Forecast for recalls, hiring, pension benefits if NPRM issued

[Tejas-Jet]

It never should change. Just like a pilot's DOH.

Uhhhh...as we speak, it would appear that we are a lot closer to seeing an NPRM than we thought.

 

[NuGuy]

Heyas,

Yes, it's time for those tooting the "discrimination" horn to pack it where the sun doesn't shine. Not only are you simply trading one age for another, BUT, the FAA insists on a mandatory retirement age for controllers that is LESS THAN 60! With the critical ATC shortage looming, where are the howles of dismay about this blatently discriminatory rule?

Bah...

Nu

 

[humuakalaka]

If it's true that the NPRM is going to be issued tomorrow, anyone who isn't very close to captain upgrade just lost anywhere from several hundred thousand dollars to more than a million dollars.

Thanks old guys!

BTW, 65 is just as discriminatory as 60, so the age discrimination argument doesn't hold an ounce of water.

 

[Flopgut]

Uhhhh...as we speak, it would appear that we are a lot closer to seeing an NPRM than we thought.

Do you think that brings any of this to an end? Hardly. You haven't thought through where this will ultimately go. This will galvanize those against it and the majority will swell even larger. Even those who get marginalized at your outfit are going to grow weary of watching elderly louses soak up the best schedules. It's a foregone conclusion that those most eager for this change are completely unable to accept this with any humility. You're going to poison the well.

 

[Tejas-Jet]

Do you think that brings any of this to an end? Hardly. You haven't thought through where this will ultimately go. This will galvanize those against it and the majority will swell even larger. Even those who get marginalized at your outfit are going to grow weary of watching elderly louses soak up the best schedules. It's a foregone conclusion that those most eager for this change are completely unable to accept this with any humility. You're going to poison the well.

Uh-huh...and thats your opinion of how you think things will go....mine is more optimistic. You think it won't galvanize those that are for the change? As far as those watching the more senior get the good schedules....isn't that the way the seniority system works now? ...or are you trying to change that too?

How it all comes out is OK with me...either way. But for now, I have a chance to make my opinion known...and I will do just that. It's just like a Presidential election....I root for my guy all the way....when its over...I accept the result, and go on from there.

 

[capt. megadeth]

Uh-huh...and thats your opinion of how you think things will go....mine is more optimistic.

Dude, that's cuz you work at Southwest.

 

[Freight Dog]

Tejas, I think we should abolish the seniority system as well and adopt the identical system to Emirates.

See, now that the old guys have brought this radical change to our industry, maybe the young crowd should now replace the seniority system with some sort of a rotational schedule like the Emirates do.

I mean, isn't it discriminatory for you to hog the good schedules, good pay, while keeping others down?

 

[nimtz]

Comments released by Capt. Prater:



"I met with FAA Administrator Marion Blakey during the first week of the new year. One of the items that Administrator Blakey raised was the Age 60 Rule. She advised me that the FAA will put the current Age 60 Rule into the internal rulemaking process at the FAA, which will result in a Notice of Proposed Rule Making (NPRM) sometime during the second half of this year.

At this time, I have put together an internal working group to plan how the Association will deal with the NPRM. I can tell you this much - we will deal with it, we will include our governing bodies and line pilots, and we will, to the best of our ability, keep Age 60 from continuing to be a wedge issue within our membership.

You know I like Prater as a person, but my support for him is now completely gone due to this limp d!ck reply. Wedge issue? Give me a freaking break. I won't give a dime to the PAC for many years if this goes through. Special thanks to SWAPA for spearheading this noble cause.

 

[Flopgut]

As far as those watching the more senior get the good schedules....isn't that the way the seniority system works now? ...or are you trying to change that too?

Unless the rule is crafted carefully to balance this out, the proper tence will be "seniority system worked then". Past tence, it will cease to function, just a crossed picket line. The day you fly past age 60, you'll be taking someone elses flying.

 

[Doug Parker]

Unless the rule is crafted carefully to balance this out, the proper tence will be "seniority system worked then". Past tence, it will cease to function, just a crossed picket line. The day you fly past age 60, you'll be taking someone elses flying.

I'm sure the Ansett scabs at AWA, a whole lot of AirTran, CAL, and UNITED guys will have NO problem doing that AGAIN.....................


.

 

[Freight Dog]

You know I like Prater as a person, but my support for him is now completely gone due to this limp d!ck reply. Wedge issue? Give me a freaking break. I won't give a dime to the PAC for many years if this goes through. Special thanks to SWAPA for spearheading this noble cause.

AMEN Nimtz! That makes two of us.

 

[Tejas-Jet]

Tejas, I think we should abolish the seniority system as well and adopt the identical system to Emirates.

Well...if thats what you think...then, get with it. See how it floats...if thats the way it plays out....I'll accept it.

Best of luck, and please keep us updated on your quest.

Tejas

 

[Tejas-Jet]

The day you fly past age 60, you'll be taking someone elses flying.

You won't hurt me....but when that day comes, at "your house" you will do what.....?

Tejas

 

[Tejas-Jet]

Special thanks to SWAPA for spearheading this noble cause.

And lets not forget to also thank the SWAPA members for their support....Hot off the press...

<<*** AGE 60: On the question regarding support for SWAPA efforts to repeal the Age 60 Rule during the 110th Congress in 2007-2008, 59.51 percent of the membership voted "yes;" 40.49 percent voted "no.">>

Tejas

 

[nimtz]

And lets not forget to also thank the SWAPA members for their support....Hot off the press...

<<*** AGE 60: On the question regarding support for SWAPA efforts to repeal the Age 60 Rule during the 110th Congress in 2007-2008, 59.51 percent of the membership voted "yes;" 40.49 percent voted "no.">>

Tejas

From http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/01/30/faa.pilots.ap/index.html

"Many pilots have taken huge penalties to their pensions, and this is a way to recoup some of that," said Carl Kuwitzky, president of the Southwest Airlines Pilots' Association, which has lobbied for the change.

Sorry I'm confused, remind me again what type of pension penalty Southwest pilots have taken? I'm sure all that SWAPA lobbying was done strictly out of compassion for the legacy guys.

 

[Tejas-Jet]

From http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/01/30/faa.pilots.ap/index.html

"Many pilots have taken huge penalties to their pensions, and this is a way to recoup some of that," said Carl Kuwitzky, president of the Southwest Airlines Pilots' Association, which has lobbied for the change.

Sorry I'm confused, remind me again what type of pension penalty Southwest pilots have taken? I'm sure all that SWAPA lobbying was done strictly out of compassion for the legacy guys.

Of course,...and as a former legacy pilot....I feel your pain. Thats why I voted "yes" to indirectly help out my legacy brothers.

In Solidarity wit mah bro's,

Tejas

 

[LeonPhelps]

Albie...any thoughts?

Albie...I couldn't agree more. Business is business. Got any ideas on how to fight it? Doesn't seem like voting at the Union meetings are working very well, based on the conversations on this board. I'm guessing that there are a lot of guys on this board that are all ears. Is it worth a million$ to get active? Hell yes...and I'm not even an activist...I usually prefer to have some Courvossier and forget about it. I hope the fellas think of the time value of money when they consider how much it's worth to take action to fight, delay or otherwise...apparently there's a million dollars on the line, is that worth a couple dozen hours of action? Sure...

 

[LeonPhelps]

One more question...

...yeah, I just polished off that box of my favorite Mexican wine, and was wondering something, as I often do at this point in the evening.

UM, WHY AREN'T THE AIRLINES FIGHTING THIS ONE? DON'T THEY PAY A NEW-HIRE LESS THAN A 64 YEAR OLD WITH 30 YEARS ON THE BOOKS? AND WOULDN'T IT SAVE 'EM A FEW BUCKS ON MEDICAL? JUST SOME QUESTIONS...MAYBE THEY'RE AFRAID TO GET SUED...BUT I'M AFRAID I'LL GET SUED EVERYTIME I GET BEHIND THE WHEEL, BUT I STILL DRIVE TO WORK.

"When I was in the Army, they called this Asia...Me? I called it freaky deaky sex land...Scrap Iron, this is your area of search...stick mainly to the back streets..." --Leon Phelps

 

[scoreboard]

Leon, WHY AREN'T THE AIRLINES FIGHTING THIS ONE?

It was answered earlier, the second they extend the old guys, there will be thousands stuck at the bottom or worse just outside the door. For years. Now, the wages for those minions will drop through the basement, thats how the business will make it a zero sum game.

Until sick bank usage skyrockets. Yes, currently it gets worse as guys get close to 60. But, they need those sick bank days to pay for age 60-65 medical by trading them in later for COBRA. What happens when those sick bank days become useless unless used overnight? You got it, sick calls up the wazoo. Money for nothing, chicks for free.

I still see years of costly union and company litigation even with legal restrictions. The question they will fight for is "how is it right to one day be to old, the next day not, yet someone just as old in 24 hours gets to stay?" You cannot argue that one and win before the supreme court. YMMV.

 

[capt. megadeth]

From http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/01/30/faa.pilots.ap/index.html

"Many pilots have taken huge penalties to their pensions, and this is a way to recoup some of that," said Carl Kuwitzky, president of the Southwest Airlines Pilots' Association, which has lobbied for the change.

Sorry I'm confused, remind me again what type of pension penalty Southwest pilots have taken? I'm sure all that SWAPA lobbying was done strictly out of compassion for the legacy guys.

This has got to be the GAYEST F***ING MOST STUPID thing I have ever read! (and for you "touchy" SWA folk.....it has nothing to do with the fact that your SWAPA president said it....any pilot that would say this is crazy).

I have an idea....let's use our money and resources to go after the dickheads that raped everyone of their pensions......but NO.....our "brothers" say "LET'S JUST WORK LONGER for the same dickheads". This is like putting a cast on a laceration.

 

[Vne]

"Surrender is not in a pilot's DNA." - ALPA President, Captain John Prater

But I guess a "blue ribbon panel" is?