Flying Blind: Deregulation reconsidered

[Flopgut]

So this lets you out of the soc sec ponzi scheme? How does pay out compare to SSN? What about the rehiring rights? In the end the Rail Roads became gov't operations.

Out of SS, yes. There is already a prevailing methodology in place for those transistioning from SS to RRB that works well. The re-hiring scheme is basically if your airline goes away you get placed in a hiring pool at another similiar airline where you are hired at the bottom of the seniority list but you keep your longevity. (ALPA had this for pilots hired before 1974 but let it go) This retirement pays out fully with 30 years of service and a minimum age of 60.

 

[pilotyip]

7th year pay?

The re-hiring scheme is basically if your airline goes away you get placed in a hiring pool at another similiar airline where you are hired at the bottom of the seniority list but you keep your longevity. .

So does this mean I have been at XYZ airline for seven years and it folds, and I get placed at ABC airline, do I come in at the 7 seven year pay scale?

 

[Lear70]

So does this mean I have been at XYZ airline for seven years and it folds, and I get placed at ABC airline, do I come in at the 7 seven year pay scale?

It's a shame, the waste of those collegiate analytical skills...

I'm just giving you a hard time. You going to be out at the air show this weekend?

 

[pilotyip]

need more info

It's a shame, the waste of those collegiate analytical skills...

I'm just giving you a hard time. You going to be out at the air show this weekend?

I would use them but I don't understand how it is supposed to work, when you come in at your previous job's longevity. Got other family plans that can not be cancelled this weekend. Besides when you fly the airshow circuit you see them on a regular basis. What I will miss is the private party with their whole crew. BTW USA Jet 6 new twin engine jets on their ramp to today, nice blue paint jobs, yellow trim, numbered 1 through 6. Can't carry any pax though, they are single pilot carrier based cargo jets.

 

[Lear70]

Carrier-based?

 

[pilotyip]

F/A-18's

Carrier-based?

Yea, the planes I was talking about were F/A-18s

 

[Lear70]

*snicker*

Was a long day, missed the joke.

p.s. I'll get around to emptying out my PM box one of these days, wish they'd let us have more than 300 messages,,,

 

[Flopgut]

So does this mean I have been at XYZ airline for seven years and it folds, and I get placed at ABC airline, do I come in at the 7 seven year pay scale?

Yes. That's still a rule under RLA if you have a hire date prior to 1974. And, that's only if your airline goes away and not merged. This was apart from ALPA merger policy. However, the reason it was amended to 1974 was part of the ruining of ALPA merger policy by ALPA pilots with hire dates in the latter 1970s and early 80s. For instance, junior UAL guys did not want any form of ALPA merger policy to prevail with FAL. So they skipped the union merger policy, called it a purchase, and sh!t on their union brother, FAL pilots. (Who just got done honoring their strike BTW) The UAL guys didn't want to have the FAL guys come in AT ALL so they made the RLA cutoff 1974. Nice huh?

BTW, this ALPA mentality that changed merger policy sprang from the junior ALPA types at the time. Those are the same ones that are now senior and saw fit to change retirement age. They've been screwing others their whole career and still lack the nads to challenge the RLA.

 

[pilotyip]

Local's

BTW, this ALPA mentality that changed merger policy sprang from the junior ALPA types at the time. Those are the same ones that are now senior and saw fit to change retirement age. They've been screwing others their whole career and still lack the nads to challenge the RLA.

That is why individual contracts holders are called locals. There concerns are local in nature

 

[Flopgut]

That is why individual contracts holders are called locals. There concerns are local in nature

Ok. But there is an ALPA National as well. They should be dealing with big picture issues. When railroad labor lost normal, full retirement age in the early 90s (age 60 with 30 years of service), top railroad labor leaders made it a priority to get it back in future contracts. And rail labor leaders did just that in 02. What did the primma donnas running ALPA National do? They merchandised an increased retirement age for themselves when they should have asserted better treratment for the profession since we're no less under the RLA than rail. And they call that taking it back?!

 

[pilotyip]

Standard wages?

Ok. But there is an ALPA National as well. They should be dealing with big picture issues. When railroad labor lost normal, full retirement age in the early 90s (age 60 with 30 years of service), top railroad labor leaders made it a priority to get it back in future contracts. And rail labor leaders did just that in 02. What did the primma donnas running ALPA National do? They merchandised an increased retirement age for themselves when they should have asserted better treratment for the profession since we're no less under the RLA than rail. And they call that taking it back?!

Not trying to flame or start a passing contest, but serious questions arise on how a National Union would work. So does this mean that ALPA will publish a national wage scale? Would it mean that locals will not have ability to negotiate with their employer to reach an agreement that works for an individual company? Such as Kitty Hawk 727 Capt. on an ALPA contract topped out around $100K/yr, same 727 pilot at Fed Ex on a ALPA contract made nearly $200K. Would FedEx have to drop their rates to the KH level, or would KH have to match the Fed Ex level? BTW KH folded because it could not afford the contract.

 

[Flopgut]

Not trying to flame or start a passing contest, but serious questions arise on how a National Union would work. So does this mean that ALPA will publish a national wage scale? Would it mean that locals will not have ability to negotiate with their employer to reach an agreement that works for an individual company? Such as Kitty Hawk 727 Capt. on an ALPA contract topped out around $100K/yr, same 727 pilot at Fed Ex on a ALPA contract made nearly $200K. Would FedEx have to drop their rates to the KH level, or would KH have to match the Fed Ex level? BTW KH folded because it could not afford the contract.

No, you're not getting it. But that's OK, I'm glad you want to know. It's just opting us out of SS. That's basically it. Instead of the SS maximum you have now (can't think of it, too tired. First 96K I think) you would have two levels that max at your first 108K. Then you would get a full benefit at whatever your specific profession's retirement age is. "ALPA National" needs to steer big picture issues like this; I don't think locals should loose any power or the ability to act autonomously.

The flip side of this arguement is that we might bet excused from the RLA. It's a remote possibility but the upside would be a huge windfall for us.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Flopgut... what is the latest with the effort?