flight director

cordova1

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Does anyone know of a reg that says the flight director must be used during a visual approach, in a turbojet aircraft. Scenario. Planning ILS. Cleared visual on base leg, 5000 ft above airport. Can I turn the FD of, and just hand fly the airplane?
 

Basil

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Never heard of such a thing and can't imagine that there is one.

The only thing close that I know of is a requirement to use a F/D or A/P on certain RNAV DP's.

91.129 does mention turbine-powered aircraft staying at ar above the GS when approaching rwys served by an ILS in Class D. Could that have something to do with your question?
 
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semperfido

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no such reg. yes you can get rid of the FD and fly without it
 

ksu_aviator

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I agree with the above. I would just ad that if the FD isn't giving you precise information, it shouldn't be used at all. I know many disagree, but I don't see the point in having the FD on if you aren't using it. Some say to set it to go-around during t/o and pitch up into it...well that's great, but the go around pitch means nothing. It does not coincide with any performance criteria or navigation, it is just an arbitrary pitch angle.

I probably hijacked the thread with that statement. Sorry.
 

cordova1

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No i agree totally. That is why I posted the question. I was taught to turn everything off on a visual approach, get your eyes outside of the cockpit, and just fly.
 

NCherches

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...There aren't regs that say you have to set up your display's a certain way... you might have a SOP if you are doing the 135, or 91K type thing...
 

LJ45

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wow! all very good... and I agree :)
 

need2fly

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In some airplane, i.e. A320, it is required to turn it off when you are maneuvering visually and not going to follow the FD commands.
 

starcheck208

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i like to turn it off and fly the ils comming in vfr just to keep my skills/scan up not relying on the fd all the time
 

Nolife

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When visual you can load up the other guy if he's moving the FD for you while you're hand flying. I turn it off; also it's a pet peeve of mine when guys kick off the a/p and fly around with the FD commanding a turn to the bugged heading or a climb to previous alt. Looks sloppy and I even had a fed comment as much while observing a proving run.

If you're not using it turn it off. Unless you're shooting a CAT II or III, or some RNAV procedure you don't need it per the regs.
 

LegacyDriver

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That is purely a 121 or 135 SOP thing.

Not an F.A.R. at all... If you don't want it you can dump it. You may violate SOP for your company but no regulation.
 

HSDriver

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I agree with the above. I would just ad that if the FD isn't giving you precise information, it shouldn't be used at all. I know many disagree, but I don't see the point in having the FD on if you aren't using it. Some say to set it to go-around during t/o and pitch up into it...well that's great, but the go around pitch means nothing. It does not coincide with any performance criteria or navigation, it is just an arbitrary pitch angle.

I probably hijacked the thread with that statement. Sorry.
The FD go around is not a random pitch. It usually, depending on the airplane, is the V2 pitch for single engine. Obviously not exact because weights, conditions vary, but pretty darn close.
 

ksu_aviator

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The FD go around is not a random pitch. It usually, depending on the airplane, is the V2 pitch for single engine. Obviously not exact because weights, conditions vary, but pretty darn close.
What weight do you think the GA pitch angle is calculated for? Most likely it is the maximum landing weight or less. So what good does it do you to fly a pitch angle and power setting for an unknown weight that is almost certainly less than your takeoff weight?

I just feel that using the FD for unkown values that are "close enough" is sloppy.
 

LJ45

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What weight do you think the GA pitch angle is calculated for? Most likely it is the maximum landing weight or less. So what good does it do you to fly a pitch angle and power setting for an unknown weight that is almost certainly less than your takeoff weight?

I just feel that using the FD for unkown values that are "close enough" is sloppy.
It's an initial target pitch and then adjusted after liftoff, or go around, for what is actually required for the current conditions. This is standard SOP in many jets to provide the initial pitch and also provide a heading or wings level in some installations. You might want to take back that sloppy comment :)
 
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Problow

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Depends on the airplane, but most are set to default to a pitch for V2 single engine at Sea Level, Max TOW, and 15C.
 

ttflyer

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What weight do you think the GA pitch angle is calculated for? Most likely it is the maximum landing weight or less. So what good does it do you to fly a pitch angle and power setting for an unknown weight that is almost certainly less than your takeoff weight?

I just feel that using the FD for unkown values that are "close enough" is sloppy.
Also depends on the airplane. Most newer aircraft, like the Challenger 300, set the TOGA pitch based (more or less) on actual aircraft weight - so it is providing useful guidance. It also adjusts the pitch based on whether or not both engines are making power.

It's another example of "every airplane is different" - fly the one you got, not the one you used to fly...
 

JJET44

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The only thing close that I know of is a requirement to use a F/D or A/P on certain RNAV DP's.
Where did you see that? The only requirement is that you have your PFD/HSI set with a CDI needle (not a Map/course track) to varify any deviation. If that's what you ment then excuse me.
 

Rez O. Lewshun

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FD's are for system managers......

Raw data is for aviators.....
 

Gulfstream 200

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Where did you see that? The only requirement is that you have your PFD/HSI set with a CDI needle (not a Map/course track) to varify any deviation. If that's what you ment then excuse me.

Possibly meant PRNAV Departures?

6.2.4.6 Contingency Procedures

Loss of Flight Director. Flightcrew will select the opposite Flight Guidance Computer to regain a Flight Director. If a Flight Director is still unavailable, the Pilot Flying will continue to fly without use of the Flight Director. The Pilot Not flying will report loss of the Flight Director system to ATC and will request Radar Vectors, if required.

Loss of the Autopilot. Flightcrew will select the opposite Flight Guidance Computer to regain an Autopilot. If an Autopilot is still unavailable, the Pilot Flying will “hand-fly” the aircraft with reference to the Flight Director. The Pilot Not flying will report loss of the Autopilot System to ATC and will request Radar Vectors, if required.

Loss of P-RNAV Capability. The flight crew must notify ATC of any loss of P-RNAV capability and the flight crew’s proposed course of action. Generally, the flight crew will need to navigate using an alternative means of navigation. The alternative need not be RNAV.
 
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