FAR question

[kc81900]

everyone thanks for your replies to the last guy stating the problem is I haven't had my head in the FAR's. Sorry the best you could contribute is that. I am an Airline Pilot who flies only part 121 flights outside of my job I have a normal life. Sorry I attracted one idiot to post. To all the rest I appreciate your input.

 

[nosehair]

I was thinking if I rent the plane and pay for it myself and volunteer my time. He would auction the hour long flight off and keep all proceeds and I would just use the expense as a write off.

Hey, kc, you did good, man, only one idiot response. Most usually get more. Must be busy.

Anyway, you just need to get out of the "paying for the airplane" part. You can volunteer your time, or the airplane, but not both. That's when the FAA sees it as a need to be certificated. If the pax could think he/she is buying a ticket on public transportation. Even sightseeing. But if the auction is a ticket for time on the airplane, and the airplane only, and you volunteer your time, you should be safe.

 

[midlifeflyer]

If the pax could think he/she is buying a ticket on public transportation.

That's an extremely important point. These discussions often (and sometimes necessarily) get into minutiae of the regs, the cases, and the interpretations. But if you step back from those "trees" that one statement is what the whole forest is about, since these issues were first dealt with, probably before the time of the stagecoach: protection of the public from their own lack of knowledge about the business of transportation and their reliance on the assumption that someone who is offering flights for a fee has met with a higher qualification requirement than someone who is doing it just for personal reasons.

 

[viper548]

kc81900, It is very generous of you to donate your time and money to the auction. I don't think it would be a good idea to auction it as a 'flight.' I think if it were auctioned as an 'introductory flight lesson' it would sound better. Either way, call your local FSDO and ask them for help.

 

[igneousy2]

You could auction it as a flight...you would need to contact the FSDO to get permission.

If you are a flight instructor the introductory flight may be your easiest bet, howeve, when you do the auction you must make sure it is advertised and is very clear that it is a Flight Lesson.

The sight seeing exemption have been effectively eliminated as a possibility by the last big Reg rewrite a few years ago.

It may simply be easier to get a flight school to send an instructor with a plane over. You could offer the flight school to pay for the airplane if they provided the instructor. The flight school would benefit from the auction as an advertisement at the high school for students to consider a flying career. The person that wins the auction has a good possibility of wanting to continue flight instruction later. It's a win/win...you do something great for the school by donating. You will limit your liability (make sure it's a reputable school...not uncle Joe's poedunk flight school).

Later

 

[LNKav8R]

Ok, caution on the CFI intro flight...100 hour required, Birthcert reqd I think now (TSA), Not to mention the nightmare of liability. I know you're a very experienced pilot, just make sure you don't get something caught hanging out when you don't want it to...

 

[soarby007]

Here I go. Probably sticking my foot in my mouth again, and I'm sure to be corrected.

I always was told that the airplane can be rented separate from the pilot, and not be a part 135 violation. In other words a person conceivably could rent a Baron, then hire Joe to fly it and there is no 135 violation. Joe cannot be part of the deal in renting the airplane and it must be an arms length transaction. If a person is given free use of an airplane and the customer is only paying for the airplane, or the pilot in different deals, there is no 135 violation. Joe cannot rent an airplane and then charge for the whole deal himself.

I don't see the problem as a part 135 or 119 violation.

 

[ToiletDuck]

When in doubt just call the FSDO. They have no problem answering questions and it would give you a nice piece of mind too.

 

[midlifeflyer]

Problem is that asking an inspector at the FSDO about an FAR question is about the same as asking the cop on the street for an interpretation of the criminal statutes.

Calling the FSDO (1) usually just gets you the opinion of the "inspector of the day" (2) is at least as likely to get you a wrong answer as asking here.

The only time you can get piece of mind from an informal call to the FSDO is when they say "no, you can't" and you don't do it.

 

[ToiletDuck]

if you call the FSDO and get an answer doesn't that covery your arse?