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Flexjet Takes Aim at Buffett?s Netjets for International Fliers

imacdog

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 12, 2005
Posts
4,196
Total Time
5000
We have a fatigue clause and union protection. Not many corporate operators can boast that. The flight and scheduling rules we operate under are more restrictive than 91, also fact.
 

X-rated

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 29, 2005
Posts
498
Total Time
8000+
We have a fatigue clause and union protection. Not many corporate operators can boast that. The flight and scheduling rules we operate under are more restrictive than 91, also fact.


And in all seriousness, considering the amount of flying you do and the business environment you work in, you certainly need both. But let me ask you this:

Does Netjets follow industry best practices considering circadian rhythms? Is your maximum duty time adjusted for early start times, late end times, time zones crossed, Window of Circadian Low? Many pt 91 operators do these days. Just because it's not regulatory, doesn't mean quality operators haven't adopted IS-BAO best practices based on scientific research. The FAA is severely lacking in their approach. Saying 91k is more restrictive than 91, which has no restriction at all, is hardly convincing and doesn't represent todays best practices.

Your other misconception is that someone must always be pushing a pilot to do something unsafe. When an owner is actually concerned about safety and there are no financial constraints, pt 91 can be a dream you probably can't even fathom. You work hard, we generally don't. Fatigue clause or not, you are undoubtedly more tired than we are most of the time. Our typical leg is like a 10am start on your day one followed by several days off. Are you really arguing you're safer because you have a fatigue clause? How many days a week do you use it? Besides, I can use the F word just as easily as you can with no fear of repercussion.
 

993_Pilot

MIGS
Joined
Jul 12, 2008
Posts
569
Total Time
20 yrs
And in all seriousness, considering the amount of flying you do and the business environment you work in, you certainly need both. But let me ask you this:

Does Netjets follow industry best practices considering circadian rhythms? Is your maximum duty time adjusted for early start times, late end times, time zones crossed, Window of Circadian Low? Many pt 91 operators do these days. Just because it's not regulatory, doesn't mean quality operators haven't adopted IS-BAO best practices based on scientific research. The FAA is severely lacking in their approach. Saying 91k is more restrictive than 91, which has no restriction at all, is hardly convincing and doesn't represent todays best practices.

Your other misconception is that someone must always be pushing a pilot to do something unsafe. When an owner is actually concerned about safety and there are no financial constraints, pt 91 can be a dream you probably can't even fathom. You work hard, we generally don't. Fatigue clause or not, you are undoubtedly more tired than we are most of the time. Our typical leg is like a 10am start on your day one followed by several days off. Are you really arguing you're safer because you have a fatigue clause? How many days a week do you use it? Besides, I can use the F word just as easily as you can with no fear of repercussion.

I won't get it to this debate about which type of operation is safer, but I can tell you that in addition to the fatigue clause, Flight Options has reduced duty for Circadian Low, or multiple times zones, although there is still room for improvement. We also have "special use airport" restrictions, and minimum runway requirements (above & beyond 135 or 91K), a maintenance resolution process, an ASAP program, professional standards program, etc. I would be surprised if Netjets didn't have something that addresses all these issues too. While some of the better corporate and charter operators have some, or some may even have most of these things, most of the smaller 91 and 135 operators have few if any. However, you make a good point about the amount of flying that the fractionals do. Carry on.
 

G4dude

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 24, 2004
Posts
1,645
Total Time
15000
And in all seriousness, considering the amount of flying you do and the business environment you work in, you certainly need both. But let me ask you this:

Does Netjets follow industry best practices considering circadian rhythms? Is your maximum duty time adjusted for early start times, late end times, time zones crossed, Window of Circadian Low? Many pt 91 operators do these days. Just because it's not regulatory, doesn't mean quality operators haven't adopted IS-BAO best practices based on scientific research. The FAA is severely lacking in their approach. Saying 91k is more restrictive than 91, which has no restriction at all, is hardly convincing and doesn't represent todays best practices.

Your other misconception is that someone must always be pushing a pilot to do something unsafe. When an owner is actually concerned about safety and there are no financial constraints, pt 91 can be a dream you probably can't even fathom. You work hard, we generally don't. Fatigue clause or not, you are undoubtedly more tired than we are most of the time. Our typical leg is like a 10am start on your day one followed by several days off. Are you really arguing you're safer because you have a fatigue clause? How many days a week do you use it? Besides, I can use the F word just as easily as you can with no fear of repercussion.

You make many good points. I originally said many charter and Part 91 flight departments fall short, but not all. There are some very safe operations out there, no doubt.
 
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