Failed Check Rides

[monkeypaws]

Where do the regionals check to find out about failed check rides? FAA? Which rides do you have to report? Only pink slip rides?

Thanks, MP

 

[SizzleChest]

PRIA will see FAA recorded "deals" as well as your training records from prior 121/135 jobs. I doubt that there are any failures you can "hide". You can always mark the box on the PRIA paperwork to receive a copy of what is sent to your future employer. You can also mail the FAA to get a copy of your own stuff outside of a PRIA request which will be the same data sent as PRIA...

 

[Freightcowboy]

The company will only find out about checkrides you failed from on a 121/135 carrier from training records.

I have received a copy of the PRIA from the FAA and it only states Type of Cerificates, Types, Medicals, Violations. Thats it. Nothing about Failed Commerical, Private, Instrument, ATP or anything.

But if a person is bad enough I guess it will show up in training.

 

[ceo_of_the_sofa]

Airlines request your basic FAA records too (as well as PRIA) It contains all the paperwork like recent written exam scores, all the 8710's and notices of disapproval (pink slips) if there were any.

 

[Smash312]

What about any aditional training required at a 121 carrier. I mean, if training only requires 9 sim sessions, but one needed lets say 11 sessions, will that show?

 

[mslide]

I'm pretty sure they can see if you needed extra training as well. One of our captains was turned down at an LCC for lying about that. He put on the application that he never had any problems in training. They then accused him of lying because he once needed extra sim sessions. Good rule of thumb is to always be honest and disclose everything.

 

[honeycomb]

I'm pretty sure they can see if you needed extra training as well. One of our captains was turned down at an LCC for lying about that. He put on the application that he never had any problems in training.

I think that is a Company thing. Not a FAA thing. To say that it was the Previous company submitting the papers on the Guy and not the FAA.

There are two files on each of us I am told. One is the Basic Info (ie PRIA) and the other is the Big One (ie Blue File).

The PRIA is very basic as previously stated.

The Blue File is very intrusive indeed. If they pay to obtain it (and I am not sure if it can be done without your okay) then they can see every single paper that has been submitted to the FAA...and I do mean every single piece of paper.

At least that is the way it was described to me years ago.

 

[ReportCanoa]

I'm pretty sure they can see if you needed extra training as well. One of our captains was turned down at an LCC for lying about that. He put on the application that he never had any problems in training. They then accused him of lying because he once needed extra sim sessions. Good rule of thumb is to always be honest and disclose everything.

What airline was this that wants to know if you did nine instead of eight sims.

 

[BoilerUP]

What airline was this that wants to know if you did nine instead of eight sims.

I want to know this too.

I don't see how asking for another session or two in order to be 100% comfortable for a type ride or PC equals "training problems".

 

[Freightcowboy]

In order for the FAA to give out any sources of information about a certain pilot , the pilot must sign a release to say its okay. You can't even get a copy of your own record unless you sign the aproprate paperwork.

If you read the PRIA, it says that the company will receive Types of Certificates, Type Ratings, Medicals, and Violations which the pilot must sign a consent to release.

The Freedom of Information Act doesn't allow companies to go search any pilot's record nor is the FAA obligated to grant any request under the Act, unless the FAA itself or NTSB is investigating an accident or incident.

As far as 121/135 companies go, they will send out records of passed/failed pc checks, initals, upgrades, and etc.

 

[ceo_of_the_sofa]

Regionals make you sign a waiver authorizing the release of records. Some do it in the employment application, some after the interview/offer.

 

[aerosky]

What about stagechecks?

Some of the regionals seems to be asking not only about FAA Checkrides but also stage checks that are taken at 141 schools. Is there anyway for an employer to find out about those or are they pretty much sealed?

 

[BoilerUP]

I don't believe 141 records are ever sent to the FAA; they are kept in-house.

 

[ceo_of_the_sofa]

Yea, 141 records are safe. They're just for the school's record keeping. Although, if you fail a checkride after graduating from a 141 school, it will show up on your record.

 

[Freightcowboy]

I'm just curious what regionals require you to sign a waiver??

 

[ceo_of_the_sofa]

PDT, PCL, TSA
Just from the applications I've filled out or had seen.

 

[Freightcowboy]

I know for a fact that XJT, whom I work for doesn't not. I was hired at ASA nope nothing there. Skywest was offered to interview, nope nothing there from the paper work to fill out. Pinnacle, nope. Mesaba, nope. That's what I know just curious who does?

 

[Freightcowboy]

I also do know that TSA doesn't according to the online app via airlineapps.com

I have too interviewed there and can't recall them asking to sign any kind of waiver.

 

[veneratio]

There are 3 different PRIA forms,

1. One is to the FAA which will show what certificates you hold, what medical cert you hold, and if you had any violations on your certificate. Will not show 709 rides,warning letters, failed 61, 141, 121, check rides. incident or accident data.

2. Second will be sent to 121/135 carriers you trained/worked with which will show training records (including comments made by instructors), personell forms, suspenstion and or termination that was not overturned, and drug test records.

3. 3 rd is a National Driving Registry showing any DUI's and things of that nature.

Now, the airlines can, and sometimes do use the Freedom of Information Act to obtain every single piece of paper, slip, comment, etc, that the FAA has in their file on you. That will show 709 rides, pink slips from 61 (not 141). Basically it will show everything from Student Pilot Cert to now....

 

[ceo_of_the_sofa]

I also do know that TSA doesn't according to the online app via airlineapps.com

I have too interviewed there and can't recall them asking to sign any kind of waiver.

In all of the pre employment papers I had to sign, there had always been a space, requesting a notarized statement authorizing release of all FAA records pertaining to me (individual filling out the app) Right alongside, there was a little box, asking if I wanted the same information that my company was going to get to be sent to me as well. Since I did not work for a 121 carrier, all I got back were my old 8710s and written scores i.e. all the paperwork the FAA had on me.
Regarding training records from another airline, it was a separate question requiring a signature. That's where training records (sim sessions, etc.) come in.

You seem kind of worried. Something to hide?

 

[veneratio]

If your wrried about something and you know that it will def keep u from getting employed no matter what just lie and hope HR misses it in the backround.... All u got to lose is getting kicked out of class ::

 

[Freightcowboy]

Do I have anything to hide NO, I just love how some shi$ thinks he knows it all and must insult when their fragile ego is in jeopardy. I was questioning your claims cause I never had that happen.

I was wrong when I said under the Freedom of Information Act that a company couldn't get your informtion if they needed it.

What I'm trying to do is, off of reasearch, present additional information for Monkeyboy. Go to the FAA website for the PRIA.

To lie about a failed checkride is hit or miss. Some companies may get your information off of the FOIA.

 

[trainer8]

There are 3 different PRIA forms,

1. One is to the FAA which will show what certificates you hold, what medical cert you hold, and if you had any violations on your certificate. Will not show 709 rides,warning letters, failed 61, 141, 121, check rides. incident or accident data.

2. Second will be sent to 121/135 carriers you trained/worked with which will show training records (including comments made by instructors), personell forms, suspenstion and or termination that was not overturned, and drug test records.

3. 3 rd is a National Driving Registry showing any DUI's and things of that nature.

Now, the airlines can, and sometimes do use the Freedom of Information Act to obtain every single piece of paper, slip, comment, etc, that the FAA has in their file on you. That will show 709 rides, pink slips from 61 (not 141). Basically it will show everything from Student Pilot Cert to now....

Veneratio is spot on, except comments by instructors. SAT or UNSAT is the standard for PRIA. As to individual comments by instructors, they are "coded" by the Carrier for db entry, i.e, "ADNTL TNG, EM PROCDRS" Personal comments on training forms are expunged after the training event for legal purposes, i.e., liability and are not part of the record. If a trainee needs more time, the coded comment suffices.

Extra sim sessions are shown in PRIA. What is to be the "normal" amount of Sim sessions is determined by the Carrier's Training Manual/Curriculum which is approved by their POI. Typically, 32 hours of training ( 8 sim sessions) plus Type/Initial Ride plus a LOFT is the usual training time at most 121 carriers. Recurrent training can be AQP or the good 'ole PC or PC/LOFT.

FYI...Your Pilot Certificate Type (comm, Private, ATP)/FAA Medical class and home address are also available to the general public to view on the FAA's web site under the Aviation Investment and Reform Act for the 21st Century. You can ask them to remove your info (I did, and they did). Anytime there is an accident/incident and the press learns the name of the pilots involved, they head to the FAA's web site to research info on that pilot(s).

T8

 

[ceo_of_the_sofa]

Do I have anything to hide NO, I just love how some shi$ thinks he knows it all and must insult when their fragile ego is in jeopardy. I was questioning your claims cause I never had that happen.

I was wrong when I said under the Freedom of Information Act that a company couldn't get your informtion if they needed it.

What I'm trying to do is, off of reasearch, present additional information for Monkeyboy. Go to the FAA website for the PRIA.

To lie about a failed checkride is hit or miss. Some companies may get your information off of the FOIA.

Hey, no skin off my back. Just telling folks what I had to go through and what they can expect. Better be upfront about it than risk getting pulled out of class.

 

[iflyjets4food]

If you bring your logbooks to the interview and someone decides to dig through to look at your (private, instrument, commercial, etc) checkrides, they'll see right there whether or not you passed on your first attempt. Of course if you don't bring those logbooks, they won't be able to see that, but then again, you won't look prepared.