Flight Data Recorders

[mattpilot]

Can anything you say on the FDR be used against you in the court of law? For example, you say to your captain that this morning you killed your wife.

Can this be used against you in a criminal court?


Instructor says no and believes it is published in the FAR's, but can't pinpoint it. I believe its no, but i also have no source to back it up.

I don't suppose you guys have sources which i could present to the instructor, be it FAR/AIM or a court case, where a precedent has been set?

Thanks...

 

[Headwind]

The FDR only records flight data. The CVR may cause you some problems.

HEADWIND

 

[soarby007]

cockpit voice recorder

First let's talk apples

The case of admitting criminal wrongdoing is absolutely admissible. This has nothing to do with federal air regulations and I can guarantee you that if available, it will be used. The authorities will probably get a search warrant or subpoena and you will be having a grand time with Bubba.

Oranges

the recorder cannot be used by your employer to find out if you violated some company rule in some cases. It can be used to investigate the cause of an incident, accident and maybe by yourself to vindicate some allegation made against you. Anytime you know that you are being recorded, it is subject to discovery by someone. If you refer to the passenger in the back as having exceptional bumper pads, then probably not. So if you do so, make sure it is before 30 minutes are up.

 

[mattpilot]

FDR - CVR - whatever..


Thanks soarby - that is my arguement. But the instructer seems to know it better. I don't suppose you have something tangible i can hand him?

 

[bafanguy]

FAR91.609(g): last sentence..."The Administrator does not use the cockpit voice recorder in any civil penalty or certificate action."


And, good luck on that one...

 

[JAFI]

With your 220 hours I'm guessing you mean part 91, so try this: (note the last sentance)


91.609 Flight recorders and cockpit voice recorders



(g) In the event of an accident or occurrence requiring immediate notification to the National Transportation Safety Board under part 830 of its regulations that results in the termination of the flight, any operator who has installed approved flight recorders and approved cockpit voice recorders shall keep the recorded information for at least 60 days or, if requested by the Administrator or the Board, for a longer period. Information obtained from the record is used to assist in determining the cause of accidents or occurrences in connection with the investigation under part 830. The Administrator does not use the cockpit voice recorder record in any civil penalty or certificate action.

Is that "tangible" enough?

JAFI

 

[mattpilot]

thanks pal...

I also found something else on faa.gov that basically says the same thing.

http://www.faa.gov/avr/afs/faa/8300/8300_vol2/2_213_00.pdf

For anyone interested in it, do a search on "cockpit voice recorders" in that pdf.

Thanks again guys!

 

[soarby007]

voice recorders

I spent years in federal law enforcement. Tell him to read Title 18, United States Code.

As someone else quoted, the recorder can't be used in civil enforcement, meaning FAR's. That is correct. In other words they can't use the recorder to determine from your conversation about fuel concerns, that you didn't comply with IFR fuel reserves. A guy doing a ramp check can't grab the data and decide to see if he can fault you on anything. This is civil law regarding regulatory enforcement.

If you discuss criminal activity, such as the best place to drop a load of marijuana, you will be seeing Bubba, and the voice recorder can be used in a criminal court, guaranteed.

Trust me, don't do anything illegal and don't expect privacy of criminal conversations on a cockpit voice recorder. Same if you discuss how much booze to pour into your glass. That's criminal as well as civil and you'll be had.

 

[FN FAL]

I spent years in federal law enforcement.

I spent years as a flying submarine commander on the Seaview. Go read Title 28523!

Same if you discuss how much booze to pour into your glass. That's criminal as well as civil and you'll be had.

Really? It's criminal to discuss your off duty drinking habits on the voice recorder of an aircraft? I'll have to remember that one...nah, I don't think it is illegal for a pilot to discuss how much booze to pour into a glass. In fact, for supposedly being a federal law enforcement officer...your ability to articulate reminds me of why it's great that we have a Supreme Court. Did they make you leave after they rode Janet Reno out of town on a rail?

 

[mattpilot]

Thanks soarby


Btw.. in case you guys were wondering.. the question originated from a question on a test - nothing personal, i promise