Fewer jets for USAirways???

[colorado418]

Maybe I am being stupid. Really quite possible. But if a company is furloughing like Airways is, wouldn't you make room in your scope clause to allow more aircraft to come to the property to be flown by your own pilots???

USAirways article here....

 

[General Lee]

I think they cancelled the CRJ-705, which in reality is a CRJ-900 with fewer seats (75 seats---mixed first class and coach style). I think that was an ALPA blunder right there. Why didn't they agree to have the USAir furloughs fly them? Why give them to MESA? I know Mesa has a J4J thing too, but the CRJ-705's could have been flown exclusively by the USAir furloughs because it was over 70 seats. Why oh why?

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[CU@OSHKOSH]

same goes for mother Delta

 

[meanstreak]

These Mainline pilots are a bunch of F!@#ing idiots. They will never learn. They could have flown these at the wholly owneds at much hire rates and better work rules. I'm glad they are going to Mesa now, I'm so sick of the BS that these mainlines guys think they are better than everyone. Have fun flying your J4J's at a crap operation. You guys deserve each other.

 

[blzr]

Well, to the mainline defense, If PDT, Alg and PSA got a bunch of those jets, Airways would lose buisness. I say let those primadonnas CHOKE on that scope. Give it all to Mesa, won't be long till Johnny O knocks on the door with 737's and takes your jobs too. This is just great

 

[stillaboo]

Have fun flying your J4J's at a crap operation.

The might not even get J4J @ Mesa!

Originally posed by jetdriven on another thread:
all of the CRJ-705's are being flown by MESA pilots only. J4J appplies only to 50 seaters.

What are you US mainliners possibly getting out of this?!

-Boo!

 

[CoopDog]

Lost my train of thought....

What are you US mainliners possibly getting out of this?!

-Boo!

I don't know Boo. I'm having a little trouble focusing right now. That avatar could put an eye out with those things. Here, let me get some sunglasses on and think about it.

 

[Dieterly]

How about this concept, mainline flies their own routes and a/c?
Any takers?

 

[Heavy Set]

ALPA - ANOTHER GREAT JOB!

Great job ALPA for screwing more USAirways pilots! What were they thinking? I am sure MOST furloughees would prefer flying in-house CRJs than flying for MESA in a J4J arrangement.

Can ALPA just increase our dues in order to hire better negotiators? I'd be willing to pay a bit more....

 

[typhoonpilot]

Meanstreak:

Please don't label all USAirways mainline pilots in one group. It is the MEC that makes the decisions and it is controlled by the pilots hired 1987 and earlier. Those of us that were hired 1988 and later have been suffering their incompetence for our whole career. In my case that is one furlough of almost 8 years and now another of indefinite duration.

I flew with the former CLT LEC Captain rep a few years ago. He was the Rep in the late 80s and early 90s who most probably destroyed the flow through agreement. He actually said to me, " those commuter pilots don't understand high speed swept wing aerodynamics ". I was dumbstruck at that comment and can easily see why the flowthrough negotiations failed with his attitude towards the regional pilot.

The mailine pilots have been unable to vote on the MEC actions and agreements for the last few years. The MEC is out of control and the pilots are finally fighting back. They recently recalled the PIT Captain Rep.

Still this isn't all the pilots fault. Management has a big say in how this is all worked out. It is management that is trying to downsize the mainline and outsource the flying. They rather enjoy playing one pilot group off against another. Those are classic Wolf tactics to keep the pilot groups unbalanced and unable to effectively work together to find a common solution.

Typhoonpilot

 

[AJWick]

Well said typhoon. You beat me to the punch.

Meanstreak needs to realize that most of us guys, be it US, UAL, AA, or DAL worked at the regionals and we felt the pain on that side of the fence. It's not the pilot group as a whole, but the few leaders and mgmt that control our destiny.

And its not just the furloughed guys destiny, but also the wholly owned as well. We are breaking up at the seems!!! We need to bring the wholly owned carriers closer together ie. one list and work from there.

This is the same sh!t that happened when I was at eagle. Four seperate eagles operating under one parent. "divide and conquer" is what they are all about.

Well, with these Canadairs going to MESA will make a real big impact on the wholly owned too. Who is to say that Siegal cant shut all the w/o's down and send the flying to chq and mesa.

Meanstreak said:

"I'm glad they are going to MESA" be careful of what you wish for dude. You may end up on the streets one day and then you are your jagoff buddies can keep each other company.

aj

ps. nice tits boo!

 

[meanstreak]

Sorry, I did not mean to attack the whole pilot group. My vent was at the Mainline MEC, and Mainline Alpa. These guys just never seem to amaze me. I would rather see the CRJ 705's come to one of the wholly owned's at a 100% staffed furloughee's than to see them going to Mesa. If you guys didn't know this, Mesa is a crap company to work for. I don't care if they have a 1000 jets, it's still Mesa. Ask most of the guys who work there. Their management treats the like scum. Why anyone would want to work there boggles me. Just another slap in the face to the furloughee's and the wholly owned's. It looks like Mesa is here to stay. It seems airlines just keep signing new contracts with Mesa because they are the cheapest bottom feeders around. And don't bitch to me Mesa pilot's, your the whores that voted that piece of crap contract in. Now all the commuters have to try and compete with that. Thanks again for setting the industry back another 10 years. Thanks again for less jobs at the major's in the future.

 

[typhoonpilot]

Hi Meanstreak:

Apology accepted. You can read my post's in the " Why I hate Mesa thread " in the regional forum. I know all too well about them and agree with you that the USAirways RJ flying should go to the wholly owneds before the contract carriers.

Typhoonpilot

 

[colorado418]

Quote ----

"The company ordered regional jets that were not in compliance with the agreements we had just reached," Air Line Pilots Association (News - Websites) spokesman Roy Freundlich said. "This was just one of many issues. ... Right now, we're having more problems with the company than we've ever had before. This is a victory for pilots."------End Quote----

Which pilot group is this a victory for? Mesa?
Allegheny? Piedmont? PSA? USAirways? I was at Allegheny for 12 years. I would not call this a victory for anyone but Mesa...

 

[blzr]

To any of you Mainline US Air guys and gals out there... Why do you so oppose the W/O's? Anyone...anyone??

 

[boeingdriver213]

I think the majority of mainline guys have nothing against the w/o's. Remember that the junior guy on the property has been there almost 15 years and is sitting bottom reserve in the right seat in LGA or PHL, and many of them were captains. What they remember of regional flying is nothing like it is now. The last thing they want to see happen is more erosion in their careers. Ever since Wolf came on the property, and now with Siegle, the company has been ramming concession after concession down our throats. The majority of us knew we had the highest costs in the industry, an inefficient route structure, no cost effective way to compete with anybody, and a long history of poor management that did not know how to market itself or compete with anyone. The pilots thought they had to lead the way out of the valley of darkness. Turns out our management used our career expectations to suck us dry in the name of saving the airline. We lost big, they got big money, and U is smaller than ever. Mainline guys are afraid they will end up flying CRJs and Embreaers for a fraction of what they have been making for years. Not easy to swallow when you and your family have been used to a more reasonable paycheck than most of us are now earning. Should we all give in and accept the companies rhetoric? I'm furloughed, haven't touched a wheel since April, though I have been actively searching since last October. I think enough is enough. Time for management to start running an airline and stop pitting the W/Os against mainline pilot and vice versa. The WOs and mainline are busting our collective asses to make this airline work, and it's time we got something besides crap for it. Stick together guys, or we all lose.

 

[AJWick]

I am a mainline furloughee and I dont oppose the wholly owned.

I was at a wholly owned regional....American Eagle. And there are plenty of us that have been there and done that. We know what its like to be there.

But I am sure there are a few guys stilll flying mainline, be it AA/DL/US or UA, have no clue on reality and whats going on below them ie. the furloughed guys and gals and the regional/express carriers. And some of these guys are running our MEC. ITs really a shame.

So remember, when it comes to bashing....please dont attack the entire pilot group....attack mgmt and attack the handleful of guys that are probably clueless who are controlling our destiny.

aj

holy cow boo....those are hypnotic!!!!

 

[blzr]

Hey Boeingdriver213..

I loved how you put that.. "their families are used to a more reasonable paycheck".. Well nuts. My family has had to live with this substandard 8 leg a day work for a while now. Maybe it will be good to get some of the furloughees to work here for a couple of years and then go back to mainline and TRY to rectify the problem.

Seems to me that every mainliner ( usair) that I talk to thinks that if we at the W/O's get jets, they will be out on the street. Not just a few, but a majority, even a few friends of mine out on the street now still feel like it is good buisness to have limited, I mean, Very Limited R/j's. If Airways had 200 CRJ/ERJ's out there bringing in the feed from cities farther away than CAE, FLO, GSP, ets, Then the 757 would be able to focus on longer haul routs, 737's too. And you would have the feed that you are sooooo willing to give to ACA, ASA, CMR, Eagle, and many others.

Scope will kill Airways because right now we are not growing and developing new markets. When this economy turns, we will be competing with other carriers that are well established.. and like always, will lose.