missing me on some of your Fed Ex threads? Who did you fly that Falcon for? Ameristar? Grand Aire? Cherry Air or USA Jet?
Say, when do you think FDX will split? This is an honest question.
Say, when do you think FDX will split? This is an honest question.
FNG_that's me
Well-known member
- Joined
- Dec 28, 2004
- Posts
- 194
SWA/FO
5 Star Senior Member
- Joined
- Nov 26, 2001
- Posts
- 3,520
SWA/FO said:negative FNG.. You having a problem finding the O on the keypad, and other places as well?
Its SWA/FO.
I think CaptainMark is a big boy, he doesn't need your help - at least those guys have enough guts to list what team they are on, kinda like the SWA/FO. A hero to all, I am.
Perhaps we could get back to the original topic? What was it again? This soap opera is getting boring...
Falconjet
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2002
- Posts
- 1,586
SWA/FO said:
You mean the other questions aren't honest?
Rats.
Honestly, I don't know jack about stocks or the market, so I couldn't even venture a guess.
Obviously I am very interested in SW and a big fan. I like to keep up with what is going on over there. Do you even read what other people write? No, I don't miss you in the FedEx threads, but you won't find me ever saying you don't have the right to be in them. I don't really care who reads what threads, its a free country.
I have already tried to ask you to reconsider your tone in your posts because I don't think you come off the way you hope to, which I can only assume is to be funny. In my opinion, you are usually not very funny, but you seem determined to keep trying. I would reconsider if I were you. Everybody else I know or who I've met at SW has been most gracious and humble, but you don't fit that mold. Quite the contrary.
I flew Falcons in the Coast Guard. How about you?
FJ
FlyBoeingJets
YES, that's NICE
- Joined
- Mar 20, 2003
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- 1,802
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